Inside the 'arms race' between YouTube and ad blockers / Against all odds, open source hackers keep outfoxing one of the wealthiest companies.

Comments

• Lophostemon@aussie.zone ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  You know… in all my time upon this earth, I cannot look back and think of a single instance where I thought: “Gosh, this advertisement which has inserted itself in between me and the desired content has actually made me want to go purchase that product.”

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  • nous@programming.dev ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Ads are effective, sadly. And why so much money is poured into them. I believe there are a few effects at play but the direct, see and ad and want to go buy it now is only one ofbhem that mostly only affects some people, or a lot of people occasionally.

    I think a bigger effect is familiarity. You are far more likely to pick a product you are familiar with or have seen before over something younjave never heard of. Even if you have only ever seen it on advets and completely forgotten that you have ever seen ads for it. So even if you don’t think they work on you they likely do without you realizing, at least enough of the time on enough people that make them worth while running.

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    • evatronic@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I think a bigger effect is familiarity.

      Bingo. It’s not about making you buy something right now, it’s about brand recognition and such.

      To wit, if you listen to podcasts, do a little thought experiment. Name a VPN company.

      Was it “Nord VPN”? Ads work.

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    • uzay@infosec.pub ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      These subconscious effects are indeed the most effective ways for an ad to work. However, if an ad is obnoxious enough for you to remember, it can get you to actively avoid the advertised product as well.

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    • vamputer@infosec.pub ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Yeah, I like to think I’m immune to advertising until I see one that makes me think “damn, I haven’t had Burger Restaurant in a while.” The worst part is that I’m fully cognizant of what’s happening, and yet I still want some and it’ll make me think about it for a while afterward.

      But, joke’s on you, Burger Restaurant! I’m fucking broke, son! Now we’re BOTH having our time wasted

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    • rottingleaf@lemmy.zip ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Well, things affecting you unconsciously should be plain illegal. Though that’s how ads are supposed to work since like 50s and earlier, and I think I remember a Colombo episode where what you said is mentioned.

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  • Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Ads work. These companies wouldn’t spend millions in them otherwise. Consumer behavior is among the most studied psychological phenomenoms in the world. If you show an ad to one person it’s near impossible to tell if it had an effect or not but show it to a thousand people and you’ll see it.

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  • Mettigel@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    That’s not how ads work.

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  • TrickDacy@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Yeah I feel mostly this way too, but the data is solid, ads are effective. Even on me, very rarely. And I’m the type of person who doesn’t ever click ads, out of spite. Even if it’s exactly what I was already looking to actively buy. But every now and then they give me an idea that I pop open a new tab, research, and then buy.

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  • AnonStoleMyPants@sopuli.xyz ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    That’s not really how they work, or that is not the only way. Their point is to put the logo, slogans, company etc into your memory. This way when you’re shopping for something specific, then the brand pops out to you because you’ve seen it and it gives you a sense of familiarity and hence, higher trust.

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  • Tattorack@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Likewise. I don’t think I’ve ever been moved or compelled to buy, check out, or even pay attention to a YouTube ad.

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  • PrinzMegahertz@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    To be honest, I once fell victim on reddit to an add that promoted AFK-Arena. It turned out to actually be a decent game.

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  • helenslunch@feddit.nl ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    You are not the target market. Advertising is a massive industry for good reason. It works. I know because I own a business and brand name recognition is everything. When people buy things they most often do any research, they just think of the first thing that comes to their head and that’s usually what they buy. Or the first thing that comes up in their product search.

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• Sprokes@jlai.lu ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  At least one popular ad blocker, AdBlock Plus, won’t be trying to get around YouTube’s wall at all. Vergard Johnsen, chief product officer at AdBlock Plus developer eyeo, said he respects YouTube’s decision to start “a conversation” with users about how content gets monetized.

  Shitty AdBlock Plus.

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  • gaylord_fartmaster@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    ABP has always been a shitty adblocker because it’s meant to make money rather than actually block ads effectively. They’ve been accepting money from ad networks to allow their “unintrusive ads” (an oxymoron) for over a decade now, and I’m sure Google is paying for this to happen now.

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    • Kiernian@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      shrug

      I’m okay with unobtrusive ads as long as the place serving them up has a modicum of common sense sensibilities about their impact and has a rigorous enough vetting process that they’ll never be used as payloads for malicious software. Ads can be a way to find out about products I might otherwise never know about. I’m not outright against all ads as a concept. Hell, sometimes it’s an actual art form in rare cases.

      I’m just against them taking up more space than the content itself, impeding my access to the content in any way, hijacking my property, or getting hijacked by malware which then hijacks my property.

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  • starman@programming.dev ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    AdBlock Minus

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    • pirat@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      AdBlock Divided by Zero

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  • BallsInTheShredder@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    An Adblocker allowing ads to… start a conversation that’s already been had and over for decades at this point.

    People don’t like intrusive ads. Give intrusive ads and we’ll always find ways around them. It’s a story as old as the internet. Google is no exception. You may have billions of dollars and thousands of employees but nearly everyone in the damned world hates ads. You can try to fight it all you want. The only reason that nearly anyone puts up with ads is they want to support the creator or don’t yet know they can avoid the ads. Even those supporting the creators don’t like the damned things.

    I’ve seen so, so many people watching ads on their phones

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• gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  And I am fucking loving it. With this move, Google has effectively started an arms race between the team they have implementing this Adblock-blocking crap and the vast majority of the technically competent internet users in the world.

  Unless the rules of how the internet works fundamentally change, Google is not going to win.

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  • ultra@feddit.ro ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Why do you think they were pushing so hard for WEI? They did try to fundamentally change how the internet works.

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    • dXq9dwg4zt@lemmings.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Precisely.

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  • affiliate@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    i wouldn’t be surprised if this was partly a war between the team they have implementing this and the team they have implementing this, in their spare time

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  • r3df0x@7.62x54r.ru ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I’m not that optimistic. They could implement some sort of aggressive DRM. In the US, all they have to do is label protection as DRM and then it becomes illegal to even have any discussion of how to circumvent it. The overwhelming majority of users aren’t going to bother with any ad blocking. In the end, this could end up hurting Google if people build decentralized Youtube alternatives and then they could take viewers away from Youtube.

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    • Adalast@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      They would end up shooting themselves in the foot. They are on shaky ground already and it would only take a new platform that can entice a few of their top content producers over to lose enough chunks of their revenues to hurt. And all they have do is keep fucking around to find out what a tech-literate group of nerds who hate big corps can do when they are aligned in a certain direction.

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    • AceFuzzLord@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Well, in the US you can legally talk about it so long as you do not actually do it. It’s similar to how an actor is able to talk about commiting murder without getting in trouble.

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• clara@feddit.uk ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  the “open source hackers” are always going to win this one, for a simple reason. if the data of the youtube video is handed to a user at any point, then the information it contains can be scrubbed and cleaned of ads. no exceptions.

  if google somehow solves all ad-blocking techniques within browser, then new plugins will be developed on the operating system side to put a black square of pixels and selectively mute audio over the advert each time. if they solve that too? then people will hack the display signal going out at the graphics card level so that it is cleaned before it hits the monitor. if they beat that using some stupid encryption trick? well, then people will develop usb plugin tools that physically plug into the monitors at the display end, that artificially add the black boxes and audio mutes at the monitor display side.

  if they beat that? someone, someone will jerry rig a literal black square of paper on some servos and wires, and physical audio switch to do the same thing, an actual, physical advert blocker. i’m sure once someone works that out, a mass produced version would be quite popular as a monitor attachment (in a timeline that gets so fucked that we would need this).

  if that doesn’t work? like, google starts coding malware to seek and destroy physical adblockers? then close your eyes and mute your headphones for 30 seconds, lol. the only way google is solving that one is with hitsquads and armed drones to make viewers RESUME VIEWING

  as long as a youtube video is available to access without restriction, then google cannot dictate how the consumer experiences that video. google cannot win this.

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  • badbytes@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    It’s how we did it with MythTV and over the air or cable tv. The algorithms will just save a file in post, that has the ads removed. And that was 15yrs ago.

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    • viperex@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I don’t see how we escape ads if YouTube splits the video in two and ads play on a third of the screen alongside the video. Or in a chiron

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  • UlrikHD@programming.dev ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    And if Google went nuclear and starts embedding the ad into the videos themselves?

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    • clara@feddit.uk ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      the current solution for that would be similar to the current “sponsor block” plugins, here’s an example

      crowdsourced start and endpoints for embedded sponsorships

      something like this tool, but for future embedded google adverts

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    • rottingleaf@lemmy.zip ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      All other hope forlorn, there’s still ML to recognize and cut out ads.

      Or one can download the same video with as many as possible metrics different, so that ads would be different, and then compare the two videos. Ugh.

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  • Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    This type of war happened 15 years ago with Hulu vs Xbox. Hulu won because despite there always being an exploit it was always several days before a work around was uploaded. Eventually it was Hulu on xbmx for 1 day, then 3 days no Hulu on an on until everyone gave up.

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• Laticauda@lemmy.ca ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  “against all odds” lmao what. Anyone who’s been paying attention since the dawn of the internet would know that youtube isn’t winning this one. The odds were 100% in the favour of the hackers.

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• crackajack@reddthat.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  To ad blockers, thank you for your service!

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• prole@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Against all odds

  lol someone hasn’t been paying attention to how this stuff generally works…

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• InEnduringGrowStrong@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  What Google seems to forget or simply not care about is I can always just… leave.
  I used reddit a lot more than I use YouTube.
  If enough viewers and content creators were to jump ship, they’d scramble to change their tune.

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  • tb_@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    That’s a big if though. Unless an actual creator-exodus happens, it’s not going to happen.

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    • Excrubulent@slrpnk.net ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      It will happen eventually. These kinds of adversarial arrangements between parties are inherently unstable. The enshittification cycle only ends when a site properly collapses. If you think they couldn’t get shittier, give it time. They’ll find a way.

      All we need is for a good alternative to become more viable and for the site to have a few more exodus events and it’ll lose its critical mass. Untimately I think most platforms are going to have to become federated, it’s the only way to avoid enshittification and still grow the network. Growing the network is important because it is the size of youtube and other centralised sites’ networks that gives them their stability and utility. It’s the network effect.

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    • InEnduringGrowStrong@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I don’t disagree with you, I’m just saying that YouTube is nothing without both its creator and viewers.
      A viewer-exodus and a creator-exodus would be tied together, they both feedback into each other.

      I even get why YouTube doubledown on catering to their advertisers over the creators and viewers, that’s just money talking.
      I’m just saying I don’t owe them my time or attention.
      They would hardly be the first Internet giant to fall, thinking they’re too big to fail, not that I see it happening soon though.

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  • _pete_@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I went through a period of de-googling a couple of years ago. Swapping browser, mobile os, search engine, storage, maps, music, video purchases, voice assistant and even email service was relatively simple, there are alternatives out there which do the job just as well if not better than what Google offer.

    The only exception is YouTube, yea there are individual sites that occasionally offer some of the videos I want (often with a subscription attached), there are some federated systems like NewPipe which have some videos but there is no one offering remotely the quantity or quality of what you can get on YouTube for free.

    As the article states, it’s basically a monopoly at this point without a viable alternative.

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    • JackGreenEarth@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      What FOSS mobile OS are you using?

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    • cleverusernametry@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      What are you using instead for Maps and email?

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  • LemmyIsFantastic@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Not going to happen. Most of us, and the ones making the service profitable pay.

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  • takeda@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Exactly, I had people tell me that we should support YouTube, because it costs money and if we don’t it will disappear.

    I would celebrate the day it would happen, YouTube is actually the reason we don’t have much competition there. They used their position and Google monopoly in other areas to establish this monopoly.

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    • wheelie@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      There’s creators out there running a non YouTube channel in parallel, mostly on Odysee. Good to see an alternative out there.

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  • nous@programming.dev ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    That is and big if though. Yeah you, me and half the people here might leave over this, but we block ads already and so are not highly valued to YouTube or a lot of the creators and are only a small drop in the ocean of viewers.

    YouTube is betting on more people turning off ad blockers then those that leave. And i am glad to see that it might be having a small effect on more people actually discovering ad blockers instead. Which I bet is something YouTube did not expect to see.

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    • SoylentBlake@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      No one in the 90s could imagine the internet without AOL or Yahoo either, and yet…

      Or the great Myspace collapse of 2008. Digg before that. Tumbler most recently.

      Big sites go boom fairly often.

      Now, watching Google go Boom, that’s gonna be like modules breaking loose of the ISS and rendering the atmosphere. Drawn out over months, as one wing goes, government breaks up another wing, class action lawsuits bankrupt another wing.

      Alphabets circling the drawn. And good. Fuck em. Fuck Apple, Fuck Meta, Fuck Amazon, Fuck Reddit.

      Just a couple more years now and imma nominate Craig from Craigslist for all the years nobel prizes for officially winning the internet.

      Specific niche forums, Craigslist and Wikipedia are the last bits of honestness and fun online. And ymmv with Craigslist people being honest.

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  • Sowhatever@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Why would creators leave? They only earn money from users that watch ads or use premium. Ad blocker users leaving doesn’t affect them.

    And if you “just leave”, guess what? You just saved them a few bucks in bandwidth. It’s a win-win for them.

    It’s YouTube, they don’t need “exposure”. They are out to make a profit.

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    • Rin@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I donate to creators I like.

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• RanchOnPancakes@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Never under estimate the outrage of a nerd.

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  • Smokeydope@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Image

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  • aeronmelon@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    They even made a series of movies about it.

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• aeronmelon@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I remember the mini-war between AOL and third-party IM clients. There were days where AOL would send 15kB patches to AIM multiple times a day to break compatibility with the other apps. And they would then fix it within hours.

  In the end, AOL gave up.

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  • killeronthecorner@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Wow that’s full on antitrust surely? Or was this before the regulatory precedents were set for Internet providers?

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    • aeronmelon@lemm.ee ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Well, not really.

      So AIM was built on an existing chat protocol called OSCAR. The same protocol used in other services. So people eventually figured out how to make chat clients that could log into many different IM services on one app.

      This was not sanctioned by AOL, but they allowed it at first. Then they decided you HAVE to use the official AIM client to talk to people on AIM. The third-party developers ignored AOL, so they entered into a tug-a-war match for a while.

      Because AOL was using known software to make AIM work, there was only so much they could do to keep their client working while also blocking everyone else. Eventually it became too much of a hassle, so AOL relented and third-party clients kept working until the service was shutdown.

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• Ookami38@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  “against all odds” my left asshole. This is always the way of hacker vs defense, it’s always an arms race and the attacking side always has the advantage.

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  • dosaki@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    How many assholes do you have?

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    • Dempf@lemmy.zip ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      A left one and a right one.

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  • RazorsLedge@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Not really. There are lots of protocols and such that haven’t been broken in any meaningful ways. Attackers have advantage is a weird thing to say.

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    • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Defense is always playing reactive. Attack gets to be creative and figure out how to break whatever tools defense has. Defense has to wait until the vulnerability is found and then deal with it. It’s the nature of the arms race with regards to cyber security.

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• Synthead@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  YouTube’s users when they adhere to the YouTube TOS:

  Image

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  • SpiderShoeCult@sopuli.xyz ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    quoth Rage Against The Machine:

    ‘fuck you, I won’t do what you tell me’

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• dannym@lemmy.escapebigtech.info ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Against all odds, open source hackers keep outfoxing one of the wealthiest companies.

  sigh developers will ALWAYS be able to outsmart companies stealing from others.

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  • zalgotext@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I was gonna say, the Internet wouldn’t be what it is today without those so-called open source hackers. They’re the giants that Google and all the rest are standing on the shoulders of.

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    • zbyte64@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      We’re going to relearn this lesson with LLMs. Open source is a maximalist approach to productivity.

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• ItsMeSpez@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Meshkov said that assessment [that scriptlet injection is the only reliable method of ad blocking for youtbue] is accurate if you limit yourself to browser extensions (which is how most popular ad blockers are distributed). But he pointed to network-level ad blockers and alternative YouTube clients, such as NewPipe, as other approaches that can work.

  How exactly do these youtube front ends survive Google anyways? Why can’t Google simply block all the traffic coming from these front ends in order to kill them off entirely? Kind of interesting that some ad blockers are having a hard time being effective on YT while these front ends seem to be having no issues accessing videos on the site.

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  • Potatos_are_not_friends@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Client side versus server.

    To use a metaphor: the internet is a mailperson, and a YouTube video is a package. The mailperson hands it off to me. Then I have to fumble with opening the box to get the item inside.

    Well, let’s say I have a butler. The butler can take the package from the mailman, and rip out all the unnecessary stuff, and give me what’s inside the box. The butler is adblock.

    YouTube/Google cannot mess with my butler. Why? Because it’s outside of their power. They can try to do things like force a signature before giving me the package. But guess what? My butler can sign off my package. YouTube knows to get to me, they have to go through my butler - period.

    So there’s no “blocking traffic” because once the package is sent, they have to deal with my butler. And they can make all sorts of detectors on the package, but we’ll keep finding ways to bypass it and convince the package that my butler can totally sign for me.

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• Marin_Rider@aussie.zone ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  my wife watches a lot of youtube via PS4, so ads aren’t blockable. but she discovered when an ad starts playing if you go to the ‘i’ icon, select you don’t want to see this ad, then click resume video, the video starts playing again. not exactly a blocker and requires those manual steps, but beats watching 30 second unskippable ads every 5 minutes

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• grue@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Anybody who thinks this is “against all odds” doesn’t understand the Internet very well.

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• Daft_ish@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Another day and another opportunity to say. Stop using youtube. Thankyou, and goodnight.

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• RisingSwell@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Against all odds? This is a game that’s been going on for year, hacker vs Corp, and the hacker always wins. Same shit as anticheat in games, it’s a constant arms race but the hacker is nearly always a step ahead.

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• Vilian@lemmy.ca ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  “opensource hackers” lol

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• Yoz@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Open source Hackers FTW!

  Please donate and keep Open Source as it is

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• MonkderZweite@feddit.ch ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  $ mpv best youtube adblocker.

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• Karyoplasma@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I would argue it’s not “against all odds”. The add-on devs probably know better how YouTube is working than the bunch of underpaid, outsourced script writers that are tasked to implement the stuff. The latter also have to make sure that it doesn’t break for legitimate viewers (oh, sorry, I meant “impressions”).

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• Banana_man@reddthat.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  To me it seems weird that YouTuber is doing this at all. They should know that they can’t win, I doubt their CEO is that incompetent. Especially after all this time of wasted effort on their side to overpower a very small fraction of users who actually block ads online. Could it be to draw attention from something else that’s actually more worrying?

  Because as an AdBlock user, since I bothered configuring them and using only ublock I haven’t had almost any popups and my experience, especially now on the later stages, is exactly like it was before the ban.

  I can’t help but think there’s more to this because they can’t be wasting resources, further damage their reputation and risk absolute monopoly on video platforms for a fruitless endeavor.

  Even if YouTube isn’t profitable by itself, which, given the user data harvesting and the ads I definitely doubt, google still is. I’d appreciate any takes on this because it’s been bugging me for a while now.

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• TheLobotomist@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  A question for the tech savy, free alternatives to youtube like newpipe relies on youtube servers to access content, right? I mean, if youtube were to disappear magically we wouldn’t have a palce where to upload and store so many Gb of videos?

  Am I missing something (I know I’m probably missing a lot!)? Thanks in advance for the replies!

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• rayyy@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Youtube is vying X for a internet death while holding the door open for a less greedy rival

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• RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Could Google and ad services sue Firefox and extension writers?

  I mean, nothing pisses off corporations more than someone coming between them and revenue, and the courts tend to agree.

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• victorz@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I always wondered why YouTube doesn’t stream the ad intermixed into the video? Like, it’s DASH, right? How does that work, can’t the server send a video then switch to another stream source (the ad) and back?

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• ModernRisk@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Got this too couple of times, all I did was F5 and go on with my day. Nothing happened.

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• Slagathor@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Serious question: what is the best add blocker right now? I’ve been using ublock origin, but it doesn’t seem to be working that well these days.

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• LemmyIsFantastic@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Lololol it’s been like 2 weeks.

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