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• TheTechnician27@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Okay, but the ruling is totally sensible inasmuch as it applies to “purposes of tariffs, imports and customs”. Tomatoes by and large aren’t being imported for their botanical value; they’re being used for food. This ruling exists so corporations can’t “um ackshually” their way out of paying their fair share.

  But that’s too sensinle; in reality, this unanimous ruling that I never bothered to spend five seconds researching independently (I am very intellectually superior) was just “le Americans uneducated ecksdee”.

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  • oo1@lemmings.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    ‘Fruit de la mere’ is obviously just some attempted tax dodge.

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    • BenVimes@lemmy.ca ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Assuming you were aiming for the French phrase for ‘seafood’, I think you meant ‘fruit de mer.’

      ‘Fruit de la mere’ would translate to, ‘fruit of the mother.’

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    • Kaput@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Or maybe dodging the no meat Friday of the Catholic Church. ?

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• Droggelbecher@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Fruit the botanical term and fruit the culinary term are just not the same word. Similarly to how theory means something different in science and in colloquial speech. That’s just how language works.

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  • chonglibloodsport@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    More people ought to learn about the programming language concept of namespaces. Generalize from that and you realize that every domain of discourse has its own namespace of words that have different meanings from those same words outside the domain.

    My favourite is math which has loads of wonderfully generic-sounding terms such as rational, irrational, radical, real, imaginary, complex, group, ring, field, category, set, operator, element, and unit which all have radically different meanings from the everyday senses of those words.

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    • jaupsinluggies@feddit.uk ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Yes, but then where would we be without all those endless squabbles about X which are easily solved by pointing out that A::X != B::X?

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    • Clent@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I like this.

      Kids are already taught to look for “context clues”

      Namespacing would require the author explicitly define the namespace.

      I would also add versioning as a year/month and localization.

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    • SpongyAneurysm@feddit.org ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I always thought it was more like overloading, but namespaces are also a good analogy.

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• Bronzebeard@lemmy.zip ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Botanically, there’s no such thing as a vegetable.

  That’s a culinary term, which seems to cover some fruits, some plant roots, some plant stems, some plant leaves, and some plant flowers.While culinary fruits are the other botanical fruits, and a few flowers (figs are weird)

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  • Enekk@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    The legal decision is important for a slew of reasons including taxation, SNAP benefits, etc. The decision was less about science and more about the reality of how tomatoes are used in our society.

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    • Bronzebeard@lemmy.zip ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      … Cool? I was more pointing out the issues with the assumptions the meme was making

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  • bathing_in_bismuth@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Now I get why some (a ?) states declared pizza a veggie or something like that? Like if vegetable is a culinary term it makes sense you could classify pizza as a vegetable. But like, why the fuck is law declaring what anything is culinary?

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    • ThatGuy46475@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      To get around legal requirements to include vegetables in school lunches

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    • frezik@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Speculating here, but taxes are one reason.

      Almost all the rules about what counts as wine, beer, whiskey, etc. comes from some country making definitions for tax purposes.

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    • FooBarrington@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Because those culinary definitions are used for other laws, e.g. laws about what food schools can give to children.

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  • bennypr0fane@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Consider that in German (and probably a ton of other languages too), there are just two different words for the botanical and the culinary definition of fruit, so you can have namespacing built in to the language

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• Ilovethebomb@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Botanically, sure, but from a culinary perspective they’re used like a vegetable.

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  • just2look@lemmy.zip ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    I don’t think vegetable is a botanical term. So fruit and vegetable aren’t really mutually exclusive.

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    • princessnorah@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Yeah I mean, mushrooms get lumped into the vegetable category most of the time and they’re a fungus!

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    • jaybone@lemmy.zip ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      If my grandmother had wheels, she would be a bicycle. But she would also be my grandmother.

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  • Gyroplast@pawb.social ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    That’s just science as applied by engineers.

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  • Valmond@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    As they say, intelligence is knowing tomato is a fruit, wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad.

    (That’s the saying, but IMO it’s wisdom to know and intelligence to not do it, maybe I’m mixing things up).

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    • TheRealKuni@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      From Dungeon Crawler Carl:

      I grumbled a bit about that three in intelligence. Yeah, I never did too great in math, but I never considered myself a slobbering idiot, either. I could fix most anything electrical after studying it for a bit. My friend Billy Maloney, now that guy was an idiot. Just last week we’d come out of a bar, and he’d peed right on a cop’s bicycle while the cop was giving someone else a ticket for drunk and disorderly. That guy deserved an intelligence of three, maybe two.

      . . .

      After I complained about my intelligence score to Mordecai, using the Billy example, he said, “Intelligence told you that bike belonged to a police officer. Wisdom told you not to urinate upon it.

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    • gofsckyourself@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Yeah, it seems you’ve heard a version adapted to explain the different D&D stats.

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    • Ilovethebomb@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Knowledge and wisdom is the one I’ve heard before.

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• PapaCabbage@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Vegetables do not exist. Well, they exist as a culinary thing. There’s just no scientific/botanical definition of what makes something a vegetable.

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  • kameecoding@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    What about Stephen Hawking?

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    • chatokun@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Stephen Hawking is a pile of ash, not a vegetable.

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    • buttnugget@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      What about him?

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  • exasperation@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    I appreciate the message, but I find this presentation style to be unbearable, like a shitty clickbait version of a TED talk: fast cuts with exaggerated audience reactions, playing hide the ball with the actual information being presented. And then they took what I imagine is a normal studio production designed for normal TV screens and cropped it into vertical video, published on Youtube as a short. Gross.

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    • melmi@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Tbf it’s a comedy show, it being informative is mostly a bonus. This one is rare for being factual and not about why we should nuke the moon or which cartoon characters are invited to the cookout or something like that.

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• kerrigan778@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  This is dumb, botanically tomatoes are a fruit doesn’t preclude them being vegetables because vegetable isn’t a botanical term at all. Tomatoes are fairly sweet but they have more culinarily in common with vegetables. Nutritionally I’m not positive but it’s a separate issue.

  Regardless the supreme court decision was regarding tariffs/imports/customs which makes sense to classify it simply by the way in which people consume it. People eat tomatoes as a vegetable, just like we eat zucchini and cucumber as vegetables despite them all also being fruit.

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  • Asswardbackaddict@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Pretty sure it’s so giving ketchup to school kids constitutes a serving of vegetables.

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    • kerrigan778@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      No that was 90 years later as school budgets were cut further and further until they were using things like pickle relish as a required vegetable. Our public school system is an embarrassment.

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• homura1650@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I’m going to take this as an opportunity to point out that bees are a type of fish in California.

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  • SLVRDRGN@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    You weren’t kidding!

    California enforces many wildlife regulations. CESA, or the California Endangered Species Act, is designed to keep animal and plant life from extinction. The law covers any threatened “bird, mammal, fish, amphibian, reptile, or plant.”

    Insects weren’t mentioned in the specific act’s wording. However, a separate California regulation legally defines fish as “a wild fish, mollusk, crustacean, invertebrate, amphibian, or part, spawn, or ovum of any of those animals.”
    So, are bees actually fish? Yes, because all invertebrates are according to California law. The broad definition of fish allows activists to fight for insect survival.
    The California Department of Fish and Wildlife has clarified that “It was not believed necessary to include the term invertebrate in the original legislation because ‘fish’ is defined in the Fish and Game Code to include ‘invertebrates’…”

    Talk about by-the-book!

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    • Hupf@feddit.org ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      sciencealert.com/actually-there-is-no-such-thing-…

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  • buttnugget@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Good.

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• WILSOOON@programming.dev ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Fun fact, the vatican classifies capybaras as fish

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  • Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    For lent-related purposes, I presume? Same as beavers.

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  • starlinguk@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Squirrels too.

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    • thespcicifcocean@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      TIL the vatican approves of squirrel stew on fridays.

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  • kryptonianCodeMonkey@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Either we’re all fish, whales and dolphins are fish, or nothing is fish. All three positions are perfectly justifiable depending on your critieria, so take your pick.

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  • cyrano@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Crazy

    iflscience.com/for-hundreds-of-years-the-vatican-…

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• merc@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Strange times for Berry Club

  From Mr. Lovenstein whose website unfortunately doesn’t seem to work, except to redirect you to Meta-owned socials. Ugh.

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  • y0kai@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Aren’t strawberries nuts?

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    • merc@sh.itjust.works ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Yeah man, they’re completely nuts!

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• woodenghost@hexbear.net ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Yes, fruit is a botanical category, but vegetable is not.

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• Kolanaki@pawb.social ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  All fruits are vegetables, but not a vegetables are fruit.

  Vegetable = any edible plant part.

  Fruit = Ovary of a flowering plant that carries the seeds.

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• foggianism@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I remember watching a YT video once about a legislative move of a US county to declare the number Pi to be exactly 3.

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  • bleistift2@sopuli.xyz ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    *State. It was Indiana. * 3.2.

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFNjA9LOPsg – How Pi was nearly changed to 3.2 - Numberphile

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• vane@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Not unique because EU also classifies tomatoes as vegetables.

  Is the tomato a fruit or a vegetable?
  The classification of fruit and vegetables can be based
  on various approaches — botanical, agronomical,
  culinary — thus resulting in different definitions. For
  example, the tomato is botanically a fruit, but it is
  commonly considered a vegetable from both the
  agronomical and the culinary points of view.
  The facts and figures presented in this briefing follow
  Eurostat’s definitions based on the farm management
  and agronomical practices, according to which the
  term ‘fresh vegetable’ refers to annual (or, rarely,
  biennial) horticultural crops, and the term ‘fruit’ refers
  to perennial crops.
  Following this approach, tomatoes are included in the
  main statistical aggregate of vegetables, as well as
  melons, water melons and strawberries, which are
  commonly considered and consumed as fruit.

  europarl.europa.eu/…/EPRS_BRI(2019)635563_EN.pdf

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• Arfman@aussie.zone ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  And we laughed when some pope declared the capybara is a fish

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  • ilikecoffee@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    When… what? 😂

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    • NotASharkInAManSuit@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Capybara are fish, so are bees, because fish don’t actually exist.

      The levels of validity may vary, but everything I said there is true in one form or another.

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• quediuspayu@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  I wonder if in other romance languages is the same, in Spanish and Catalan the two definitions are distinguished by being masculine or feminine. Fruto/fruit being masculine is the botanical fruit and fruta/fruita is the culinary fruit.

  How is it in other romance languages?

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  • Railcar8095@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Almost, but not quite. Fruto and fruta are not two genders of the same word, but two different words, with different sources words (fruto fructus and fruta fructa)

    Meanings are very similar, so there’s a lot of mixup.

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    • quediuspayu@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      You’re completely right, they are two different words. For me that distinction was so clear that I never considered that what I wrote could be interpreted as two genders of the same word, that would make no sense.

      I didn’t know the origins though, cool.

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• bjoern_tantau@swg-empire.de ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Is there even a botanical definition of vegetables?

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  • stray@pawb.social ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    No. What is or isn’t a vegetable is determined entirely by whether we collectively consider any given plant or plant part a food item.

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• Zerush@lemmy.ml ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  They are vegetables

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  • friendlymessage@feddit.org ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    They are both, it’s not contradictory

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    • kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      This is because “vegetable” is purely a culinary term. There’s no botanical definition of a vegetable. Tomatoes are berries, which is a type of fruit, from a botanical standpoint. So are cucumbers. They’re both vegetables from a culinary standpoint. Lettuce is a leaf. Broccoli is a flower. Carrots are roots. Celery is a stalk. All vegetables culinarily.

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• infuziSporg@hexbear.net ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Intelligence is knowing that a tomato is a fruit.

  Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad.

  Distinction is inventing a fruit salad that a variety of tomato can fit into.

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  • lemmur@szmer.info ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    True wisdom

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• einlander@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  So tomatoes are trans?

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• sirico@feddit.uk ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Pizza is a salad according to your legal system

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  • PrimeMinisterKeyes@leminal.space ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    That’s a wrap.

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• Kirsche_z@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  [deleted]

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  • Remavas@programming.dev ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    The Supreme Court was fully aware of the technical term:

    Botanically speaking, tomatoes are the fruit of a vine, just as are cucumbers, squashes, beans, and peas. But in the common language of the people, whether sellers or consumers of provisions, all these are vegetables which are grown in kitchen gardens, and which, whether eaten cooked or raw, are, like potatoes, carrots, parsnips, turnips, beets, cauliflower, cabbage, celery, and lettuce, usually served at dinner in, with, or after the soup, fish, or meats which constitute the principal part of the repast, and not, like fruits generally, as dessert.

    The attempt to class tomatoes as fruit is not unlike a recent attempt to class beans as seeds, of which Mr. Justice Bradley, speaking for this Court, said:

    “We do not see why they should be classified as seeds any more than walnuts should be so classified. Both are seeds, in the language of botany or natural history, but not in commerce nor in common parlance. On the other hand, in speaking generally of provisions, beans may well be included under the term ‘vegetables.’ As an article of food on our tables, whether baked or boiled, or forming the basis of soup, they are used as a vegetable, as well when ripe as when green. This is the principal use to which they are put. Beyond the common knowledge which we have on this subject, very little evidence is necessary or can be produced.”

    Nix v. Hedden, 149 U.S. 304 (1893)

    So this is how the Supreme Court could do this: they were fully aware but reasonably decided tariff laws should be based on ordinary meaning.

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• TimewornTraveler@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  wow whoever made this post is SO smart

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• psycho_driver@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Vibe judging.

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• quediuspayu@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  What about a bell pepper and an aubergine?

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  • Bronzebeard@lemmy.zip ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    aubergine

    Doesn’t exist in the US

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    • quediuspayu@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      Oh right, they call it eggplant. Right?

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• Stern@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  en.wikipedia.org/…/Toy_Biz,_Inc._v._United_States

  Also the X-men aren’t human. Kinda makes the court system feel like the baddies tho

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• ZkhqrD5o@lemmy.world ⁨5⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  “There is nothing more American than shooting a man in this Walmart of a world.”

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• HugeNerd@lemmy.ca ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  youtu.be/kpLd-Vi8qZA?t=18

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• veni_vedi_veni@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Ketchup lobby in full swing

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• Bloomcole@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  Americans don’t eat vegetables

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