Mark my words.
For many of us, this is a “No shit Sherlock” moment.
But in 10 years, we will have young people going “Uh what really?”
Remember when we used to say, “Don’t put your name on the internet?” And now it’s everywhere?
Don’t ever hand your phone to the cops
Submitted 1 month ago by Amicitas@lemmy.world to technology@lemmy.world
https://www.theverge.com/2024/9/24/24252235/police-unlock-phone-password-face-id-apple-wallet-id
Comments
ByteOnBikes@slrpnk.net 1 month ago
BruceTwarzen@lemm.ee 1 month ago
That was like the biggest thing i learned in computer class, that i already knew in 2002 or so. Later myspace became a thing, and everyone had a myspace name. Then facebook and some people used their real name. Then facebook asked you for your phone number, and i thought: well, that’s silly, who in their right mind would do that. Turns out the answer is everyone.
Petter1@lemm.ee 1 month ago
They even give them all phone numbers from all of their contacts linked to real name (even those who don’t have whatsapp) What a database…
buddascrayon@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Remember when we used to say, “Don’t put your name on the internet?” And now it’s everywhere?
Mine isn’t, go ahead and look it up. You won’t find my name anywhere in the internet.
Here it is encrypted so only you can read it: >!John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmidt!<
ByteOnBikes@slrpnk.net 1 month ago
Hey what the heck? How did you get my Lemmy password?
Syd@lemm.ee 1 month ago
Woah that’s my name too
Prok@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Hey! That’s my name too!
Phoenicianpirate@lemm.ee 1 month ago
Yeah I remember the early days of the internet when no one used their real name and we had relationships with dozens of people who we had no idea where they lived and what their real names were.
It seems quaint, but I kinda liked it like that.
TriflingToad@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Its still like that on discord. Have no idea what one of my closest friends name is, but he really loves opossums and Minecraft!
ripcord@lemmy.world 1 month ago
I don’t see what the difference would be in 10 years.
I don’t think 90% of people, especially “young people” would avoid doing this already. It’s already a major awareness/compliance issue, and not at all a “no shit sherlock” moment.
But what did you have in mind that will be different in 10 years? Paricularly for young people.
Petter1@lemm.ee 1 month ago
I bet I dossed my pseudonym like not even a day after creating 🤣
potatopotato@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
If you absolutely have to hand over your phone, turn it off completely, like hold the power button and then tap the off icon. That will dump any keys out of RAM, which is why it always requires the full password to unlock when you turn it back on. Both in terms of how your phone works and the leaks we’ve seen, the cracking tools the police have are overall significantly less likely to be successful when used on a phone that’s been turned off and not unlocked since.
Also, IIRC iphones have a feature where they will dump at least some of the system keys from RAM if you push the lock button five times. I’d still trust fully off more but that’s easier to do covertly.
ODuffer@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Five times wanted to set off an emergency service call and sound the alarm 🚨 YMMV (Pixel 7)
silico_biomancer@lemmy.nz 1 month ago
I use [KeyMapper(github.com/keymapperorg/KeyMapper) to map “long press of the lock button while screen is locked” to the lockdown/secure lock action
Zementid@feddit.nl 1 month ago
The more comments and news I read about the US the more Orwellian it feels.
You guys really need a massive left-shift away from the omnipresent government which regulates bodies more than companies.
captainlezbian@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Oh sorry instead we’re going to get fascism
SSJMarx@lemm.ee 1 month ago
The whole Western world is at this point, it’s so depressing. Even when the left seems to win democratically people like Macron nakedly abuse their authority and caucus with the fascists over the social democrats.
CaptPretentious@lemmy.world 1 month ago
At some point, someone is going to figure out George Orwell was actually a time traveler, and he tried to fix things with books. He had to deliver the message that way because if he just shouted in the streets the things that were going to happen, he’d been written off as a madman. Change a few details here and there… and then sell it as “fiction”…
SSJMarx@lemm.ee 1 month ago
Frankly, George Orwell is part of the problem. Aside from a brief stint during the Spanish Civil War where he supported the CNT-FAI, he spent the overwhelming majority of his life supporting the British Empire and relentlessly hating Communists of all stripes, to the point where even the British government told him to chill the fuck out because they were allied with the Soviets. His books aren’t immensely popular in extremely right wing countries because they have a left wing critique of government overreach, they’re popular because they are anti-government in exactly the same vague and malleable way that all populist right wingers are.
Squizzy@lemmy.world 1 month ago
I have been to a few spots over there and it is crazy how different culturally it is. Nothing is away from politics and cops get called fot eeeeverything.
LodeMike@lemmy.today 1 month ago
Where do you live?
Zementid@feddit.nl 1 month ago
European Union FTW, Germany specifically where the CCC is a massive counter measure to uneducated politics.
Clent@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Yes. We must know where they live so we can shit on their country to make ourselves feel better.
'Merica!
KingThrillgore@lemmy.ml 1 month ago
DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR PHONE
DO NOT TALK TO POLICE
Your ONLY responses should be to identify yourself, and “I will not make any statements without my lawyer present.”
SynopsisTantilize@lemm.ee 1 month ago
Serious question, what gets you into these situations that you need to safeguard your belongings so hard? I’m asking to understand not to make a shit post thread.
BillMurray@lemmy.world 1 month ago
dudeami0@lemmy.dudeami.win 1 month ago
To add to this, don’t use bio-metrics to lock your devices. Cops will “accidentally” use these to unlock devices when they are forcibly seized.
SolarMonkey@slrpnk.net 1 month ago
Or just know how to enable lockdown mode. On iOS that’s 5 rapid clicks of the power button, screen on or off, and it vibrates to let you know you got it without looking. Dunno what it might be for android, or if it varies by model.
It ends up like a newly rebooted phone; requires a typed passcode.
dudeami0@lemmy.dudeami.win 1 month ago
I personally rather trust that my device isn’t able to be unlocked without my permission, rather than hope I am able to do some action to disable it in certain situations. The availability of such features is nice, but I would assume I would be incapable of performing such actions in the moment.
My other thought is, how guilty is one perceived if they immediately attempt to lock their phones in such a matter, by a jury of their peers? I rather go the deniability route of I didn’t want to share my passcode vs I locked my phone down cause the cops were grabbing me.
Zwiebel@feddit.org 1 month ago
(On Android five clicks on the lock screen makes an emergency call)
Revan343@lemmy.ca 1 month ago
If you reboot your phone, the first unlock can’t use biometrics
Suburbanl3g3nd@lemmings.world 1 month ago
You can also set it up so biometrics can be used by apps but not to unlock the phone. That way it’s easy to get to your apps and such but trivially more difficult to unlock.
Rob200@lemmy.zip 1 month ago
It goes without saying, but I’ll say it.
Don’t use a digital id, nor a digital social security number or anything like it because a cop may run into something incriminating against your on your phone, something as simple as a notification could be enough.
If you just use a physical card/I’d they can only get that specific information and nothing more without looking to look at other sources.
I will say tho, having a digital id as backup might come in handy if you don’t have the physical cards on you, but be responsible about what notifications and images and other data you have accessible on your phone to them.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 1 month ago
All this makes it sound like police are giving you a bunch of time to respond and addressing you politely.
I mean, I agree on the principle. Don’t just hand your phone over to… anyone, really. But the game becomes very different when a guy with a gun is hassling you over it.
Wolf314159@startrek.website 1 month ago
This is why I set up tasker to lockdown my phone under certain conditions, such as: getting disconnected from Bluetooth (like when my phone is separated from me and my watch, my headphones, or the car), getting disconnected from WiFi (like when it’s taken from where it’s supposed to be), getting a slight jolt from the accelerometer (like getting thrown to the ground or even just a swift tap). My phone may get locked down a bunch during day to day stuff, but at least I know it will lockdown automatically when it matters.
Lemonparty@lemm.ee 1 month ago
Pro tip, if you suspect the police are going to take your phone, turn it off. As far as I am aware, finger print and face id do not work on initial startup and they can’t console you to enter your pin without a warrant.
MadBigote@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Better yet: don’t use biometrics. My phone has face recognition for unlocking, but I better stick to a PIN/PASSWORD.
Lemonparty@lemm.ee 1 month ago
Or better yet just don’t use a phone at all! Can’t make you unlock what you don’t have!
Welt@lazysoci.al 1 month ago
*counsel you. I’m picturing a police officer comforting a suspect who’s sobbing with a hand on their shoulder haha.
Lemonparty@lemm.ee 1 month ago
Not counsel, compel actually. But either way, definitely not console! Ha
TheRealKuni@lemmy.world 1 month ago
If you have an iPhone, holding down either volume button and the side button will bring out the Medical ID, slide to power off, Emergency SOS screen. This will also disable FaceID. Password will be required to access the phone now.
LeTak@lemm.ee 1 month ago
Just hold Side button and one of the volume buttons to deactivate biometrics
r0ertel@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Double check this in the state or country you’re in. I recall something from a few years ago where the police could force you to give a swipe pattern and maybe pin since these items are not covered in the same way that a password is.
Maggoty@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Maybe in some countries but in a western one they aren’t getting a pattern or passcode unless you verbally give it to them. We do know though that there is some level of capability to crack phones though.
mako@lemmy.today 1 month ago
How can you be forced to input a pattern/PIN?
yamanii@lemmy.world 1 month ago
How is a pin not a passcode?
UnbalancedFox@lemmy.ca 1 month ago
But aPpLe CaRe AbOuT pRiVaCy
Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Reminder: If you are in a situation where you’re presenting a digital ID to a digital ID reader, do not unlock your phone first. Tap your locked phone on the ID reader, then authenticate the document share.
endofline@lemmy.ca 1 month ago
It’s not possible not to it you want to visit USA. If you don’t, they’ll reject your visa or deny entry. Thr only way is to use brand new cheap android before or after ( after is better ) and resell it once you go back. Most corporations do so
absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz 1 month ago
So the answer is to not visit the US then.
DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 1 month ago
Don’t you want to see our amazing 200 years as a nation and 500 years of massacre sites??!!?
DBT@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Duh.
lol_idk@lemmy.ml 1 month ago
For iOS. You can just hold down the lock and volume up button and it will require your passcode. 5x lock works too but I feel the former is easier.
You can show your wallet with your phone locked. Settings > Face ID & Passcode > Allow access when locked > Wallet
NikkiDimes@lemmy.world 1 month ago
For Android:
Open Settings Search for "Lockdown" Select "Show Lockdown option" from the results, or the result that most resembles that. Enter your pin if required. Tap the associated slider to enable Show lockdown option
Now when you hold your power button, you get a “lockdown” option that forces you to enter your passcode for the next unlock.
Particularly useful for me, as I have my phone set up to always be unlocked if my watch is close enough (maybe stupid of me), but I can force lock it at any time.
Petter1@lemm.ee 1 month ago
They only need to be 500 miles near you, if they pay for the good juicy 2G exploits 😉
TrueStoryBob@lemmy.world 1 month ago
*especially if you’ve got nothing to hide.
ansiz@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Seems like the cops should now be worried about civilian phones exploding and now might consider shooting anyone that tries to hand them a phone /s
etchinghillside@reddthat.com 1 month ago
I know this is obvious – but I also don’t want to have to purchase a printer to print out up to date proof of insurance.
My current plan is to just hand over the old/expired copy. Or I have to go through attempting to remember how to display a card from your Apple Wallet while it remains locked.
Nurse_Robot@lemmy.world 1 month ago
No shit
Mwa@lemm.ee 1 month ago
does this apply to other countries
PrincessLeiasCat@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
I’m sorry if this is a stupid question, but what is the best way to refuse to do this?
Say you’re in xyz situation and a cop demands your phone. You say no. They get angry, maybe make some threats (whether true or not), etc.
What is the best way to say no, you aren’t comfortable, come back with a warrant, etc, without pissing them off royally in such a way that things end up worse for you?
someguy3@lemmy.world 1 month ago
IANAL. This is what they want you to think, “just do this and it’ll be better for you”. It might be a short term hassle waiting for the drug dog, being arrested while they conduct their investigation, but long term it’s the court that matters. And the court will throw out anything obtained illegally or the cops do illegally.
MrVilliam@lemmy.world 1 month ago
This. You have rights, but the police will lie, cheat, and steal their way into getting whatever they want, especially when what they want is for you to waive your rights.
When stopped by the police (in America), you say “I invoke my fifth amendment right to not answer questions and I don’t consent to any searches and seizures. Am I being detained or am I free to go?” That question starts a clock for what is a reasonable amount of time to detain you for their investigation because you’ve made it clear that you’d like to leave as soon as you’re legally allowed to.
As for any kind of force, just stay silent and unthreatening. They’re gonna do what they’re gonna do, and anything you do can be used as rationalization for escalation, which they really seem to fucking love. Be polite when you do choose to speak. Obey lawful commands and let them arrest you if that’s what they’re gonna do. You don’t fight armed thugs in the street, you fight them in court. File complaints and sue when they violate your rights and cause undue harm. Swinging at them or shouting in their face is how you get shot. Let their ego win the moment and then administratively destroy their career and life later on.
I’m also not a lawyer, but this is what any half decent lawyer would tell you to do. Just shut the fuck up (but invoke your right to shut the fuck up or your silence can actually be used against you) and be as passive as possible so your lawyer has a slam dunk case getting your charges dropped and/or suing the everloving fuck out of them, hopefully nullifying their qualified immunity in the process. Nothing you do or say to the police can help you, but it sure as shit will be used against you. Even things you think are innocuous can corroborate that you’re who they’re looking for, so just shut the fuck up.
rtxn@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Important addition: don’t just shut the fuck up.
First, in some jurisdictions, failure to identify is an arrestable offense. Full name, date of birth, relevant cards/papers.
Second, if you need to reach for something, tell the officers so they don’t think you’re about to pull a weapon on them.
Third, explicitly state that you are exercising your fifth amendment rights. Otherwise you might run into an “I want a lawyer, dawg” situation.
helenslunch@feddit.nl 1 month ago
FYI thats illegal (US vs. Rodriguez)
Detained*
PrincessLeiasCat@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
Thank you!
pyre@lemmy.world 1 month ago
try to be as white as possible.
dudeami0@lemmy.dudeami.win 1 month ago
PrincessLeiasCat@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
Never thought about it this way. Thanks!
helenslunch@feddit.nl 1 month ago
You can decline consent without resisting. Just say no. If it’s taken from you illegally then anything they find is inadmissible in court. If it’s taken from you legally, ain’t shit you can do anyway.
colonelp4nic@lemmy.world 1 month ago
I gotchu: m.youtube.com/watch?v=uqo5RYOp4nQ
NaibofTabr@infosec.pub 1 month ago
Q: Is it shut the fuck up Friday?
A: It’s always shut the fuck up Friday.
PrincessLeiasCat@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
Oh man that was fucking hilarious! Thanks for making my night!
copd@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Mobile youtube links, gross
Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Disable biometrics and mention your password.
Android: look up “lockdown mode”
iOS: hold volume down + power, or press power 5 times fast.
wreckedcarzz@lemmy.world 1 month ago
Better: restart the phone. This puts it into the safest state it has, as it has not yet been initially unlocked and will require a non-bio auth. Stronger security, may/should hold if they attempt to attack/hack/compromise it, if it comes to that. Takes like 3 seconds. Do it, not the equal-time-worse-security version of just disabling bio.
Broken@lemmy.ml 1 month ago
Additionally, running GrapheneOS you can set up a duress pin to wipe the phone profiles if things were to escalate.
Being smart, set up the main profile a bit to look real, but have no actual information. That way it’s not obvious tha its been wiped.
Being cheeky, set the duress pin to be something simple like your birthday. So if you are detained/arrested and they try to get into your phone they are the ones to wipe it for you.
brbposting@sh.itjust.works 1 month ago
I imagine something like “I do not consent to a search nor seizure of any of my property. May I reach into my pocket so I may place my phone in plain view? If my property is going to be seized even against my will, I still want to ensure everyone’s safety.”
Then repeat the no consent line as you place your phone on your dashboard or whatever.
I imagine this means your lawyer will have body cam footage of the double nonconsent and the judge will see you were willing to comply even with potentially unlawful orders so he could sort it out in court instead of someone trying to fight it out on the street.
Kalysta@lemm.ee 1 month ago
Do you have a warrant? Then sorry officer I will not hand it over per my fifth amendment right.
From there just say you’re not saying anything else without a lawyer and then just keep demanding a lawyer.
Yes. The cop will get pissed off. But better him mad then you spending years trying to get out of a bogus charge because of some bullshit they found on your phone. Better to be annoying and demand to speak to a lawyer.