cross-posted from: programming.dev/post/36378173
Comments
- Hackernews.
I’d prefer an AMD 9000 series because I refuse to support Nvidia, but the upgradability is still an amazing achievement. I’m glad to see Framework delivering.
Framework unveils a second-generation Framework Laptop 16 with a swappable Nvidia RTX 5070 GPU, an industry first, shipping in November 2025
Submitted 15 hours ago by Pro@programming.dev to technology@lemmy.world
https://frame.work/ro/en/blog/introducing-the-new-framework-laptop-16-with-nvidia
Comments
BlameTheAntifa@lemmy.world 9 hours ago
AlexisFR@jlai.lu 4 hours ago
It could help if AMD still manufactured discrete mobile GPUs.
tempest@lemmy.ca 42 minutes ago
Most people don’t need them. The gaming and workstation laptop market is smaller than ever. The integrated graphics has been “good enough” for a while now.
bassomitron@lemmy.world 8 hours ago
Out of curiosity, why do you refuse to support Nvidia? AMD isn’t some saint, they’re a shitty corporation just like Nvidia. They got lucky when Jim Keller saved their asses with the Ryzen architecture in the mid-2010s. They haven’t really innovated a god damn thing since then and it shows.
amorpheus@lemmy.world 7 hours ago
they’re a shitty corporation just like Nvidia
Neither of them are anyone’s friend, but claiming they’re the same level of nasty is a bit of a stretch.
domi@lemmy.secnd.me 6 hours ago
Besides what was mentioned below, it’s not about making competitive products but about Nvidia being an absolute asshole since the 2000s and they got even worse ever since the crypto and AI craze started. AMD and Nvidia are both corporations but they are not even playing the same game when it comes to being anti-competitive.
There’s a reason why Wikipedia has a controversies section on Nvidia: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nvidia#Controversies
That list is far from exhaustive. There’s so much more about Nvidia that you should remember vividly if you were a PC gamer in the 2000s and 2010s with an AMD GPU, like:
- When they pushed developers to use an unecessary amount of tesselation because they knew tesselation performed worse on AMD
- When they pushed their Gameworks framework which heavily gimped AMD GPUs
- When they pushed their PhysX framework which automatically offloaded to CPU on AMD GPUs
- When they disabled their GPUs in their driver when they detected an AMD GPU is also present in the system
- When they were cheating in benchmarks by adding optimizations specific to those benchmarks
- When they shipped an incomplete Vulkan implementation but claimed they are compliant
Nvidia has been gimping gaming performance and visuals since forever for both AMD GPUs and even their own customers and we haven’t even gotten to DLSS and raytracing yet.
I refuse to buy anything Nvidia until they stop abusing their market position at every chance they get.
ElectroLisa@piefed.blahaj.zone 8 hours ago
Not OC but I don't want to deal with Nvidia's proprietary drivers. AMD cards "just work" on Linux
frezik@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 hours ago
Haven’t innovated? 3D chip stacking?
CPU companies generally don’t change their micro-architecture, especially when it works.
MITM0@lemmy.world 5 hours ago
Now if only Framework did that with AMD & Intel GPUs, then we’d all be balling.
Also please make it available in the East
ilinamorato@lemmy.world 3 hours ago
They’ve had AMD for a few years now. No Intel one, but they do sell empty GPU module shells, so maybe someone could cut down a desktop Intel card to fit in one?
chiliedogg@lemmy.world 14 hours ago
The more impressive thing is that they managed to get the Nvidia upgrade to be backwards compatible with existing Framework 16 models.
That’s the push I need to really, truly believe they’re committed to the goal of upgradablity. Too many “mouldular” products have come out where the “upgraded” modules were only available if you bought the newest version of the base product.
In the next year or so, I’ll probably be buying a new laptop, and this has convinced me that Framework is probably the way to go.
AliasVortex@lemmy.world 13 hours ago
I’ve been rocking a Framework 16 for about a year now and would happily recommend it. It’s a bit more upfront, but I love knowing that I can fix or replace just about anything on it (pretty affordably too). It’s just so refreshing to not have to worry about dumb shit like an obscure power adapter or port forcing my laptop into an early retirement.
It’s not the lightest laptop I’ve ever had, but realistically not all that much different from my last gaming laptop. Now that I’m not a full time student anymore I could probably get away with one of the smaller models, but the form factor is pretty nice.
Overall, no major complaints!
SatyrSack@lemmy.sdf.org 13 hours ago
The only downside I have seen is that GSYNC will not work. The newer display supports it, put anyone upgrading an older Framework 16 with the new NVIDIA card will have to buy the screen upgrade as well if they need GSYNC.
halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 12 hours ago
That’s not unexpected. Variable refresh rate (GSYNC and Freesync) has always needed the display to support it first.
carotte@lemmy.blahaj.zone 10 hours ago
i’ve had a framework 13 from a time before there was any other type of framework, and it’s a great laptop honestly. ive yet to do big upgrades, but just being able to repair it myself is awesome. one time i dented the chassis around where the power button was. no worries, just changed the input cover and bam 5 minutes later it’s like new.
my only complaint is that the battery life is atrocious. i heard it’s better (but still not great) on newer models tho
randombullet@programming.dev 5 hours ago
I have a 7840U with a 55HWr battery. I can squeeze out 7 hours. If I’m power using then 5-6 is typical. With the 63WHr battery, you’ll get about 15% more time with it.
SkaveRat@discuss.tchncs.de 9 hours ago
I have two Intel frameworks, and they both suck in regards to battery life
Buuut, I just have a big power bank in my backpack. Gives me at least 1 full charge when I’m on the go. And at home I just have a lighter laptop due to smaller battery
The only thing that pisses me off about framework, is their abysmal software and communication in that regard. It’s basically impossible to get them to acknowledge or fix problems in their firmware
tankplanker@lemmy.world 7 hours ago
Yeah it pushed me to finally put in an order, got to wait till December now as I’m in the third batch.
I wanted to wait till we had proof thst the graphics card would be updatable and a better one would be available as their AMD card is a bit too lightweight for me.
I would rather it had been a better AMD card, I have a 7900 xtx in my desktop, but i will take what I can get at this point, especially as I know I can upgrade later.
SlartyBartFast@sh.itjust.works 1 hour ago
What about SIM slot
tempest@lemmy.ca 47 minutes ago
Presumably a Wan modern could fit in one of those little USB port things.
ABetterTomorrow@sh.itjust.works 4 hours ago
lol industry first? Swappable GTX models were already a thing 10+ years ago. Clevo/Sager chimes in…… “bitch, we did it before you”.
Dremor@lemmy.world 26 minutes ago
Nowhere in the press release and he claim to be an industry first on swappable mobile GPU, and the title imply that the “industry first” is to have a swappable RTX5070M, which may be correct, especially depending on your definition of “swappable”.
notthebees@reddthat.com 1 hour ago
That said, the cooling system is contained in the module. Afaik the mxm modules were just PCBs.
BeardedGingerWonder@feddit.uk 1 hour ago
MXM has been around for 20+ years as far as I know.
notthebees@reddthat.com 1 hour ago
I have a Sony vaio F series laptop from 2000 and it apparently has an mxm ATi Rage Mobility M1. So I can confirm that at least.
any1th3r3@lemmy.ca 9 hours ago
And still no OLED screen… why Framework, why?
I got one of the latest Framework 13 a couple months ago for work, and while I’m happy about the prospects of future repairability and upgradability down the line, it’s not a great laptop given its pricepoint.
The build is subpar, with the screen flexing a ton, the keyboard and trackpad are lacklustre and pretty uncomfortable, but the worst is the screen, it’s dim, with poor colour reproduction and 3:2 is frankly not for me. And fractional scaling is a mess with XWayland, while it was much better on my 2019 XPS 13.I love what Framework are pushing for and actually achieving, but tradeoffs are very much at play. I’m hoping for an OLED screen replacement in the near future though.
Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 hours ago
The good thing: You will probably be able to swap it once they make it available.
YiddishMcSquidish@lemmy.today 21 minutes ago
I really don’t see it happening considering you would likely just be replacing the whole chassis. I see an OLED in the future, just not a swappable one.
AlecSadler@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 hours ago
I’ve yet to use an OLED monitor that didn’t make text look shitty and I’ve used $1000+ OLED displays with high ratings.
Don’t get me wrong, OLED colors and blacks are gorgeous. I love OLED.
Even my Samsung Pro whatever latest laptop with an OLED display…the text just looks off. Which was disappointing because my Samsung phone text is fine.
LG C2/3/4, also gross looking text.
Alienware OLED $750+ monitor? Text was bad.
I love OLED but I’ve yet to find one that works for productivity.
bassomitron@lemmy.world 9 hours ago
Aren’t phone screens AMOLED? I’m definitely not an expert, but I thought it was a variation of OLED, which would explain why text looks better.
That being said, I also have an OLED Steam Deck and I can read text on it just fine if the scaling is set correctly in the game or just browsing the web normally in desktop mode.
firebingo@lemmy.zip 8 hours ago
Almost all OLED displays use a different pixel layout than traditional LCD displays. And sub pixel font rendering is designed for the standard LCD layout. Depending on your OS you may be able to configure the font rendering to look better on most OLEDs. But some people are just more sensitive to this as a problem.
SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
Did you turn on PC-Mode with your LGs?
I use an LG nanocell TV as an pc monitor and the fonts didn’t look good until I set the HDMI input type to PC. And ofcourse you need to play around with the font rendering tools like ClearType in Windows.
any1th3r3@lemmy.ca 8 hours ago
Yep, text is definitely not handled well on most OLED monitors (or TVs) because of their pixel substructure. It’s usually been better on Linux for me and I essentially don’t notice it anymore, but I also haven’t used Windows in years so I can’t compare.
AlexisFR@jlai.lu 4 hours ago
OLED does not belong on a computer.
iopq@lemmy.world 12 hours ago
That’s it, every other gaming laptop is finished. Even though I have the older CPU I can get the newest GPUs now. Nobody can claim that right now. No other company is doing this.
DacoTaco@lemmy.world 7 hours ago
The other laptops arent finished yet. Framework is super expensive , even compares to other gaming laptops.
I think its worth it, but thats not the opinion of a lot of casual people.
And had i not gotten one via my job, i would not have gotten a framework 16 because of the pricewoelkchen@lemmy.world 7 hours ago
Well, the idea is that you can upgrade components without replacing everything, so the initial cost is higher but the long term cost is lower.
That said, they took their time. The 1st generation is old now. The Radeon dGPU is probably weaker or on a similar level than the new Ryzen iGPU. There is no Radeon dGPU upgrade path other than “just use the old one”. They have a better upgrade cadence with the 13 inch model.
Gaja0@lemmy.zip 9 hours ago
So what’s the hivemind consensus fellow lemmings, framework or thinkpad? My brain says lenovo but my heart says
3laws@lemmy.world 8 hours ago
There is no Thinkpad as repairable as the framework and if they are (they’re not) the price is out of Reich for individuals since she p51 with LCAMM2 targets enterprise costumers.
Your brain is wrong on this one. Follow your heart
kittenzrulz123@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 hours ago
Framework is more repairable but Thinkpads simply have superior build quality with less issues.
ilinamorato@lemmy.world 3 hours ago
My experience with Framework is exactly one unit, but I would disagree with this. The Thinkpads I’ve used all felt more plastic-y and less sturdy than my Framework. The keyboard did feel cheaper until I wore the powdery feel off of the keycaps, at which point it felt amazing.
Emma_Gold_Man@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 hours ago
Thinkpads are not what they once were. I finally gave up on them, moved over to a Framework, and haven’t regretted it.
Yoshi@futurology.today 8 hours ago
I’d say it depends on your needs and budget Framework has a higher build Quality and a bit loser prices but if this isn’t a Problem for you, go for it. Great repairability and replacebility is awesome!
umbrella@lemmy.ml 8 hours ago
that’s a good looking computer
ObsidianZed@lemmy.world 9 hours ago
*caresses screen*
some day…
etchinghillside@reddthat.com 15 hours ago
Which part is industry first?
candyman337@lemmy.world 15 hours ago
Nvidia is really cagey about what the let vendors do with their gpus, they had one hot swappable concept years ago and it never went anywhere because they basically didn’t allow them to do anything with it. So this actually making it I to a product is crazy
potustheplant@feddit.nl 10 hours ago
Afaik, the gpu is swappable, not hot-swappable and modular nvidia gpus are not a new things. Older gaming laptops used to have the gpu as a daughter board.
Pro@programming.dev 15 hours ago
swappable Nvidia RTX 5070 GPU
Dudewitbow@lemmy.zip 15 hours ago
the title is sensationaliat, as the gpu part has been done before (mxm gpus)
the only induatry first off the top pf my head is the 240w usb c epr charger for a laptop
notthebees@reddthat.com 1 hour ago
Only argument I could make is that this is the first gpu module that has a self contained cooling system. Older mxm cards were just the PCB.
Theoriginalthon@lemmy.world 14 hours ago
Industry first to use this specific part in this specific way
NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 13 hours ago
Framework is partially owned by Linus Media Group.
They got their PR game on lock.
iopq@lemmy.world 12 hours ago
Yeah if the newest GPU fit your laptop! But it never really worked well
Bluewing@lemmy.world 2 hours ago
Now if I could only afford a Framework…