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Reddit stock falls for second day as references to its content in ChatGPT responses plummet

⁨1009⁩ ⁨likes⁩

Submitted ⁨⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨RandAlThor@lemmy.ca⁩ to ⁨technology@lemmy.world⁩

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/reddit-stock-falls-for-second-day-as-references-to-its-content-in-chatgpt-responses-plummet-135203534.html

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Comments

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  • calliope@retrolemmy.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Huh.

    Does anyone else think that ChatGPT is still using the data, they’re just not referencing Reddit directly?

    This is how you can tell Reddit’s $200+/share price is insane. Over 10% of its value dropped based on a different unprofitable company’s references to ingested content.

    Yikes!!

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    • rafoix@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Reddit’s value is its ability to use bots to manipulate and distribute information. It’s just like Twitter, meta and all the other social media platforms.

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      • FlexibleToast@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        No, it’s value is that users have up voted and down voted good and bad data. This gives the AI training data that has been crowd sourced by humans. Bots manipulating votes would destroy the value of Reddit.

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      • BakerBagel@midwest.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Ok, so how does a shareholder benefit from that? My company that pays people to stomp on kittens at my kitten stomping factory has value in that in gives people jobs and controls the feral cat population, but it creates no profit for the shareholders.

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      • Tollana1234567@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        ability to allow bot propaganda to infest the subreddits more easily(especially politics and news)

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    • arsCynic@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      The entire stock market has become a meme stock pyramid scheme. No price makes sense; it’s all glorified gambling making life on this planet worse for most living things.

      - - ⚜︎ arscyni.cc: modernity ∝ nature.

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    • Taldan@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Yes, but Oracle’s stock skyrocketed based on the unprofitable OpenAI promising to buy >100B worth of AI data center space from Oracle. Nvidia stock also surged on the news, since Oracle builds those data centers with Nvidia chips

      Obviously OpenAI doesn’t have the money to pay Oracle themselves, so Nvidia has helpfully given them the money

      So now we have an incredibly large cyclic corporate dependency of money from Nvidia -> OpenAI -> Oracle, then back to Nvidia. Definitely not a financial disaster waiting to happen

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      • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        They haven’t even spent the fucking money yet. It’s just announcements of intentions, with a fraction of that $100B in outlays. Nobody seems to want to say who gets to be the one holding the $100B at the end of it, either.

        Presumably they’ll all just do a stock swap and tell their vendors “We’re good for it, check’s in the mail”?

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    • NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      While I don’t agree with the reddit valuation to begin with…

      that is actually how the stock market “should” work? Reddit is a company that, at its core, produces data to sell to other companies. If other companies choose to (say they are not going to) use that data, then the value of reddit drops. That is literally supply and demand.

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    • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      This is how you can tell Reddit’s $200+/share price is insane.

      Well, that and the P/E is 180. Typical target P/E on a stock is 15-20, depending on your anticipation of its growth. But we’re expected to believe Reddit’s earnings will be 9x their current income in… some nebulous amount of time?

      Like, its silly to get excited about a company this hyperinflated seeing a tiny slide off its new peak. But also, you can’t help be bearish on a firm this flimsy.

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  • Eat_Your_Paisley@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Couldn’t happen to a nicer company

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  • mrodri89@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Reddit banned me today for making a joke that the patch title for Guild Wars 2 could match real life events.

    What is the patch name? The Mad King and his Lunatic Court.

    Permanently banned for what? Harassment.

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    • Winged_Hussar@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Not how I expected GW2 to come up on Lemmy… But here we are hahaha

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      • nekbardrun@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Well… no surprising since we ought to have the molengrad.

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    • PKscope@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      I wish I could say I’m shocked. That site has fallen off so hard it’s crazy. The censorship has gone mad. It’s the main reason I’m here.

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      • UltraMagnus0001@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Hopefully the mods on lemmy don’t go power hungry

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    • NoodlePoint@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Must be the AI profiling system and how it flags anyone even remotely talking about POTUS.

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    • Tollana1234567@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      im not surprised if the filters is looking for any “anti-trump” comments, they probably will ignore certain bots and not users.

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    • Strider@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Insult to the king, off with your head!

      /s

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  • MedicPigBabySaver@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Fuck Reddit and Fuck Spez.

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    • AtariDump@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Image

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  • etherphon@piefed.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Wasted 15 years on that site to be banned for one fucking comment, burn baby burn.

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    • YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Same. My comment was “fuck trump and Obama” arguing about using drones to order civilians abroad. Do you remember what your violent advocation was?

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      • BanMe@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        I suggested drawing in chalk on the street outside of the governor’s mansion, to protest the GIANT chalk Christ she had commissioned across the driveway to celebrate Easter one year.

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      • Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Mine was a direct, attributed quote from the US president.

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      • axexrx@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Mine was telling someone it was unlikely that spain would declare war on israel, it being a nuclear nation…

        Banned for ‘glorifying violence.’

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      • rumba@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        no OP.

        I got the F out and deleted my old posts every time they restored them until they stayed gone.

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      • Goldholz@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Mine was "the german train system organisation should be burned down and redone anew

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      • etherphon@piefed.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        For wishing an old man would have a heart attack and leave the world peacefully.

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    • Tollana1234567@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      i think people were shocked that all thier accounts were banned simulataneous, despite some of them not participating in the same subs, around the same time. they just went after every account in your ip address.

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    • HarneyToker@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      I said that folks would blame the Kirk shooting on trans people. What do you know, I was banned and it actually fucking happened.

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    • BilSabab@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      feel your pain, homie.

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      • etherphon@piefed.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Thanks haha, I was never really rah rah into reddit itself but it had a lot of cool niche subs for hobbies and such and that's where I spent most of my time not even in the default or political subs.

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    • whereyaaat@lemmings.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      I could never understand why people cared about their social media accounts.

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      • Fyrnyx@kbin.melroy.org ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Because whether you like it or not, social media is the easy-track to connect with people of all varying degrees and connect through common interests and even ideals. It's a lot easier than in the 2000s and 1990s when all you've had was an e-mail and probably chat room hopping. You just had to know someone else's e-mail like you would have to know someone's number to call them, that's how it worked.

        With social media, you can just breeze through friend lists and comb over searches to find friends and everything far easier. It's easier to connect with people that way than ever before. And losing out on that, can sting.

        I sometimes wished it wasn't that way, but the people have largely decided we needed something more than just writing e-mails to eachother.

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      • IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        if you start having a social network within a social media, a ban can hurt.

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      • Tollana1234567@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        probably some have ties to smaller communities of specific category(not news or politics), like your into tech, or cars, or CARD GAMES, or console games. or specific discussions.

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  • hayvan@feddit.nl ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    I don’t care about their stock value but the situation fells so weird. So chatgpt refers to reddit less, and that makes reddit stock value fall. This really shows how much of the share value is pure hype and how much of “the economy” is pure manupulation of numbers instead of actual value.

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    • DupaCycki@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Image

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      • Shortstack@reddthat.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        The bubble bursts when one of them can’t make their monthly payment.

        It’s the dot com bubble all over again

        Makes me think I should sell all my retirement stocks and stick it in bonds until the bottom falls out from under Nvidia

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    • RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      How decoupled stocks are from reality or value. It’s bizarre.

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      • bitjunkie@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Tesla is “larger” than all other car companies combined when they’re virtually always “delayed” on actually shipping product. We live in bizarro world. Your livelihood is a single cell in a giant spreadsheet full of completely made-up numbers.

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      • utopiah@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        meme stocks.

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    • AAA@feddit.org ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      That’s actually quite easy to explain. Reddits entire monetary value (or at least a very large portion) depends on how relevant it is as platform to mine user interactions - to use as training material for AI.

      Reddit getting references less is a sign that the models, or the owning companies, value reddit data less compared to before.

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    • r0ertel@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      You just described most tech stocks.

      As Cory Doctrow explains:

      the fundamental duty of every CEO of every high-growth tech company: explaining how his company will continue to grow. These growth stories are key, because growth stocks trade at a huge premium relative to the stocks of “mature” companies.

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  • Reygle@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Good. Fuck u/Spez.

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    • Cassanderer@thelemmy.club ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Keep in mind if the Reddit stock price fell too much some hedge fund vulture would buy up a majority of the stock and then turn it into Nazi town.

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      • bigFab@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Even better then. That’s how the mass migration from twitter happened.

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      • expr@programming.dev ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Isn’t it already basically Nazi town?

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  • Adderbox76@lemmy.ca ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    The fact that any AI company thought to train their LLM on the answers of Reddit users speaks to a fundamental misunderstanding of their own product (IMO)

    LLMs aren’t programmed to give you the correct answer. They’re programmed to give you the most pervasive/popular answer on the assumption that most of the time that will also happen to be the right one.

    So when you’re getting your knowledge base from random jackasses on Reddit, where a good faith question like “What’s the best way to get get gum out of my childs hair” get’s two two good faith answers, and then a few dozen smart-ass answers that gets lots of replies and upvotes because they’re funny. Guess which one your LLM is going to use.

    People (and apparently even the creators themselves) think that an LLM is actually cognizent enough to be able to weed this out logically. But it can’t. It’s not an intelligence…it’s a knowlege agreggator. And as with any aggregator, the same rule applies

    garbage in, garbage out

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    • bridgeenjoyer@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Thats why I have stopped calling it ai. Its a dumbass buzzword just like cloud, that tech bros like to use but cant explain (or blockchain).

      Its llms, and image generators/OCR (which has been around for decades), Using complex markov chains and a fuck ton of graphics cards. NOT AI. NOT AI.

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      • sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        It is AI, along with a bunch of optimization algorithms, statistical decision trees (probably used in adaptive AI in games), etc. AI is a field in computer science that includes a ton of things many wouldn’t consider AI.

        It’s not “general AI”, but it is in the field of AI.

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      • muusemuuse@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        I use the term “inference machine”

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      • filcuk@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        I’ve had to start calling it AI because most people don’t know what LLMs are, noone cares to go through the explanation, including myself.
        I’m afraid that, as these things go, AI has gained a new meaning by popular use, rather than the original meaning of the acronym.
        No point fighting it anymore.

        Maybe we just need to adjust and start saying GAI (generative ai). It has a nice ring to it too.

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    • mcv@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      The main thing that AI has shown, is how much bullshit we subconsciously filter through every day without much effort. (Although clearly some people struggle a lot more with distinguishing between bullshit and fact, considering how much politicized nonsense has taken hold.)

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      • Adderbox76@lemmy.ca ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Exactly that.

        If I were to google how to get gum out of my child’s hair and then be directed to that same reddit post. I’d read through it and be pretty sure which were jokes and which were serious; we make such distinctions, as you say, every day without much effort.

        LLMs simply don’t have that ability. And the number of average people who just don’t get that is mind-boggling to me.

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    • SuperEars@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      “How do I parallel park a car?”

      AI Overview: “git gud”

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      • Wav_function@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Technically correct

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    • dil@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Usually the third/fifth comment down is correct while the top 4 are jokes

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  • just_another_person@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    This is certainly part of OpenAI’s plan, and a warning shot to other user content-driven sites.

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    • Tollana1234567@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      reddit is all cahoots with OPEN AI/googles own AI. im not surprised, its probably what led to thier massive ban waves, since they are using AI to overmoderate the whole site(indiscriminate bannings)

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  • nieceandtows@programming.dev ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    News about short term falls are just click bait. Just look at Tesla

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    • BilSabab@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Tesla stock ups and downs seem like someone is literally gaming the system.

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      • jobbies@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        That’s because he is.

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  • NoodlePoint@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    That’s what pandering to the bigger techbros spez gets.

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    • Psythik@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      All my accounts were banned except one, because I used a different email address for that one. Their “AI” isn’t as advanced as they want you to think. They literally just track you by email and IP.

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      • NoodlePoint@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        Their profiling system is based on content in the form of posts and comments, and they used AI to build it up in addition to user-submitted reports determining one’s character. Mods and admins would then use that information to determine if you are a candidate for banning.

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      • Tollana1234567@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        mines was the same, until April the final account got banned. I heard early on in the year, that when it gives you the message “your account has been suspended for suspicious activity, change your password”, when i did that the ban was lifted. they fixed that later on.

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    • themachinestops@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      I wonder why people on worldnews are not banned. 🤔

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    • Tollana1234567@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      you dont even have to mention anything you can just get banned for creating a new account, or firing up an years old account, since they will consider those as bots. it happens randomly though. so much so, the shadowban sub had so many of these bans because they got banned for little reason.(besides the one that have multiple accounts get shadowbanned).

      they started limiting the amount of time the shadowban questions stay open to silence any discussion of it.

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  • sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Oh my god I somehow forgot that Reddit IPO8ng means I get to read stories like this.

    Oh no, the world’s most poorly managed and funded corporate social media website’s stock is tanking, oh nooooo!

    Ahahahah!

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  • mesamunefire@piefed.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    heh I wonder if all the “old” content getting messed with and/or removed is causing issues with the algorithm/scraper.

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    • NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      For unauthorized scrapers? Definitely

      For paid API usage? That tends to not be public for obvious reasons but, allegedly, people have, allegedly, done tests and found “deleted” content in the results.

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  • Fyrnyx@kbin.melroy.org ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Good job, Spez, you fuck!

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  • buddascrayon@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Downvoted because this isn’t news. It’s clickbaity nonsense which has no bearing on anything real.

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  • KingThrillgore@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Oh no!

    Anyways what’s everyone having for lunch? I’m having bean burritos.

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  • hodgepodgin@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    I remember back in 2021 or 2022 when it was announced they were going public that yep, this site is gonna be gone soon.

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  • Blackfeathr@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Good, hope it crashes.

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  • notgivingmynametoamachine@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Good. Nazi sympathizing shithole deserves nothing but the worst. Fuck spez and every complicit modgoloid and SSAdmin.

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  • db2@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Image

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  • devolution@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Fuck reddit.

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  • Formfiller@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Image

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  • Korhaka@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Yay reddit worth less, wtf it’s due to chatgpt?

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  • freqMon@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    I just deleted my Reddit account of 6 years. Just found Lemmy today and joined up, this is my first post :)

    Back on topic! It makes so much sense when you watch the way the LLM interacts, its tone exactly encompasses the average Reddit user and post, half-baked karma whoring … You’re absolutely right!

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  • Lucky_777@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    They were the architects of their own demise

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  • Trill88@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Buncha self absorbed cliched weirdos over there anyway

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  • Aljernon@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Reddit be a mess, yall

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  • LemmyBeGood@lemmy.myserv.one ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    That’s probably why they are banning people left and right to control the content they want to put out.

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  • Ironfist79@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Reddit is a parasite that produces nothing of value. The users are the ones keeping the site alive.

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  • fossilesque@mander.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    The entire site is gpt.

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