Microsoft gives the Wine team infectious mononucleosis. Got it.
But seriously, Microsoft is nobody’s friend and shouldn’t be trusted.
Microsoft donates the Mono Project to the Wine team
Submitted 2 months ago by mesamunefire@lemmy.world to technology@lemmy.world
https://www.gamingonlinux.com/2024/08/microsoft-donates-the-mono-project-to-the-wine-team/
Comments
TootSweet@lemmy.world 2 months ago
dan1101@lemm.ee 2 months ago
In an organization as large as MS there have to be a few good guys. Just don’t let the corporate leadership hear about it.
Thorry84@feddit.nl 2 months ago
I know a lot of folk that work at MS or have worked there, they are all very good people. They are highly motivated professionals that are top in their field. MS is a rich company and they recruit the best they can. However those are not the people making any kind of decisions. And it’s a cut throat company, if the budget gets cut, you are out on your ass. At least in most of the world, where strong employee protection isn’t a thing.
Don’t get me wrong, MS has a lot of bad apples just like any other company. Useless managers who say dumb shit and take praise for other peoples work. A leadership that doesn’t care about anything except their bonuses and the bottom line. But at least as far as the engineers go, there’s plenty of really good folk.
People also seem to forget how huge MS actually is. And a lot of the time the different branches within the company are as far away from each other as can be. Even within the same branch one can only talk to so many people.
boraca@lemmy.world 2 months ago
From a Microsoft employee: with all the conspiracy theories people have about Microsoft secretly planning to control th world, the most surprising thing is them assuming MS are this organized to attemp it.
11111one11111@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Lol noone is thinking they are taking over the world. There is no conspiracy. Everyone has been so fucking tired of the operating system monopoly theve had on PC’s before they started ruining every fucking piece of technology they touch.
TootSweet@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I’m just speaking from their history. Like when they embraced Java, built their own JVM, shipped it with Windows, and then forked the Java language by adding Windows-specific APIs to Microsoft Java and not adding the Java 1.2 features to Microsoft Java. Or the whole “Windows tax” thing. Or “Open Core.”
And, who knows. Maybe they’re either nicer now or less competent at that kind of evil. But if so, that’s a relatively new thing. Their history as a company is full of (not-so-)“secretly planning to control the world”. And they have never really faced any consequences for their anti-trust violations. And if they didn’t want people to hold grudges, maybe they should have thought of that before fucking everyone over as thoroughly as they possibly could.
I guess you could say Microsoft was perfecting the art of enshittification before it became such a pervasive thing. Plus, I largely blame Gates personally for the rise of the institution of proprietary software, which is also complete BS.
Mind you, I don’t blame you for working for Microsoft or anything. No ethical consumption (or employment) under capitalism and all that. And it’s not like I’m not doing evil things on a regular basis as an employee where I work.
MoonlightFox@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I am no Microsoft fanboy, but I get the impression people are a bit overly skeptical here.
I think this is fairly obvious. They have no further use for it, they can either let it rot or they can do the tiniest bit of effort and get some positive PR. It might also just be as simple as an initiative from some employees.
kautau@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Yup, what they needed from Xamarin was absorbed into .NET and now that have MAUI for cross platform stuff, it was either sunset mono or give it to someone else
Technofrood@feddit.uk 2 months ago
Now if only they would add Linux support to MAUI.
Valmond@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Wasn’t it open source all the time? The article spins it more like microsoft don’t want to shepherd the project any more, another group takes over?
Isn’t it just less work for m$ or what am I missing?
EmasXP@lemmy.world 2 months ago
TIL that Mono is a Microsoft project. I always thought it was an open source reverse engineered .NET
NegativeInf@lemmy.world 2 months ago
It was only a Microsoft project the moment they bought the original company that developed it.
Dremor@lemmy.world 2 months ago
It was at first, then they became a for profit organization, Xalarin, who was bought by Microsoft.
Omega_Jimes@lemmy.ca 2 months ago
I can’t help but think that Microsoft has decided to proceed in some way that will break compatibility, so they’re done with Mono now.
I know it’s skeptical, but I just have no faith in that company to act in good faith with anything.
paf0@lemmy.world 2 months ago
dotnet is now a multiplatform framework itself. Do they still need mono?
purplemonkeymad@programming.dev 2 months ago
Is mono not the .net framework version? .net core has always been multi platform, but is not compatible with .net framework apps. So any .net apps built against 3.5 or 4.x would still need to use mono.
Imgonnatrythis@sh.itjust.works 2 months ago
As much as it is beloved, I don’t think windows sees Linux / wine as any kind of substantial threat.
kautau@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I think they do in the enterprise hosting / software dev world, which is the reason for so much effort being poured into WSL, but for standard client applications or the “average user” switching to Linux I agree
vin@lemmynsfw.com 2 months ago
Very true because the relationship they have with laptop manufacturers will ensure windows domination
woelkchen@lemmy.world 2 months ago
proceed in some way that will break compatibility
That’s what new major versions are for.
octopus_ink@lemmy.ml 2 months ago
I can’t help but think that Microsoft has decided to proceed in some way that will break compatibility, so they’re done with Mono now.
It’s essentially right there in the article:
Microsoft maintains a modern fork of Mono runtime in the dotnet/runtime repo and has been progressively moving workloads to that fork. That work is now complete, and we recommend that active Mono users and maintainers of Mono-based app frameworks migrate to .NET which includes work from this fork.
We’re done with it, you guys can take the scraps. By the way, ours is better and folks should move to it.
auzy@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Jeezus. Microsoft can’t do anything without people talking crap about them 😂
Wooki@lemmy.world 2 months ago
It’s almost like they have a terrible track history and hold the gold medal for antitrust and enshitification.
octopus_ink@lemmy.ml 2 months ago
It’s almost like they have a terrible track history and hold the gold medal for antitrust and enshitification.
To be fair, there is a young up and comer in that space.
CynicusRex@slrpnk.net 2 months ago
If someone evades billions in taxes but one day donates 50 dollars it doesn’t absolve their wrongdoings whatsoever. This is just an attempt at trying to improve their image.
auzy@lemmy.world 2 months ago
It doesn’t mean there is some evil plan either 😂
auzy@lemmy.world 2 months ago
In my experience, generally the most vocal contribute the least lol
Croquette@sh.itjust.works 2 months ago
No corpos does something for the good of the people. It just so happen that this particular thing does.
Behind every move, there is a price tag attached to it.
By doing that, Microsoft is trying to get good PR.
BarbecueCowboy@lemmy.world 2 months ago
You’re not wrong, but if we want companies to keep doing things for good PR, we need to reward them for it.
They’re basically giant badly trained dogs that happen to control every aspect of our lives.
auzy@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Do you think they’re going to ask for this one back? 😂
Whatever it is, it benefits the community.
What price tag do you think is attached to this one?
Things can be beneficial to both parties… Not everything corporations do need to screw someone else 😂
sep@lemmy.world 2 months ago
People have experience.
InternetUser2012@lemmy.today 2 months ago
Because they’re crap. Pretty obvious right?
auzy@lemmy.world 2 months ago
How does this help open source?
I’m not sure how the community has grown to be so toxic recently that it becomes risky to release a product as open source, and we’re losing opportunities. This has huge benefits to projects like wine
Are you guys suggesting they should retract the offer and close source everything?
interdimensionalmeme@lemmy.ml 2 months ago
Nobody forced them to be ruthless monsters and monopolize computers for 40 years.
reksas@sopuli.xyz 2 months ago
They have burned their good will and trust long ago
EnderMB@lemmy.world 2 months ago
It’s embarrassing at times, much like it was almost two decades ago when Slashdot used to shit on “Micro$oft” for everything. Lemmy also has a tendency to be emotional to tech news rather than factual, so there’s that too.
Pretty much every tech company is shit in some way, but it’s not productive to call it out everywhere. This is a good thing.
auzy@lemmy.world 2 months ago
What people don’t realize, is that Miguel de Icaza actually started gnome and mono.
Xamarin got acquired by Microsoft.
I’m so tired of watching the community crap on every company which donates open source (I’ve been watching for 25 years at least now). Even Redhat which basically is a major factor to the survival of Linux is getting crapped on. Systemd developers, etc.
If people are genuinely interested in Linux growing, they need a positive community. Because developers like myself mostly stopped providing free code (as a hobbyist developer) because whilst finding help is difficult, it’s not hard to find people willing to abuse you and your projects unfortunately
Even the VLC developers can’t escape the abuse
diviledabit@lemmy.world 2 months ago
As the great philosopher and poet, George Bush, said:
Fool me once can’t get fooled again!
96VXb9ktTjFnRi@feddit.nl 2 months ago
This made me look up the wikipedia page on Bushism and I must say it’s beautiful! Thanks :)
BilboBargains@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Microsoft is cancer but then so much of tech is going that way. We shouldn’t lose sight of small victories, this is a good result. The EU is enforcing more openness and transparency in the sector. These are the type of changes we need.
funn@lemy.lol 2 months ago
What’s the twist? There must be some reason.
lily33@lemm.ee 2 months ago
I guess it’s simply the framing: You don’t ‘donate’ open source projects. Is simply a case of a new organisation taking over a stalled project.
twinnie@feddit.uk 2 months ago
Most of the time a company does something like this they would just let it die. It’s good that Microsoft have at least made the effort to hand it over to a team who’s willing to keep it going.
joyjoy@lemm.ee 2 months ago
So it’s like “gifting” someone a puppy.
woelkchen@lemmy.world 2 months ago
What’s the twist? There must be some reason.
.NET runs natively on Linux since quite some time. Honestly, I don’t get what Mono is even good for these days. Maybe reverse engineering old .NET versions.
chaospatterns@lemmy.world 2 months ago
.net core is the future but Mono is still important for running legacy .net framework applications like ones that use WinForms or WPF. That’s pretty much it. Anything new should go straight to .net core.
lemann@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 months ago
.NET runs natively on Linux
Only
.NET CoresadlyWhen I moved my personal laptop to Linux I needed WINE to run some source-available .NET apps that were written targeting the Windows-only
.NET FrameworkNekkoDroid@programming.dev 2 months ago
IIRC Mono was mostly used for WASM as it was optimized for smaller builds than the full fat CoreCLR
MajinBlayze@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Probably simply that they are done with it (mono specifically, and possibly .net framework in the long run)
kevindqc@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I would be extremely surprised if they are planning to abandon .NET
cyborganism@lemmy.ca 2 months ago
Cost cutting.
thesmokingman@programming.dev 2 months ago
Microsoft has had dotnet-core for awhile. If you are running production dotnet loads (eg a C# app), you’ve probably been using those Linux containers for awhile. This doesn’t surprise me; they usually aren’t interested in maintaining an open version of software they have more restrictive licenses for. Enterprises will continue to use dotnet-core and Microsoft will probably do something to shoot mono in the foot in a few years.
neclimdul@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Read the headline and thought “there’s a catch…”
Finally got around to reading the post and Microsoft is very politely saying “we’ve completed stealing their shit now. Don’t know why anyone would want it, use ours now. You can have it though.”
Thanks I guess? I’m glad it’s out of their hands now and with an open source group that cares and can make a difference.
TheEighthDoctor@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Now give us DirectX on Linux
Cosmicomical@lemmy.world 2 months ago
That’s a good.way to burden a competitor with a huge project.
madjo@feddit.nl 2 months ago
Beware of Microsoft bearing gifts…
DaddleDew@lemmy.world 2 months ago
That’s extremely uncharacteristic. Are they trying to prepare for an antitrust probe?
n3cr0@lemmy.world 2 months ago
.Net sucks, compared to mono. The compiler is slower, filesize after optimization is still higher and the character set in cli is far more limited when I compile an app with .Net.
bitwolf@lemmy.one 2 months ago
So they forked, gave mono away and asked that everyone use their fork?
It seems like they’re hoping to gain a significant chunk of the mono community directly into .net.
That could be good or bad I suppose.
extremeboredom@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Extend, Embrace, Extinguish?
demizerone@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Remember back in 2008 when people were losing their shit if someone created a mono app on Linux? Miguel remembers.
UnbalancedFox@lemmy.ca 2 months ago
Someone on that page commented:
“It was always open source. They just bought the company who created* and maintained, it, moved the devs over to their own fork and closed down the original, graciously allowing the wine team to maintain their own fork of the old code, as if they needed a permission, lol. It’s a good PR move (also for Wine, mind you) but nothing else.”
gofsckyourself@lemmy.world 2 months ago
FYI - the owner of this site, gamingonlinux, was a mod on the linux_gaming@lemmy.ml community until they were caught abusing their moderator powers. Then they deleted their account and complained on mastodon that it’s stupid design that mod logs are public.
Gsus4@mander.xyz 2 months ago
That’s one of the things I love in lemmy. Transparency of moderation.
orgrinrt@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I’m boosting this and the screenshots too, but just thought I’d point out for quick scrollers that it does not seem as dramatic as this comment initially lets you believe.
I mean it’s awkward, but just seems more like your usual social awkwardness/incompetence than malicious behavior as such.
gofsckyourself@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I agree that the main interaction was mild, but if they were willing to go this far to try to hide this, then that shows how low the bar is for them to try to manipulate things to their favor and liking with the trust that was given them as a moderator.
mods_mum@lemmy.today 2 months ago
Look at the screenshots few comments down. That was a shitty mod. They can have those back at reddit.
Roflmasterbigpimp@lemmy.world 2 months ago
lemmy.ml doing .ml-things
croizat@lemmy.ml 2 months ago
What does this comment mean. No other communities have bad moderators?
JTskulk@lemmy.world 2 months ago
Fuck that guy.
myersguy@lemmy.simpl.website 2 months ago
Do you have any sources for this?
gofsckyourself@lemmy.world 2 months ago
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interdimensionalmeme@lemmy.ml 2 months ago
All moderators should be assumed to be abusers. Acab
echodot@feddit.uk 2 months ago
Well yeah that’s why the mod log is public. It’s a feature not a bug
uzay@infosec.pub 2 months ago
You seem very hurt about that one interaction you had with him months ago. If you’re gonna comment that under every gamingonlinux article you’ll have a lot to do.
gofsckyourself@lemmy.world 2 months ago
It has nothing to do with “being hurt”. They showed the kind of scummy person they are.
They showed that if they were willing to go this far to try to hide this, then that shows how low the bar is for them to try to manipulate things to their favor and liking with the trust that was given them as a moderator.
I don’t like the idea of that kind of person reaping the benefits of their site being linked to on the platform they tried to manipulate.
I don’t like the idea of people not facing the consequences of these kinds of actions.
I think people should know who this person is, since they showed their true self and then tried to hide it.
11111one11111@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I’d rather have that than have moderators bringing their shitty reddit leftover mentalities and think they can throw tantrums anytime someone critiques their post title. I mean homie was a moderator, who quit the site entirely as his reaction to the same interaction you are criticizing homie here for his reaction after bringing up a relevant commentary about the individual from the post.
x00z@lemmy.world 2 months ago
I really dislike that guy. I was interested in his website but lost interest because of him. I already forgot why I started disliking him. But this just adds to that.