As a classically trained driver I’ve found automatics make people drive worse because they have to think less. And they already barely think.
You guys have to end it
Submitted 2 months ago by ObviouslyNotBanana@lemmy.world to [deleted]
https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/e1068f18-b068-4c14-9196-11a0d77bfde9.webp
Comments
Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world 2 months ago
baldingpudenda@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Manual occupies their phone hand. How is someone supposed to heart content so the algorithm gives them more of it!
Using the PRiNDle opens one up for so many activities.
archonet@lemy.lol 2 months ago
using the PRiNDle
hOrni@lemmy.world 2 months ago
What the fuck is a “classically trained driver”?
papalonian@lemmy.world 2 months ago
He was taught by the same institute that taught Beethoven to drift.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Didn’t go to one of those lousy postmodern driving schools I think
ObviouslyNotBanana@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Like Robert Wells or Bill Nye.
thesystemisdown@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Mom took him to a big office building parking lot on a Sunday when it was quiet. At least that’s how this classically trained driver learned.
Ledericas@lemm.ee 2 months ago
like going to a prestigious school for drivers?
ObviouslyNotBanana@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I’ve actually observed the opposite. Automatics leave more brain cells to focus on traffic.
Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world 2 months ago
They use them to focus on their phones, not the road
Diplomjodler3@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Do you sing an aria by Mozart or something when you drive? But anyway, in my experience driving manual makes people more distracted because they have to think about gears and the clutch and stuff. Sure, a competent driver will not have any difficulty with that, but there’s an awful lot of them out there that don’t quite fall into that category.
MichaelScotch@lemmy.world 2 months ago
You must not know how to drive a manual. When you know how to drive one, you don’t think about it. You just do it. You feel connected to the car and connected to the act of driving. Automatics absolutely allow people to go on autopilot and they focus on anything but driving: stuffing their face with food, browsing lemmy, texting, talking on their phone on speaker while holding it up to their mouth for some fucking reason even though it would be easier and better sound quality to just hold it up to their ear like phones were designed to be used, or you know, just use the fucking hands free phone calling that’s built into every fucking car that was made in the last decade and a half and included in every cheap ass aftermarket stereo system available on the planet
Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world 2 months ago
No I let my exhaust do the singing. It’s like playing a really simple pipe organ.
Kolanaki@pawb.social 2 months ago
Now think about how much worse they would drive if they had to switch their concentration from the road to the transmission.
hOrni@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Only just noticed Your username. For a moment I thought You were serious.
Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world 2 months ago
If I was serious I’d say no human is sane enough to drive.
Blaster_M@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Stupid is as stupid does. A significant portion of trucking accidents involve the truck driver missing a cue because they were mid gear change.
While it is good to have a person learn to drive stick, it is really hard to get people to learn how to drive if they have zero interest in actually learning how to be a driver, no matter what transmission.
I personally like dual clutch transmissions and daily’ed a car to 175k miles with one, yet I went out of my way to find a manual version of my current car.
sp3tr4l@lemmy.zip 2 months ago
I mean, I’ve driven only automatics my whole life, with the odd exception of a friend’s ATV or whatnot, but I know when and how to use an e brake (and/or dual foot the brake pedal and gas pedal) to start a car on an incline, when said car has an automatic transmission…
You’re not gonna uninvent automatic transmissions.
Assuming you’re American (I doubt a non American would name themselves ‘Boomer Humor’), what you could do is mandate people completely retest, written and driving tests, for their liscenses every 5 years, then every 2 years after some age cutoff (60? 65?) then every single year after another age cutoff (70? 75?)… instead of just assuming that because they passed the test once in their life, all their skills and knowledge are perfect and up to date for the rest of their lives.
Most people think they are much better drivers than they actually are, so lets actually reality check them on that.
FelixCress@lemmy.world 2 months ago
US: predominantly automatic transmission, low speed limits
Germany: predominantly manual transmission, higher speed limits and no limits on most of the autobahns (motorways)
US road deaths per capita twice of Germany.
Draw your own conclusions.
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 2 months ago
Probably more related to the god-awful infrastructure design in the US, like stroads and an unfathomable tendency to use stop signs for a lot of things they are just not fit for, like to replace speed bumps, chicanes, and roundabouts.
Also the better comparable statistic should be deaths per distance traveled in cars.
Eheran@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Here is the list 6.9 vs 4.2 deaths per 1 billion km. 12.8 vs. 3.35 per 100’000 inhabitants.
But you need both for a fuller puncture, not everyone involved/dieing is in a vehicle.
BakerBagel@midwest.social 2 months ago
Not to mention the DUI rates in the US are astronomical. Over 1/3 of motor fatalities are alcohol related in the US.
HelixDab2@lemm.ee 2 months ago
Chicanes are the best part about riding a sport bike! I get to drag knees on public roads!
bestboyfriendintheworld@sh.itjust.works 2 months ago
Germany has much stricter requirements to get a driver’s license. That leads to better driving skills on average.
Glitch@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 months ago
I would, but I ran out of crayons
crank0271@lemmy.world 2 months ago
What if we’re too American to draw an appropriate conclusion from that?
Sludgeyy@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Quick Google
In 2024 36% of Germans reported using the car daily.
In 2023 95.3% of Americans older than 16 drive on occasions.
83 million Germans, 63% above 16
340 million Americans, 65% above 16
52 million potential drivers in Germany, 17 million actually drive
221 million potential drivers in America, 210 million drive daily
17 million vs 210 million daily drivers
~12x more drivers, only 2x more death
Per capita isn’t really a way to look at it
Besides automatic cars or lack of a manual transmission is not causing accidents.
Chance of death goes up significantly with speed
No one has ever crashed because they couldn’t go over the speed limit
MisterFrog@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Downvoters mad to find out cars are inherently unsafe and need very good infrastructure and to be remotely safe.
Downvoters mad that E~k~= ½mv^2^, and speed, funnily enough, is dangerous.
Downvoters mad that manual transmission isn’t making cars safer.
Car go vroom vroom, but public transport go better
Fax
BorgDrone@lemmy.one 2 months ago
83 million Germans, 63% above 16
Not sure why you think this is relevant. Children aren’t allowed to drive in Germany.
AA5B@lemmy.world 2 months ago
It’s been difficult to find manual transmisssions for a couple of decades here in the US. That ship has sailed.
While most of my life I vowed my kids would learn manual, I gave up on that idea because
- manual transmission cars are rare and disappearing
- automatics now are more fuel efficient
- CVT are reliable and even more efficient
- EVs don’t shift They started driving in a world of automatics and will soon be in a world with no shofting
lemming741@lemmy.world 2 months ago
cvts are reliable Now THAT’S a statement made by the utterly deranged
kameecoding@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I think he is confusing CVT with the toyota eCVT which is quite different and is actually reliable
thebigslime@lemmy.world 2 months ago
If they aren’t made by Nissan, they are.
meathorse@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Belt CVTs - I’m right there with you, but take a look into the more modern geared CVTs such as Toyota e-CVT in their hybrids - I think Honda have a similar tech. It’s a planetary gear system that provides infinite gears without the rubber band feel that plagued belt CVTs and hella-reliable.
youtu.be/vHc-_E8xWnM?si=tzCJWXHmC9T5GCpx
I’m a petrolhead at heart and would love more options for manuals but in lieu of that, a geared CVT is by far the next best transmission and 100x better than a traditional auto.
Even better, jump in one and take it for a drive - because there are gears, it feels more connected to the motor - almost manual-like response and no sluggish delay like a traditional auto.
You literally pick your revs by pushing the throttle more or less, they’re magic for hills or when the car is packed since you’re never waiting for revs to climb up into the power nor holding a speed because any faster and you have to change again which takes you out of the power again. If you want more power, you simply modulate that with the throttle and the revs rise instantly to accommodate.
CptEnder@lemmy.world 2 months ago
CVTs are good for tractors that need a wide range of torque ratios but still stay automated.
AtHeartEngineer@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I’ve had a Subaru CVT for 10+ years with over 200k miles no issues
JustAnotherKay@lemmy.world 2 months ago
EVs don’t shift
I know there’s no reason for them to, but a small part of me wishes there was. Something so satisfying about being good at managing gears
Gladaed@feddit.org 2 months ago
There are simulated transmissions for the weirdos.
AA5B@lemmy.world 2 months ago
So true. I’ve never been more tempted to keep a classic car, even if it’s just an old shit box with manual transmission.
vaionko@sopuli.xyz 2 months ago
I seem to recall some EV having a 2 speed transmission. A modern one, not like the Electrek that had a 5 speed manual
exasperation@lemm.ee 2 months ago
When I learned how to drive, manual transmissions were higher performance and better fuel efficiency: side by side comparisons of the exact same model of car would show better 0-60 and quarter mile times, while having slightly better EPA fuel efficiency ratings, for the manual transmission.
At some point, though, the sheer number of gears in an automatic transmission surpassed those in the typical manual gearbox, and the average automatic today has 6 gears, up to 9 in some Mercedes and 10 in certain Ford and GM models. So they could start selecting gear ratios for better fuel efficiency, without “wasting” a valuable gear slot. There was a generation of Corvettes that was notorious for having a 6th gear that was worthless for actual performance but helped the car sneak by with a better highway fuel mileage rating.
And the automatics became much faster at shifting gears, with even the ultra high performance supercars shifting to paddle shifters where the driver could still control the gear, but with the shifting mechanism automated. Ferrari’s paddle shifter models started outperforming the traditional stick shift models in the early 2000’s, if I remember correctly. As those gear shifting technologies migrated over to regular automatics, the performance gap shrunk and then ended up going the other way.
At this point there’s not enough reason for a true manual stickshift transmission. It’s no longer faster or more economic, so it’s just a pure fun. Which is fine, but does make it hard to actually design one for any given model of car.
AA5B@lemmy.world 2 months ago
In the US it’s not really even cheaper - as in maybe you could save a couple hundred on a few models but most won’t offer a choice and it’s nothing in proportion to the cost of the car and the chances of finding one are so small it’s not even worth trying for most cars. There may be a few - are jeeps still available?
My favorite car was a Miata with a stick (even though I’m too tall to fit) - maybe I need to track down an older one before they’re gone forever
474D@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Isn’t the civic si series all manual?
Two2Tango@lemmy.ca 2 months ago
The Si and the R! They both sell like hotcakes, waited 8 months for my 2024 Si. I’m not sure why Honda doesn’t increase the volume, there’s still a lot of demand - maybe the margins aren’t as good as their SUVs :(
AA5B@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I bought a civic in 2006 and it took 6 weeks to get one. A manual would have taken much longer
nexas_XIII@lemm.ee 2 months ago
Had a manual 2016 Mazda 3. Took a bit to find it with all the options I wanted but it was available at the time.
Mr_Mofu@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 months ago
• Wanted to Start on a Steep Hill? We had a Tool for that: it was Called “Flooring the Gas while letting go off the Clutch”
I miss the Smell of Burned Clutch…
sartalon@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I was going to say, I always had my e-brake on when I parked my car and so I always started the car with it on.
Does he mean slowly let off the clutch while releasing the e-brake? Does he put on his e-brake if he stops on a hill, in traffic too!
Suck_on_my_Presence@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I’ve had to use the ebrake method before for a hill that was wayyyy too steep and a fence gate closed behind me.
You basically just let off the clutch and press on the gas until the car wants to move forward, then you let off the e brake and go without going backwards.
jimmux@programming.dev 2 months ago
If you’re on a steep hill, yes sometimes you need to use the handbrake to get moving. This had to be demonstrated when I got my licence, but to be fair some manual vehicles now have automatic hill start. Still a good technique to learn because it doesn’t always activate.
shalafi@lemmy.world 2 months ago
We’d park my buddies Mustang on a hill wherever we went in case it wouldn’t start. LOL, everyone made fun of him saying it was a Pinto.
thebigslime@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Ah the Mustang II. What a historically bad letdown.
JordanZ@lemmy.world 2 months ago
[deleted]nevemsenki@lemmy.world 2 months ago
What the hell is this design.
shalafi@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Bringing back the classics! Great-grandad had one, he’d be right at home.
kameecoding@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Bruh, that’s almost worse than Tesla
hOrni@lemmy.world 2 months ago
You guys do realize this is supposed to be a parody of boomer bullshit arguments right?
ObviouslyNotBanana@lemmy.world 2 months ago
They don’t, and that’s the way I like 'em!
rc__buggy@sh.itjust.works 2 months ago
Daddy needs his coffee.
Seriously, the automatic is so much better for using a truck as a tool. I still drive a stick right now and I’m lucky I miss rush hour most days because we start and end early, one job site.
I’d never choose a manual for dealing with taking tools and materials around the Metro while the assholes I’m trying to service cut me off in stop and go traffic.
And IMO we need to start racing EVs, leave combustion for the 20th century old timer events
chiliedogg@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I love my automatic transmission and cruise control, but I do think that I may have been a better driver when I drove stick. By necessity, I had to pay closer attention to the road than I have to today.
DJDarren@sopuli.xyz 2 months ago
My Volkswagen flashes a message when I put the key in the ignition; “Depress clutch to start”
So I tell it that the majority of Yanks don’t know how to use it and it starts every time.
empireOfLove2@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 months ago
Oh good I got here before the lemmy fuck cars brigade showed up
ObviouslyNotBanana@lemmy.world 2 months ago
LET’S FUCKING TAKE THE BUS
grue@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Hi, !fuckcars mod here. I absolutely love my manual transmissions and unironically fully endorse this meme.
Cars ought to be like horses: they should be available for enthusiasts to play with, but it should be wholly unnecessary and kinda ridiculous to use them as routine transportation, especially in cities. Frankly, I would prefer it if all transmissions were manual, as it would help encourage people who see driving as a chore to use other transportation modes instead.
4shtonButcher@discuss.tchncs.de 2 months ago
Big oil forced that shit onto you instead of going the far superior EV route from the beginning. Now EVs are finally taking over and I’m happy my kids never have to get fuel grease on their hands and suffer those nasty fumes at gas stations. Shifters were needed for an inferior technology to work. I liked it as an experience when I learned to drive. But cars are mostly transport due to failure of better public transport infrastructure. I don’t care whether they’re fun. I drive for fun on the Xbox or maybe in a GoKart every few years.
Oh that felt good to rant.
SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world 2 months ago
EVs weren’t viable for long distance travel before though. Like batteries didn’t have the energy density they have today. The advancements in battery tech relied heavily on the advancements in computing tech. Like for battery research, manufacturing and battery management. And research in computer technology has never stopped.
Even if they never stopped making electric cars, they would have stayed short distance vehicles for a long time since battery tech didn’t advance fast enough. We might have gotten long distance EVs a decade years sooner but definitely not decades.
Polderviking@feddit.nl 2 months ago
You’ll never catch me doing something that can be automated away, this includes shifting gears in a car.
CptEnder@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Manuals are infinitely more fun to drive and I like to manipulate the performance characteristics of the car myself but they’re probably going extinct to EV which is fine.
Aconite@lemmy.ca 2 months ago
Manual is hell for people with back or knee issues.
Snowclone@lemmy.world 2 months ago
You’re like a solid 20 years behind here bud, they don’t even offer manual transmissions on high end luxury cars. People don’t buy them. I get it, I miss having manual cars, and it’s not as hard as people always complained, I could teach a dog to drive manual over the phone, it’s really not hard.
SidewaysHighways@lemmy.world 2 months ago
i miss my stick
Bishma@discuss.tchncs.de 2 months ago
The perfect transmission UI was the Teletouch on the Ford Edsel. And if anyone tries to argue I’ll say “nuh uh,” run away, and cry.
mlg@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Lol that handbrake start is utterly useless if you live anywhere that’s actually hilly all over.
You’ve got to learn the proper clutchwork from the very start or you’ll be taking years on every hill.
Unless you’re starting from a cold start on a hill without ABS, I guess it could a safety precaution.
riquisimo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 months ago
Electric cars have no transmission. If you buy electric, there are no stick shifts because electric cars only have one gear (with very few exceptions, and even then you’d just have 2 gears.)
Idk how this plays into the joke, but it’s a neat fact.
Canopyflyer@lemmy.world 2 months ago
As someone that literally spent 25 years driving a manual, including various stints in racing. Manuals have seen their day.
It used to be if you wanted better mileage, you drove a manual. If you wanted to be faster on the track, drive a manual (caveat there is drag racing.)
Today? The computer is just better at controlling a transmission. I drive a Camry Hybrid now and not having shifts is REALLY weird and the drone getting up to highway speeds is annoying, but I do like the 45mpg. Not to mention, when I sat down to learn how the Toyota Hybrid Drive works… It’s a pretty clever system.
There are a lot of times that nostalgia gets the better of me and I wish I had a car with a manual. My oldest is possibly joining a skating team that is a 2 hour drive away. It’s tempting to let him use my car and then buy an older manual for myself as a toy. I’d love to get a hold of another mid-80’s Corolla GT-S. I autocrossed one back in the late 80’s early 90’s. It still remains my favorite car I’ve ever owned.
Hadriscus@lemm.ee 2 months ago
Wife owns an automatic, it’s fantastic for when you’re stuck in traffic, but GOD does it make shitty decisions. Of course it cannot anticipate whether or not you’re going to be climbing a slope, so it goes up a gear, but then it has to immediately go back down a gear, but you lost all speed already and it’s raining and you can’t pick up traction again so you slide back down the slope and try again. It’s also only really effective for the most tranquil driving, and it has a huuuuuuge inertia when accelerating, like a good half second of not obeying your pedaling, which is 1.frustrating and 2.dangerous in situations where you have to get out of the way urgently. So, would only recommend for old people or people frequently stuck in traffic. The technology has ways to go still
Etterra@discuss.online 2 months ago
I’m suddenly reminded of some ai-death clock site I saw recently. It predicted my death on May 13st.
searchingforporpoise@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Bought a new car last fall and looked everywhere for a manual, they are indeed getting rare in the US. Ended up with a Jeep Gladiator sport because it’s a convertible 4x4 with a stick shift and so far the driving experience has been nice. You can tell Stellantis cheaps out on some of the plastic trim stuff and we’ll see just how reliable it is after a few years. Would be sweet if Toyota would make a convertible or T-top 4runner with a stick shift in the US.
imvii@lemmy.ca 2 months ago
I’ve always had a manual car. I love them. That is until I ended up dating a younger woman and we moved in together. Several years later the manual turned into the second car only I drove. That got sold and we now have two cars she can drive.
One day I might teach her how to drive manual. We live in a really flat area with no major hills, so it shouldn’t be a problem. One day maybe,
the_eyestalk@lemmy.zip 2 months ago
Eh, I’ve been driving manual for 20 years before I switched to electric a year ago and I don’t see many benefits with manual, apart from a certain comfortable nostalgia. Automatic is better in cities and it’s a lot easier for kids to learn. Handbrake starts on hills? What a weird thing to be nostalgic about.
I suspect it’s just these people think handling the gearstick makes them special. It’s the one thing they can be smug about,completely discounting the fact that any old idiot can learn to drive manual if they just practice a bit. Reminds me of my grandpa who insisted that it’s better to chop down trees with an axe and a handsaw, instead of using these modern chainsaws. He was a stubborn old dude.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 2 months ago
I have never owned a car with an automatic transmission, and I am proud of that fact
wolfeh@lemmy.world 2 months ago
PUT IT IN “H”
ivanafterall@lemmy.world 2 months ago
During Covid, I put together a budget sim rig. Played a looooot of VR Assetto Corsa. Learned to drive a manual, then went and did a manual Porsche race car on a track in Vegas. It worked! It was one of the best things I’ve ever done. I was flushed when I got out of the car. It was overwhelming.
Anyway, I was ready. So I took the natural next step. I bought a manual 1984 Ford F-250 with a ~7L (7.4L?) engine, dual gas tanks that held more fuel than I could ever afford. It was a beast. Long story short, I was not ready. Oh, did I mention I lived in mountainous Utah at the base of said mountains at the time?
j0ester@lemmy.world 2 months ago
When car companies start charging for heated seats… that’s why I stop buying brand new cars and go for older ones
wanderwisley@lemm.ee 2 months ago
I own a 2020 Subaru WRXSTI manual and I’ve enjoyed every minute of it.
SlopppyEngineer@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Image
All hail the Unimog!
ObviouslyNotBanana@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Biblically accurate transmission
bobs_monkey@lemm.ee 2 months ago
“How many hydraulic levers you need?”
“All of them”
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 2 months ago
you aren’t supposed to show people what the control panel to the mcflurry machine looks like