Excellent point...

Comments

• Shanmugha@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Have to look deeper. I definitely want to spend thousands of hours playing games created by people with jobs and provided to me by people with jobs, and I don’t mind having a job of my own. But the fact that I am gaming mostly to retain some semblance of sanity indicates something is seriously fucked up

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• ICastFist@programming.dev ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Don’t forget the many, many hours spent weaving simple fabrics and baskets, cutting down and grinding wood and rocks into tools, lifting small wooden houses, fighting off annoying and nasty bugs, the many trips to bring water from a reliable source to the camp, maybe going 1 or 2 days without food because there are no edible plants/fruit around and the hunter party couldn’t get shit. You better not be squeamish about eating just about every part of animals, including brain, tongue, eyes, intestines, lungs, bone marrow.

  Probably little to no seasoning to whatever you happen to eat, either. Salt? Good fucking luck if you’re far from the sea.

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• carrylex@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  “Should we tell them that most of these people got trampled to death by mamoths (or similar) once they were like 30?”

  “Nah just smile and wave”

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• SapphironZA@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  And try not to die from the dodgy meat you were forced to eat, becuase its the only meat you have seen in the past 3 months.

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• teyrnon@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  You forget the hunting part. And caves were a not an all time thing, most had to follow the herds, or move to find game. You couldn’t stay in the same cave without exhausting the resources.

  But hunter gatherer societies had a more egalitarian society, and had a lot of free time. After agriculture took off, armed groups could force them to do stuff and make their lives tougher a lot easier.

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  • ICastFist@programming.dev ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Agriculture also happened as an on/off season thing, with groups being nomad for a season, then “settling” and planting for another. No point in keeping a land year-round when half of that time there’s no actual land (underwater) or people around and the other half needs a lot of manpower to work it; manpower that is very ready to pack their shit and leave. There are many ways agriculture showed up and not all of them had an asshole bossing everyone while saying “MINE!”

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• elbiter@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  You also lived for 32 years, tops, and had 9 children for 3 to survive

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  • sus@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    No, half the people died in early childhood and most of the rest lived for around 40-70 years. Agriculture also sometimes made life expectancies worse, even in the year 1900 life expectancy globally was still less than 35.

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    • ICastFist@programming.dev ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      I think one thing that kept life expectancies low was high child mortality, that will skew the average downwards. Unless they were accounting for that measured separately

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    • rumschlumpel@feddit.org ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Year 1900 life expectancy seems like it would be more severely impacted by industrialization than agriculture. But yeah, hunter-gatherers don’t just drop dead at 32.

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• PugJesus@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  First part is true. We didn’t evolve to have ‘jobs’, but instead to live in small and unspecialized societies.

  Second half is an absurdly utopian view of hunter-gatherer societies. Hunter-gatherer societies do less work than subsistence farmers, but more work than modern day 40-hour workweek laborers. Not only that, but it comes at a price of severe food insecurity and low survival rates for anyone with serious health problems.

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  • minorkeys@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Yeah but we could do it waaaaay better now.

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    • Darkenfolk@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Could we though?

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  • AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Huh, US people are modern day hunter gatherers, how about that.

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  • teyrnon@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    “Work,” following herds of game and hunting, is not the same thing as schlepping it to some multinational soulless corp 5 days or more a week for what is now approaching starvation wages for many.

    The hunter gatherers are understood to have had more free time, and a higher standard of living in many respects, than their ancestors that started to farm, and were subsequently conquered by organized groups of armed men that subjugated them.

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    • PugJesus@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      “Work,” following herds of game and hunting, is not the same thing as schlepping it to some multinational soulless corp 5 days or more a week for what is now approaching starvation wages for many.

      You’re right, it’s much fucking harder and ‘starvation wages’ in the context of hunter-gatherer society is fucking laughable.

      Don’t mistake an unfair scenario in the modern day with it being worse than the past.

      The hunter gatherers are understood to have had more free time,

      Slightly more, yes.

      and a higher standard of living in many respects,

      Fucking what.

      Material accumulation was only possible with the advent of sedentary societies, which were overwhelmingly based on subsistence farming.

      than their ancestors that started to farm, and were subsequently conquered by organized groups of armed men that subjugated them.

      The ’neat’ notion of hunter-gatherer societies being overwhelmingly conquered is deeply outdated - as is, for that matter, the notion of a strict and immediate demarcation between hunter-gatherer and sedentary farming societies in most regions.

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  • arrow74@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Damn beat me to it

    Only caveat is I wouldn’t say they did “less” work than contemporary subsistence farmers. They did more varied work. The repetitive work done by a subsistence farmer left definitive marks on the bones and led to conditions like arthritis. For the hunters gathers their bone density points to high levels of activity, and I doubt they were doing intense exercise regiments

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    • merc@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      The first part isn’t true. We evolved to do whatever’s necessary to survive and pass on our genes. Whether that’s living in small societies and foraging (and fucking), or farming, or hunting, or living in big cities going out to night clubs so we can get laid. Our bodies haven’t changed too much from those of apes who live in small societies and hunt and forage. But, evolution gave us a huge brain and doesn’t take millennia of evolution to adapt.

      Even though are brains are adaptable, there are limits. In many ways the brain processes the world in a way that’s useful for a primate living in a small group in a savanna surrounded by possible threats. For example, if the grass is moving in a certain way, a brain that interprets that as having meaning might survive better than one that doesn’t. Maybe there’s a lion approaching in a stealthy way. That way of assuming there’s a brain behind a pattern leads humans to believe in gods, or to think that ChatGPT is their girlfriend. That’s something that might be a maladaptive trait in the modern world, but not enough for evolution to strongly select against it.

      As for hunter gatherers, they didn’t have exercise regimens, or form into regiments.

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    • PugJesus@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      It’s generally accepted that, in terms of hours-per-day, hunter-gatherers worked (and still work) less time than subsistence farmers.

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• JennyLaFae@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  “Hippy” Communes living like this is one of the reasons we’ve been economically squeezed since the 70’s started

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  • Gladaed@feddit.org ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    What?

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  • prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Sounds a little victim-blamey, no?

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    • JennyLaFae@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Oligarchs not liking the economic freedoms experienced by communes led to this bull shit

      Is that phrased better for my shitposting?

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    • velma@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      The hippy movement isn’t necessarily one that needs to be defended tbh

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  • Typotyper@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    You sure, because the number of factories moved off shore far out numbers communes filling up the countryside.

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    • JennyLaFae@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Yes, they didn’t like groups of people living together off of a few wages and becoming educated while having time to protest. Factories moving offshore is one of the things that they did to stagnate wages and decreasing the stability of communes.

      Many threads and much nuance of a very tangled web.

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• Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  I invite everyone who holds this opinion to go do some reenactment. The earlier the better, but really, anything pre 1800s will do for an idea of what life was before modernity.

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  • VicVinegar@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    When you have to work to eat and survive you quickly stop giving a shit that you’re “working.” It doesn’t feel like work to chop wood all day knowing it’s gonna keep you from shivering or freezing all night.

    That doesn’t make it easy, it makes it less deflating. Work feels more like “work” when you’re just doing it to make some other asshole rich.

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  • shalafi@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    From my casual reading of history and what was invented/discovered at what times in different areas, life before, say, 1830-1850 would be unrecognizable to us. Hell, drop me back in my teens and I’d struggle to remember how to navigate the 80s! In just 55-years, I’ve seen such radical changes I sometimes feel swamped by history and tech.

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  • CapuccinoCoretto@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Do they have any hunter gatherer reenactment societies?

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  • teyrnon@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Apples to oranges comparing the early modern era, anywhere back to classical days, to prehistory.

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    • Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      It is. Being a hunter gatherer is significantly worse, but you won’t find many reenactors who will go for a weekend of prehistory.

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• Agent641@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Spend all day carving up a big booty “fertility goddess” to use later for “Ceremonial purposes”

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• LSNLDN@slrpnk.net ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  And this is why I waste as much company time as possible 💅

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  • P00ptart@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    I wonder how much I’ve saved over the years from almost only pooping at work.

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    • Janx@piefed.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Image

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    • LSNLDN@slrpnk.net ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      my gut knows when I’m being held hostage in the office

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• TheLeadenSea@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Yeah but then you also don’t have medical care and climate controlled housing, or video games, so….

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  • CaptainPedantic@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    I’m so sick of people idolizing shit like this. Go walk around a fucking cemetery from the 1800s or early. All you see is headstones with several dead babies on them. All of whom would have survived if they were born today.

    Literally every society from all corners of the globe had a 50% mortality rate for children prior to 1950.

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    • plutopos@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      I know at least two family members who would have died if they had been born even ten years earlier

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    • RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      The reason why civilization is what it is today is because people didn’t like what civilization was before. (Yes, drastic simplification and yes we have lots of problems today, but at least everyone is less likely to die of disease and starvation.)

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  • rumschlumpel@feddit.org ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Or food security. But there’s definitely a golden middle, most of our work seems to only serve the enrichment of people who are detrimental to society.

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  • Vinylraupe@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Lol who needs videogames when you are literally free to do what you want?

    Edit: I would miss videogames and i would probably be slimed in one week. It was lowkenuinely a joke.

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    • atopi@piefed.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      you can probably find something that runs DOOM

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    • psx_crab@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Imagine a long day chasing a deer on foot for 10km, drag it back home, and then start playing Monster Hunter while your group preparing the meal. That would be the bestest day.

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    • TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      I don’t know, being a hunter gatherer won’t let me live the power fantasy of being Batman. I can’t pull all those slick moves in real life!

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    • CaptainPedantic@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Uh. Me! When I get bored I read, or play a game, or watch a movie. Not that I’d be bored because I’d be trying not to die in a primitive society.

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    • Saapas@piefed.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      I guess you have the freedom but not the ability

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• snoons@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  I think we’ll get back there eventually, if we don’t murder ourselves in the process. This time though we’ll have chilled beer picking sessions and no large animal is going to crack our skull open when we try to cook supper.

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  • janus2@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    we’ll get back there either because we finally figured out how to live peacefully, or because we didn’t and we nuked ourselves back to the stone age

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• FiniteBanjo@feddit.online ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  I imagine this person, and most modern humans, would not survive in a low-tech situation. The show “Naked and Afraid” is pretty good to get an understanding of why: not enough food. You “win” the show by surviving as a duo for 21 days, contestants have been failed for minor cuts and sleeping under a poisonous tree, among other issues.

  The most successful dude I’ve ever seen on the show got put on an island covered in mice. His strategy involved setting up some rocks and the mice kept knocking the rocks over and killing themselves, which he would then prepare to eat. His co-survivor actually complained that he was catching so many mice that it was keeping her up at night. One of the only contestants to ever gain weight. He did get some leg cramps while swimming to the rescue near the end, otherwise 9/10 performance.

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  • shalafi@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    I have 2.5 acres of swamp in Florida. I would starve very quickly if confined to that land. Yes, even with all my modern tools and knowledge, even given electricity and clean water.

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  • unemployedclaquer@sopuli.xyz ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Lol still not gonna watch it but I’ll read synopses

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• schmorpel@slrpnk.net ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Cave Inc. looking for Troglodyte Equine Prototyping Technician - We offer a competitive salary & free berries in the break cave. You bring: 5 years experience in cave painting and drawing, good team working skills.

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