A headline without calling it an “Artificial Sun”?!
France runs fusion reactor for record 22 minutes
Submitted 1 month ago by misk@sopuli.xyz to technology@lemmy.world
https://newatlas.com/energy/france-tokamak-cea-west-fusion-reactor-record-plasma-duration/
Comments
notsoshaihulud@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Toribor@corndog.social 1 month ago
The power of the sun in the palm of my hand.
MalMen@masto.pt 1 month ago
@Toribor @notsoshaihulud with great power comes great responsibility
Shardikprime@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Don’t worry, it will stabilize
cynar@lemmy.world 1 month ago
The amusing thing is that the sun is actually quite a shit fusion reactor. It’s power per unit volume is tiny. It just makes it up in sheer volume. A solar level fusion reactor would be almost completely useless to us. Instead we need to go far beyond the sun’s output to just be viable.
It’s like describing one of the mega mining dumper trucks as an “artificial mule”.
notsoshaihulud@lemmy.world 1 month ago
I think this energy density math really depends on whether only the core or the whole surface area is taken into consideration.
lurklurk@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Arguably, the nearby sun scale fusion reactor has been fairly useful for us. Nowadays we can convert its output directly into electricity using solar cells
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 1 month ago
Someone once told me a sun is just a fusion nuclear pile reactor and… Like… I guess.
merc@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
Sure, but it makes up for that by having an idiot proof design.
yogurt@lemm.ee 1 month ago
They say “artificial sun” because that’s what it is though, there’s no fusion reactions they’re just microwaving hydrogen to millions of degrees to study the kind of thing that would happen IF somebody runs a fusion reactor for 22 minutes.
scratchee@feddit.uk 1 month ago
Or a “star in a bottle”
SpicyLizards@reddthat.com 1 month ago
A bulb in a bong
Placebonickname@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Meanwhile in America we’re trying to make macdonalds cheaper by bundling an extra sandwich to go along with a value meal…
crank0271@lemmy.world 1 month ago
That’s called McFusion
Brickhead92@lemmy.world 1 month ago
And it only takes 22 seconds to consume.
Jericho_Kane@lemmy.org 1 month ago
America would blow up a fusion reacto, call it dangerous, elon musk has a lot of things to say about it and then it would be illegal worldwide. Have you guys heard about coal? We already fixed it, just burn coal.
akakevbot@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
RunningInRVA@lemmy.world 1 month ago
The power of the sun in the palm of my hand
ThePyroPython@lemmy.world 1 month ago
la puissance du soleil dans la paume de ma main
Honhonhon
[Takes a drag on a sexy cigarette]
echodot@feddit.uk 1 month ago
The only reason to pursue fusion power research is so you can say this on a weekly basis. Any benefits to humanity are purely secondary.
x00z@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Why don’t we use “shatters world record” like the pro-China articles where they did this for 16 minutes?
I know why.
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 1 month ago
I know!
Because the articles were written by different people and published in different magazines ya goober.
x00z@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Nah.
It’s because of the Chinese propaganda machine.
FanBlade@lemmynsfw.com 1 month ago
Because that one was over double the length of the record before it and this one is closer to a 35% increase.
lurch@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
Is it because if the Uyghurs?
eugenevdebs@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 month ago
Why do you care so much what an article says about France’s accomplishments of science and China’s accomplishments of science? Why can’t we enjoy the movement of technology without bickering about lines drawn in the sand by people none of us know or care about?
jose1324@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Dumbass lol
Abnorc@lemm.ee 1 month ago
They’ll never tell.
LostWon@lemmy.ca 1 month ago
Maybe if it runs longer, we all get to jump to a better timeline. 😅
PumpkinEscobar@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Or the world blows up and it’s all over. I guess what I’m saying is, no downside, fire it up and let’s see what happens.
Obelix@feddit.org 1 month ago
I’m sceptical. Even if somebody would present a working fusion reactor today, what would the timeline to replace everything based on fossil fuels even be? Build several thousand of expensive fusion reactors in every country of the world, even in geopolitical rivals like China, Russia or North Korea or war-torn third world countries? Replace every car with an electrical one? Replace home heating everywhere? Rebuild every ship and airplane worldwide?
JayObey711@lemmy.world 1 month ago
I mean yea that’s the plan. What are the other options? Force every countrie to stop producing instead to reduce carbon emissions that way? Wich one Sounds more realistic? And I feel like you assume that fusion reactors are dangerous because your comments about war torn countries. But it’s not possible to turn them into weapons. They run on hydrogen. And if they ever oberheat or something the magnets stop working and the reaction stops.
CoffeeJunkie@lemmy.cafe 1 month ago
Progress is progress, and it’s good to be skeptical (I literally just posted a comment saying “I’m skeptical”!), but progress is good. 🙂 What other alternatives are there?
If it doesn’t make dollars, it doesn’t make sense. That’s why the electric car movement is having a hard time really taking off rn; it is hard to justify & all the tech, all our builds, aren’t exactly super economical yet. And they’re not built for tough conditions, heavy towing, long commutes, and easily workable & recyclable components.
…but things are, indeed, getting better. If you look at it from a macro view. Lithium recycling can be done even a decade ago, but IIRC it was relatively small scale & the lithium could be refreshed “most of the way”, not fully. The right things will catch on when their time is right & its viability is realized.
Man’s greatest strength is our shared knowledge, technology, science, and innovation. I encourage you to make good decisions in your personal life and be positive. 🙂
LostWon@lemmy.ca 1 month ago
I was just making an abstract sci-fi joke based on how cold fusion has been presented like a Holy Grail in the past. Obviously a better source of energy isn’t going to solve all our problems, no matter how good it is.
Sceptique@leminal.space 1 month ago
No tech will give you a better timeline, back on the floor please ^^ It’s a political problem before anything else, and energy production is far from being the first problem.
naught101@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Scientists: invents commercial scale fusion Capitalist: hordes the almost free energy because why not? Poor people are only useful as a resource anyway.
match@pawb.social 1 month ago
1,337 seconds? That… that number used to mean something, but now i can’t recall what…
not_so_handsome_jack@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
The translation has been lost to the ages
chiliedogg@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Found someone who can help you.
rimjob_rainer@discuss.tchncs.de 1 month ago
I still use 1337 sometimes, for joke names like H4xX0r1337 and it’s always that nobody gets it. How could past internet culture vanish like that?
robador51@lemmy.ml 1 month ago
1337, leet, elite
Th3D3k0y@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Shh, don’t let the kids hear you say that
tomkatt@lemmy.world 1 month ago
This is freaking awesome. Only a few years ago it was exciting to see a fusion reaction last a fraction of a second.
Thief@lemmy.myserv.one 1 month ago
It is awesome. Whichever country develops it first will be remembered as the next ‘moon landing’ event forever.
Saleh@feddit.org 1 month ago
So a big event without any practical relevance because there is more cheaper, reliable and safer alternatives available?
HowAbt2morrow@futurology.today 1 month ago
Oh shit. Things are heating up in the fusion race.
misk@sopuli.xyz 1 month ago
IIRC it was expected because previous record from China was essentially a trial for this one. It all happens under ITER project so it’s not that much of a race.
ZJBlank@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Good shit. I’d rather this be a global cooperative effort rather than a jingoistic dick-waving contest.
Akasazh@feddit.nl 1 month ago
Good. The only thing that was quite good about the cold war was the competition.
ByteJunk@lemmy.world 1 month ago
That’s not what this is, and even then, that competition wasn’t even good. You had two countries hoarding technological advancements for themselves, with everything having to be discovered twice.
This is a worldwide collaboration, where each assists the others, and it’s a much better way of making progress. See ITER.
DataDisrupter@feddit.nl 1 month ago
I didn’t see any mention of the output in the article. 22MW injected, but does anyone know if the reaction was actually generating a positive output?
sushibowl@feddit.nl 1 month ago
No magnetic confinement fusion reactor in existence has ever generated a positive output. The current record belongs to JET, with a Q factor of 0.67. This record was set in 1997.
The biggest reason we haven’t had a record break for a long time is money. The most favourable reaction for fusion is generally a D-T (Deuterium-Tritium) reaction. However, Tritium is incredibly expensive. So, most reactors run the much cheaper D-D reaction, which generates lower output. This is okay because current research reactors are mostly doing research on specific components of an eventual commercial reactor, and are not aiming for highest possible power output.
The main purpose of WEST is to do research on diverter components for ITER. ITER itself is expected to reach Q ≥ 10, but won’t have any energy harvesting components. The goal is to add that to its successor, DEMO.
Inertial confinement fusion (using lasers) has produced higher records, but they generally exclude the energy used to produce the laser from the calculation. NIF has generated 3.15MJ of fusion output by delivering 2.05MJ of energy to it with a laser, nominally a Q = 1.54. however, creating the laser that delivered the power took about 300MJ.
DataDisrupter@feddit.nl 1 month ago
I wasn’t aware of that distinction about the energy for the laser to generate the heat energy within the reaction not being factored into the Q value, very interesting, thank you! Would that energy for the laser still be required in a “stable reaction” continuously, or would it be something that would “trail off”?
Lycist@lemmy.world 1 month ago
theguardian.com/…/us-scientists-achieve-net-energ…
I’ve seen a few mentions of positive output.
frayedpickles@lemmy.cafe 1 month ago
The input energy doesnt matter that much. Nobody is going to use 1980s laser tech to power a real reactor. As with OP, inertial confinement is interested in very small nuanced science aspects, not making a power plant.
simplejack@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Sounds like the goal of the test wasn’t to vet ignition power in relation to output. These people are testing the durability of system designs that can maintain a reaction after ignition.
If this was a car, they wouldn’t be testing the fuel efficiency, they’d be testing how long they could drive before the wheels fell off.
jordanlund@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Mr. Fusion now 1 step closer… 10 years late, but still!
frog_brawler@lemmy.world 1 month ago
I hope it smoked a cigarette once it finished.
CoffeeJunkie@lemmy.cafe 1 month ago
Well, I’m still skeptical, but I have far more trust in France’s reporting than Chinese claims.
Fleur_@hilariouschaos.com 1 month ago
Just one more giga Jule guys …
Pro fusion research btw just a chronic shitposter
Harbinger01173430@lemmy.world 1 month ago
How ks the drill baby drill crowd going to compete against mini stars in a can?
Lmao. Fucking oil losers
caboose2006@lemm.ee 1 month ago
30 years guys.
meowmeowbeanz@sopuli.xyz 1 month ago
France’s 22-minute plasma reaction is a bold stride toward sustainable fusion energy but remains experimental.
🐱🐱🐱🐱
Sunshine@lemmy.ca 1 month ago
Amazing news!
antor124@leminal.space 1 month ago
This is an incredible milestone for fusion power! 22 minutes of plasma reaction is a huge step forward. Looking forward to seeing how this technology evolves. Check out more details here: <a href=“markdown-viewer.com”>markdown viewer</a>.
ian@feddit.uk 1 month ago
They should get out more.
Krik@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 month ago
Doesn’t sound that impressive when Wendelstein 7-X achieved 17 minutes of plasma in 2021.
DarkCloud@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Garantee you they weren’t generating a whole lot of power though… And if you can’t do that part then what’s the point?
Fizz@lemmy.nz 1 month ago
This is so cool. I remember seeing that Europe is working on a massive mega project to build an even bigger reactor for more experiements. Its costing like 75 trillion
WalnutLum@lemmy.ml 1 month ago
This is cool but also remember the practicalities of Fusion make it not much better than nuclear:
vastlyimproved69@lemmy.world 1 month ago
merde
TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Image
NOT_RICK@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Le et
AtariDump@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Image
Evotech@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Flexing
5714@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 month ago
Flexing is not good for the containment
Cheems@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Rumor is next they are trying for 11.6858˙3 hours
_stranger_@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Elven time conversion is the worst.
hakunawazo@lemmy.world 1 month ago
5,318008 seconds should be a new goal.