Microsoft, doing it’s part to make the world a better place.
I’m seriously thinking of trying Linux when Windows 11 is forced. My computer has the specs to run it, but I’m just tired of Windows and Microsoft.
Microsoft's draconian Windows 11 restrictions will send an estimated 240 million PCs to the landfill when Windows 10 hits end of life in 2025
Submitted 8 months ago by catch22@programming.dev to technology@lemmy.world
Comments
ClopClopMcFuckwad@lemmy.world 8 months ago
ptz@dubvee.org 8 months ago
Unless you run some really niche software or are a heavy gamer, you’ll likely have no problems and enjoy it.
Just stick with a well supported distro like Fedora, Ubuntu, Debian, or PopOS, and it’ll be super easy.
I’m actually looking forward to the perfectly good Linux boxes that are bound to be popping up at yard sales or on ebay once that happens.
EdibleFriend@lemmy.world 8 months ago
a heavy gamer
Why I am still hesitant to make the leap. Not just do I mostly use my PC for gaming but I have a tendency to jump into a new game for like 3 weeks and then off to the next like the horrid ADHD having fuck that I am. I don’t want to possibly have to work to make a game work each and every time. I know its gotten a lot better about that but still. Convivence has me trapped yo.
Revan343@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
I suggest Mint for new users (and lazy old users like me). All of the simplicity of Ubuntu, without Canonical’s shit
TunaLobster@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Even heavy gamers are getting a much better experience on Linux these days (yay Proton!). There are a couple of anti-cheat systems that are still trouble some, but honestly if the developers don’t want to to put in the much smaller amount of effort to make it work on Linux, I don’t want to give them my money.
RedditWanderer@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Sadly I have niche software and I’m a heavy gamer. But now it’s becoming as much of a headache to deal with Windows threatening dumb upgrades that I might as well switch and fight with compatibility.
The more we do it, the more companies will be incentivised to make Linux work.
foggy@lemmy.world 8 months ago
I’m kind of a power user.
Gaming. Multimedia (Video, Image, Audio). Application development. Web development. Getting into cybersecurity, so using a lot of VMs. Watching videos.
I’ve been making a Linux transition. So far, the stuff I still need to iron out:
-Adobe. Make it work somehow or replace. Can use it on a windows VM 🤷♂️. Happy to replace because fuck em. Working through options.
-VST managers for digital audio workstation. Most aren’t on Linux (spitfire audio, iZotope, IK multimedia, iLok). Haven’t begun trying to make them work. I e heard most can be configured in WINE.
-old MIDI program not working. No audio for MIDI. One program works, another doesn’t 🤔
That’s it. Everything else is working. Big challenges Ive had:
-bluetooth gaming controller took a lot of effort. Works great now.
-Epic games through heroic… Through steam on Linux… Through remote play on my phone… That was difficult. But it works!!
-remote desktop troubleshooting. Works fine now.
Oh and I can’t get windows subsystem for Linux to work in my windows VM on my Linux machine. 🤷♂️
assembly@lemmy.world 8 months ago
My Win10 machine is an audio workstation (DAW) so I am curious how the migration to Linux will work out. Reaper has a Linux port so that should be OK. Hopefully all the VSTs will still work and I’ll have to check on my Focusrite Scarlett. I am not buying a new machine just to run this stuff as it’s just a hobby.
redditReallySucks@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 months ago
Niche hardware meaning an asus laptop
BearOfaTime@lemm.ee 8 months ago
Hahaha, right, right.
Most users would get lost on a Linux box, even with the truly great user-friendly distros today. I use a few for testing and things like LXC, and it’s still frustrating at times - and I started with UNIX 35 years ago.
You’re seriously over estimating the capability of most users.
People can’t find controls in Windows when I guide them.
MaximilianKohler@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Fedora, Ubuntu, Debian, or PopOS
What about Arch? I was told:
mint is garbage. The only thing easier about mint or any of those “noob friendly” distros is the initial install
any time you want to do anything outside of its strict little ecosystem it becomes a massive headache
arch’s wiki is unparalleled
lvxferre@mander.xyz 8 months ago
I’m seriously thinking of trying Linux when Windows 11 is forced.
Sorry for the uncalled advice, but if you’re considering it, you might as well try it now. Specially in ways that don’t limit your access to Windows, such as live USB and dual boot (Windows and Linux in the same machine, at the same time). So if you do decide “I’m ditching Windows”, in the future, you’ll have an easier time doing so.
PM_Your_Nudes_Please@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Yup. Don’t wait until the W11 upgrade is imminent. Start it now, so you have a year of experience under your belt and can help your friends switch too.
homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Pretty much all computers have the specs to run linux. Of some flavor.
kakes@sh.itjust.works 8 months ago
The only thing stopping me from switching over to Mint is procrastination.
CosmicTurtle@lemmy.world 8 months ago
The hardest thing about Linux Mint is installing all of your software. It’s daunting even for very established users.
I moved from Ubuntu to LM a few months ago and I’ve enjoyed it.
mypasswordis1234@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Do yourself a favor and do it now. Maybe then you’ll be able to help others move to Linux who haven’t done so before.
agressivelyPassive@feddit.de 8 months ago
Then don’t hesitate! You could easily install both side by side, in case you need some Windows exclusive software.
catch22@programming.dev 8 months ago
I have switched a dell laptop that windows 10 didn’t support to pop os. (It was 7 years old) My whole family has used it for a few years to do everything without any issues. Ironically I have had problems with the Pop OS install on my newer more powerful machine.
ptz@dubvee.org 8 months ago
Yeah I’m not as much of a fan of PopOS as I thought I’d be. I have it on my daily driver laptop, and every system update seems to introduce some wacky bug/glitch or another. Nothing major, just random small annoyances that usually get fixed in the next update.
It dual boots Pop and Debian, and Debian performs flawlessly. It’s a Thinkpad, so Linux support has always been fantastic. I’m thinking of just dropping the PopOS partition and going back to my original love, Debian.
ovalofsand@lemmy.world 8 months ago
… Linux can run on a potato.
spyd3r@sh.itjust.works 8 months ago
There are multiple distros with live-cd (or usb drive) where you can boot to a desktop environment without installing anything if you want to try them.
BothsidesistFraud@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Start trying Linux now using WSL (Windows Subsystem for Linux). It’s a great way to dip your toe in the water, and your computer can run it today.
Viking_Hippie@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Blackmist@feddit.uk 8 months ago
Yes, because normal people always throw PCs away when they stop getting security updates.
Goodtoknow@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
When Chrome/Firefox stop getting updates and websites stop working they will
Contend6248@feddit.de 8 months ago
So 5-10 years after Windows EOL
Blackmist@feddit.uk 8 months ago
So at least 3 more years, plus however long it takes for website makers to use features exclusive to the very latest versions.
The only stuff that I know no longer works and is in common use is TLS. That’s the only reason some of our customers updated from XP.
Takumidesh@lemmy.world 8 months ago
But that will only happen when the user base falls, so enough people will have had to move on organically, for popular tools like web browsers to give up.
Firefox didn’t end windows 7 support until July of last year. 3 years after eol for 7 and when 7’s market share among windows was around 3 percent.
And just eol’ing Firefox doesn’t immediately break it, you will have at least a couple years before the browser becomes functionally useless.
KyuubiNoKitsune@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 months ago
Slack is already warning of eol on 10
rickyrigatoni@lemm.ee 8 months ago
most normal people are just going to be happy their computer isn’t annoying them about restarting for updates every two days
init@lemmy.ml 8 months ago
Oh, Microsoft will find a way to still annoy them, mark my words
someguy3@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
Companies probably will.
mods_are_assholes@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Some of the biggest businesses in the world still run legacy systems somewhere in their organization. I work for one of the top 5 retail data processors in the world and we have a handful of ancient legacy apps that can’t run on anything more modern than Server 2012.
And almost none of them take the proper precautions for vulnerable systems.
I mean for fuck’s sake, Office Depot’s Southeastern regional headquarters’s HVAC system is (well as of 2019 when I last checked) is controlled by a truly decrepit Windows 2000 box THAT IS NETWORK CONNECTED!
SupraMario@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Hahahahahaha…breathes…,… hahahahah
But in all seriousness, the %100 will not. They’re still companies that have winxp machines and servers on 2000/2003.
There is an entire sector of the secops industry built on protecting these machines.
Contend6248@feddit.de 8 months ago
Hack the planet?! Finally.
Blackmist@feddit.uk 8 months ago
Routers put paid to a lot of that. Early modems were like sticking your dick directly into the internet. I remember when Blaster came out and suddenly we all had to learn what a firewall was.
Hard to believe we just sat there with every port open to the net like that.
unreasonabro@lemmy.world 8 months ago
it’s not even that retarded an argument! If you don’t think about it, it could appear to make perfect sense instead of being bullshitese for a problem that isn’t real but taps into moral outrage about how wasteful every day is under capitalism.
Eggyhead@kbin.run 8 months ago
That’s a lot of new Linux computers.
capital@lemmy.world 8 months ago
I want to believe.
mods_are_assholes@lemmy.world 8 months ago
lol no, there’s several reasons linux’s desktop marketshare is terrible.
ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
They could move to Free-BSD
n0m4n@lemmy.world 8 months ago
No Nvidia for me.
HexesofVexes@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Once upon a time, updating your hardware every couple of years was essential. Your new hardware was a lot faster for normal use, and everyone benefitted.
Over time, however, people could wait longer between updates, as new hardware didn’t impact daily use all that much.
The powers that were grew displeased, and then decided to force people to update more often. Newer hardware had shorter lifespans, software forced newer hardware, software as a service became king.
The End?
Rodeo@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
You forgot the part where we all return to poverty so the rich can stay rich in the face of climate change.
neonred@lemmy.world 8 months ago
SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 months ago
Well you see, they learned their lesson from Windows 7 and having to support it for years longer than they intended to.
They know the same thing will happen for 10, because they are literally forcing a bunch of hardware out, even though all of it can technically run Windows 11 and just don’t have a TPM 2.0 chip. They made this choice, this was a business decision and they know it’s coming.
So what did they learn? That they’re rolling out a program to charge consumers for access to extended updates for Windows 10.[^1]
Back in the Windows 7 days, they only did that for corporations, extended updates with a cost attached. Now you, the consumer, get the joy of paying for these updates as well.
Not only are they purposefully creating trash, they’re also squeezing people for money in the process.
They’re doing exactly what they did with Windows 7, this time they just plan to charge you for the convenience.
Stay classy, Microsoft.
[^1]: “Individuals or organizations who elect to continue using Windows 10 after support ends on October 14, 2025, will have the option of enrolling their PCs into a paid ESU subscription.”
phoenixz@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
Again, Install Linux, get rid of Microsoft shit.
yoz@aussie.zone 8 months ago
I installed linux. I only use browser and vlc and it works great. I am not buying a new machine when old one works just fine.
mister_monster@monero.town 8 months ago
For us Linux users it’s just a fire sale. Diet cheap PCs incoming.
TheObviousSolution@lemm.ee 8 months ago
Sounds to me like an opportunity for Linux and Linux derivatives.
Obonga@feddit.de 8 months ago
Windows 11 can suck my stinky cock. Windows will successfully force my LAZY ass to Linux. I am already testing the waters with my laptop.
Jennykichu@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 months ago
Meanwhile Apple does this every few years and nobody cares.
Gormadt@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 months ago
Hello, it’s me, a landfill
Those systems are going to be dirt cheap Linux boxes in the very near future
Or at least a couple will be for me
LockheedTheDragon@lemmy.world 8 months ago
I’ve been saying for years I was going to move back over to Linux. This will be the push I need. Sadly my Dad is bad at computers and will need Windows 11 when using 10 becomes a problem. I’m throwing this at my brother since I was the one who got our Dad a Windows 10 computer. FU Microsoft, you peaked at XP.
Infynis@midwest.social 8 months ago
Linux about to pop off
RedditEnjoyer@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Cool, a prime opportunity to scalp even more old machines y the end of the decade once they become valuable.
RizzRustbolt@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Or folks will just continue to use 10.
3volver@lemmy.world 8 months ago
More people will switch to Linux once and for all.
Clbull@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Launching Windows 11 in the midst of a semiconductor shortage was such a dumb move on Microsoft’s part, especially when 11 doesn’t really offer that much more than 10. The only real ‘groundbreaking’ new feature (multiple desktops) was something that Linux had fifteen years ago.
BrownianMotion@lemmy.world 8 months ago
The only people that will really suffer from this is businesses. They will have to buy W11, and they will need to get supported hardware. However, businesses usually have rolling upgrades in place in the IT and have probably rolled out many already.
As for home users, with each newer generation, they become more tech savy. I can tell you now, this won’t affect as many people as you imagine.
1: W11 is free to download from M$. You can choose whether or not to buy a licence. W11 cracks already exist, M$ is still using key management services, so something like KMSpico still work. There are also tons of activator scripts on github (lol, since M$ owns this!). 2: Grab a copy of RUFUS. Use it to take the W11 image and remove all restrictions, and dumb it to USB. 3: ??? 4: Profit.
wowwoweowza@lemmy.ml 8 months ago
The great LINUX uprising of 2025!!!
mvirts@lemmy.world 8 months ago
yay i can finally get a good laptop on ebay in 2025! 😹
redcalcium@lemmy.institute 8 months ago
A fraction of those “old” computers will use Linux. Perhaps we’ll reach 5% desktop market share soon thanks to Microsoft.
AeonFelis@lemmy.world 8 months ago
So 2025 will finally be the year of the Linux desktop?
RedditWanderer@lemmy.world 8 months ago
None of these PCs need to go to landfill. Linux
TheOneWithTheHair@lemmy.world 8 months ago
“Windows 7 appears to still be running on at least 100 million machines, despite Microsoft ending support for the operating system a year ago”
–Tom Warren. Jan 6, 2021.
theverge.com/…/microsoft-windows-7-109-million-pc…
Maybe the landfill won’t be overstuffed as quickly as expected.
See also
“Monthly market share held by Windows operating system for desktop PCs worldwide from January 2017 to November 2023, by version” statista.com/…/worldwide-windows-operating-system…
It’s a dwindling effect, not just instant abandonment.
dangblingus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 months ago
This is such an old article at this point. PCs don’t get sent to the landfill because the OS isn’t supported anymore. That’s idiotic.
TypicalHog@lemm.ee 8 months ago
Why would you send 240 million PCs to the landfill when you can install Linux on all of them?
kinther@lemmy.world 8 months ago
I built a new PC last year and bought a copy of Windows 11. Holy moly the login process required so much bullshit that I skipped through. It also every few days tries to get me to go through it again. After learning about all the Spyware and other bullshit I decided to just take the plunge back into using Linux as a main OS.
dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world 8 months ago
No it won’t.
240 million grandmas, cheapskate businesses, and cash-strapped public schools will continue to use whatever operating system their computers already have, forever, until they break, security implications be damned.
bitwaba@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Windows
10XPanguo@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
Took this picture a couple of days ago: 1000006180
kescusay@lemmy.world 8 months ago
This is a huge business opportunity for someone with the know-how. They should offer a consulting service that does the following:
Offer a support contract that severely undercuts anything Microsoft is
gougingselling. Offer basic training, too.Anyone who does that can make bank.
voluble@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Would also need to get a burner phone number w/ answering machine to take calls from 240 million grandmas, cheapskate businesses and cash-strapped public schools for any & all tech support questions until the end of time, because if there was an issue with system stability in any way whatsoever, or if the router went down or the printer stopped working, they’d assume it was the fault of ‘the guy who changed everything’.
Linux is great & everything, but this sounds like a recipe for utter disaster, not a way to make an easy buck.
FonsNihilo@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
Uhhhhh no. That would not work. Sorry to be so blunt, but I’ll explain way it wont:
No gradeschool anywhere is going to simply move to Linux from Windows because their systems are outdated. Microsoft pays a huge roll in the educational systems around the world. Most often they will offer their software for free, as long as the students are trained on Microsoft programs. It’s considered to be a long term investment by Microsoft. Most school boards cannot simply drop Windows for Linux.
A better business opportunity would be to just mass buy these outdated computers, get Rufus to remove the TPM 2.0 requirement, reinstall Windows, resell PCs.
Do you think someone who uses their PC for Facebook is going to want to learn how to use Linux? What will they do if/when they break it?
2 major and key difference between Linux and Windows for the average user is: 1.Windows protects the user from breaking the OS. 2. Peripherals and everything else just work on windows. Everything for the average user, it just works. Plug it in, and Windows takes care of it.
For the average person who just wants to turn their PC on and use it, Windows/MacOS just work.
Or even simpler business idea: Offer a reinstallation of Windows without TPM for the user for a fee.
Unfortunately just because ~%4 of PC users want Linux to be the norm, doesn’t mean it will.
ech@lemm.ee 8 months ago
See, the key flaw in your plan is expecting companies to shell out to upgrade their systems. Putting aside organizations who’s infrastructure can’t realistically transfer to a new system without scrapping it entirely, pretty much every business will run their systems until they have literally no other choice (ie it is functionally unusable/affecting sales) instead of “losing money” upgrading. MS stopping updates won’t push them over that line, at least not for a while.
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 8 months ago
That’s actually a decry idea if people are using boilerplate windows software. Unfortunately institutional software is unlikely to cross over, and even if similar software can be found to replace private users’ needs, there is going to be resistance to change. The resistance will be commensurate with the differences in workflow and usage between the windows and Linux software.
I mean, the whole point is people don’t want to change. The only way you’d win people over easily is directly cloning their windows setup.
BearOfaTime@lemm.ee 8 months ago
Companies won’t pay. Even SMB.
There’s way too much stuff that only runs on windows, their users are used to windows.
You’re telling them to spend a lot of money to transition, and take on a lot of risk.
It just ain’t gonna happen.
Look at the current VMware issue to see what companies will do.
crazyfuckincoder@programming.dev 8 months ago
I feel the issue is if you’re successful with this idea and get on radar of Microsoft, they will make sure to snatch away all deals from you by bidding even lower. They have money to lose. Small firms generally don’t.
Crashumbc@lemmy.world 8 months ago
ROFL, and for a half of that cost and none of the risk, companies will just drop in new windows computers and keep the status quo…
funchords@lemmy.sdf.org 8 months ago
My 76 y/o spouse loves Linux Mint. The 2017-bought desktop was deemed insufficient for Windows 11 and now runs Mint.
Holzkohlen@feddit.de 8 months ago
If all they use is a web browser and solitaire then putting them on Linux is super easy. Got my dad on Mint for years now. I recommend KPatience for solitaire needs.
CraigeryTheKid@lemm.ee 8 months ago
yeah, other than the obvious “haha-ing in Linux” (which… I also use Linux) - the REAL answer is people will just keep using the outdated Windows until THAT computer dies it’s natural death.
Bristle1744@lemmy.today 8 months ago
Also third world countries where people can’t afford to spend their yearly salary on a mouse.
Arthur_Leywin@lemmy.world 8 months ago
When that time comes, would that create a period of insane amounts of scams?
SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 months ago
Yes.
LifeOfChance@lemmy.world 8 months ago
I wish you were right. Instead what we will likely see is an increase in year to year E-waste until the majority is phased out into land fills.
tigeruppercut@lemmy.zip 8 months ago
I dunno, computers aren’t like phones where your provider is offering you incentives to chuck your old one every 2 years. There’ll be an increase of waste from businesses for sure, but I think most people don’t really pay attention to their security updates and will just keep using their pcs until they need a newer one for personal reasons (playing newer games, old one bricked, etc)
FunkPhenomenon@lemmy.zip 8 months ago
ChromeOS has entered the chat
mods_are_assholes@lemmy.world 8 months ago
0patch offers microcode patching for EOL windows systems, I have a subscription for my Win7 gaming box and will be getting one for my win10 daily driver, because FUCK win11.
It’s a good company, they’ve won several bounties from Microsoft for 0-day fixes and have had their code published in official microsoft updates.
Armando3996@lemm.ee 8 months ago
And tech-savvy windows users(those who need it) switch to windows 10 LTSC iot edition