Microsoft still can't convince folks to upgrade to Windows 11

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• derry@midwest.social ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  But they managed to convince people to switch to Linux

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• Passerby6497@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  For anyone that refuses to downgrade win10 to win11 and still wants to be secure 0Patch will cover your computer for 25eur/computer/year.

  I’ve never used them, but a security researcher I follow regularly promoted them since they’ve been doing this for systems for a good while (I think win7 was the first one they did) and are able to apply their micropatches in memory.

  Definitely worth a look if you don’t want to upgrade to Linux while not downgrading to win11.

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  • Sertou@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    You can also get extended service updates from Microsoft for at least a year. $30 for up to 15 computers, although there are also a couple of ways to get then free. 1000 bing rewards points, or enabling Backup to sync your settings to OneDrive are supposed to both means to get them that will become available soon.

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  • kylian0087@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Or just get the IoT enterprise edition. Support for many more years straight from MS. Or better yet try Linux.

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• daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I can’t wait for what comes first. The claudication and predictable extended support or the wave of malware paralyzing half the world over unsecured devices.

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  • Truscape@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I think the latter is more likely. The former will only occur once MS is compelled by something that will force them into support mode, like a government or a lawsuit.

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• ZoteTheMighty@lemmy.zip ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Help! Our unsustainable behavior of screwing over customers in the name of quarterly profits has finally caught up to us! Turns out there are long term consequences of our behavior, and now Linux can truly go toe-to-toe with Windows on a home desktop!

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• bigbabybilly@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I sidestepped the win11 artificial requirements, and things are great.

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• Imgonnatrythis@sh.itjust.works ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  What?! Are they not emphasizing that the start menu has moved from the left of the screen to the middle of the screen? Really seems like that alone should hook people.

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  • Cricket@lemmy.zip ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    You forgot to mention the great new start menu feature that makes it spike the CPU when you merely click it!

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  • Passerby6497@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    They should advertise the new feature of not being able to put the task bar on any side of the screen you want! “We’re improving your experience by making it worse!”

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    • Bonesince1997@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      And no Toolbars on the taskbar anymore.

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• k0e3@lemmy.ca ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I literally can’t. And I’m not buying new hardware just to make the switch.

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• DJDarren@sopuli.xyz ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Looking at it from a perspective other than “Windows shit, use Linux”, MS’ biggest issue here is that the vast majority have no compelling reason to upgrade. Currently.

  To the average punter, W11 offers nothing that W10 doesn’t already have. There’s no new technologies that they care about, no new tentpole software that they’re dying to try. Nothing. It has copilot running rampant through it, but most people don’t know what that is or don’t give a shit.

  Give Apple their due, when they announce an OS update, they focus hard on the ways it improves over the current offering. Ways it can interact with your other devices, for example. Or even just a whole new design.

  But MS advertise nothing beyond “This is new, come get it!”, then wonder why no one cares.

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  • LiveLM@lemmy.zip ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    And also, please correct me if I’m wrong, but as far as I know whenever Apple releases a new MacOS version they don’t put fullscreen nag messages on your machine…

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    • DJDarren@sopuli.xyz ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      They do not. Yet.

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  • AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    As a non windows user, I don’t get to interact with Microsoft systems an awful lot, but to me windows 10 felt like a complete system while windows 11 always feels like an early beta for some reason. It has some kind of unfinished, wet paint quality to it.

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    • EldritchFeminity@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Ironically, Windows users have generally felt that way with every new Windows version after 7. Vista was painful for a lot of people and 7 was basically Vista but with the problems finally fixed, and every version since then people have complained that the newest version feels unfinished.

      And in a lot of ways they have been. In 10, there are at least 2 different UIs for navigating the system and settings. Some options have been migrated over to the newer one, some only exist there, and some still only exist in the old version of the settings. And then 11 made it even worse by moving a number of frequently used options in the right-click menu into a second menu that you have to open after you right click.

      People hated 10 at first, too, but by now they’ve gotten used to it and Microsoft has ironed off most of the rough edges people hated. But it’s been building for years and this pattern has seemingly hit some kind of breaking point with the present-day circumstances.

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    • DJDarren@sopuli.xyz ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I don’t really use Windows these days. Mostly in a VM to make sure something I’m fiddling with is compatible for the poor folks at work who have to use it. So I can’t say I have any real opinions on 11 one way or the other. I couldn’t really point to one thing that’s vastly different or improved.

      I guess, from that point of view, 11 feels mostly like it’s MS adjusting the OS to better suit their revenue stream, rather than improving workflows for the consumer. Which it is, I suppose.

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  • ilinamorato@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Great point. Their strategy at this point is holding a gun up to your hard drive and saying “upgrade now or your data gets it.”

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    • Korhaka@sopuli.xyz ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I thought it was “we are upgrading now and your data gets it”

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  • PalmTreeIsBestTree@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    The biggest problem Microsoft has is that the biggest selling feature of Windows is its ability to be backwards compatible and run on older hardware. The fact that a good number of PCs that aren’t even 10 years old yet can’t even run it is the issue.

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    • Cricket@lemmy.zip ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      The biggest problem Microsoft has is that the biggest selling feature of Windows is its ability to be backwards compatible and run on older hardware.

      Absolutely, a gazillion percent this. My main desktop doesn’t have TPM. I bought a cheap micro form factor Lenovo that I thought would run Win 11, but it didn’t. It had a 6-year old CPU and that wasn’t supported by Windows 11. 6 years old. I realized then that this eliminated one major reason to get a Windows PC over a Mac. I think that both Mac and Linux are going to make huge gains in market-share in the next months and years.

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    • AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      the biggest selling feature of Windows is its ability to be backwards compatible and run on older hardware

      Really? I thought it was supposed to run older software, I don’t think hardware comes into it.

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    • thetrekkersparky@startrek.website ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      A lot of people are also questioning why they even have a home PC now. Their Win 10 machine is “out of date” and they need to replace it or else, but their cell phone now does much of what their PC did. Instead of installing Linux and learning a whole new OS, they just cut out their PC and just use their phone.

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    • NewNewAugustEast@lemmy.zip ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Maybe it is worth saying that it isn’t that it can’t run on it, it is that Microsoft is trying to stop it from running on it. Two registry keys and 11 replaces 10 on anything 10 works on. But they don’t want to tell anyone that.

      But the premise is sound: to the end consumer they hear “buy a new computer” while the old one works fine, and the new ones price is starting to climb…

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    • DJDarren@sopuli.xyz ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I genuinely couldn’t tell you what the current gen Xbox is named, though to be fair I don’t really pay that much attention these days.

      But yeah, Windows can’t really have much of a default theme update when there are a good four different window styles throughout the various settings panels.

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• cupcakezealot@piefed.blahaj.zone ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  they did convince me to upgrade to linux mint 22 tho

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• Treczoks@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  The only reason I got a Win11 computer at work is that the new box came with Win11 preinstalled.

  Most work is still done on an aging Win7 box and my Linux laptop.

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• ArchmageAzor@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Yeah, because if I did then in another 5 years it would be the same thing with Windows 12. Then 13. And so on. So I’m ditching Microsoft entirely in October and moving onto Mint.

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  • slaughterhouse@lemmy.zip ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Why wait? 😁 I made the move in May, and it’s been great!

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    • ArchmageAzor@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I don’t doubt it, I’m just very stubborn and afraid of change

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  • GreenMartian@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    moving onto Mint.

    Yeah, but in another 2 years it would be the same with Mint 23. Then 24. And so on… /s

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• ZiemekZ@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I’m upgrading to Debian 13 instead, since 13 is bigger number than 11 so obviously it’s better

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  • Matriks404@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Jokin’ aside, I am thinking to upgrading to forky (14), if it gets newer Nvidia drivers, because of a single issue I have with Wayland on Plasma (that is X applications flickering like crazy).

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  • ohshit604@sh.itjust.works ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    You’ll likely need to purge your Nvidia drivers after upgrading to 13, I had two machines fail to start NvidiaPersistence.d.service (or something like that) which caused the machines to fail on boot-up.

    Reinstalled the drivers with sudo apt install nvidia-driver nvidia-cuda-dev nvidia-cuda-toolkit if you’re looking for raytracing don’t forget to install libnvoptix1.

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  • dublet@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    This is why I upgraded my Windows 10 laptop to a Fedora 42 one. 42 is obviously the biggest. And thusly better than Debian.

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    • ShinkanTrain@lemmy.ml ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Just wait until you learn about Windows 2000

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  • webghost0101@sopuli.xyz ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    My first pc had windows 95 and it was indeed vastly better then todays corporate shite

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    • MNByChoice@midwest.social ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Remember how much people HATED Win95? They still moved to it to escape DOS, but still. Loads of hate.

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  • Squizzy@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Way ahead of you on Mint 22 or something like that

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    • TechnoCat@lemmy.ml ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Fedora 41 is like being decades in the future.

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  • wordmark@mas.to ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    @ZiemekZ @Pro it has a completely new #apt (still C++) so i guess yes :D

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• Gamoc@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  They’re not trying to get me to upgrade my OS, they’re trying to get me to buy a whole new fucking system for no good reason. Every last one of them can die in a fire.

  And that’s before we consider that Windows 11 is actually a downgrade.

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• Buffalox@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Oh I thought Windows was discontinued after Vista failed miserably.
  At least I haven’t used it since then, and it’s completely irrelevant to me.
  Why others keep using it IDK, must be some kind of masochist tendencies.

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  • palordrolap@fedia.io ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I thought Win2K was peak Windows, but I begrudgingly got comfortable with XP (using the classic Windows theme) then Win 7 after they ironed most of Vista's kinks out.

    Been on Linux since then.

    But it would be unfair to say that masochist tendencies aren't a requirement to be a Linux system owner.

    All systems require some level of that. It's just Linux has been rushing towards "less masochism" and Windows even quicker towards "more", and we find ourselves at that sweet spot where they've the same level of requirement.

    Frankly, I'd prefer this sweet spot to be more towards "less", so I'm hoping Linux continues its trend.

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    • Buffalox@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Linux as my main since 2005, I dual booted for a couple of years to play games, because gaming on Linux was too limited.
      Now gaming on Linux is amazing IMO. But yes every system requires some level of masochism, I guess we could call Windows the OS of choice for the more advanced masochists. 😋

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  • DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Yea, people don’t use windows these days anymore, they just use iOS and Android.

    Seriously, no joke, my parents have never actually used a computer. They just have a glorified pocket social media machine basically.

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• kruhmaster@sh.itjust.works ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  [deleted]

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  • LainTrain@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    VR issues put me off and honestly Win10 20H2 was cancerous enough frankly, 1903/1703 was as much as I could tolerate the endless bugs, design issues, fundamental flaws, it’s a house of cards that utterly collapses under the weight of ads and general enshittification.

    You say Linux is complex but idk, it’s pretty intuitive for basic use to setup and install, it’s just customizable so people make it a hobby, and as it’s fully open source, people who are into computers like to learn how it works, because unlike windows, they can do so with some certainty.

    On Windows the sheer amount of software it takes to make the beast keep back is unreal, OldNewExplorer, ClassicShell/OpenShell/StartAllBack++ ($$$), RetroBar, WinAeroTweaker, Windhawk, SecureUxThemePatcher, DWMBlurGlass, Microsoft-Activation-Scripts/KMSLiteAuto, SystemInformer/ProcessHacker2, BootICE, HackBGRT etc etc.

    The list goes on, with you having to subject yourself to GPO Editing to disable updates, and the horrors of Powershell syntax (yuck! Scripting languages shouldn’t be a shell! Shell languages shouldn’t have an object oriented tumor!) if you’re a power user or a good friend to someone who isn’t and you want to go in there and Get-AppxPackage | Select yada yada to uninstall the assorted Microsoft PUPs, Adware and other malware that comes pre-installed like Edge, Cortana and the new gippity Cortana (whatever it’s called), “The Xbox app” whatever that means with its horrid overlay it puts over directx apps like some sort of necromanced GFWL etc.

    In other words

    Image

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  • zrst@lemmy.cif.su ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Dunning-kruger effect on full display right here.

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  • Vanilla_PuddinFudge@infosec.pub ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Linux, as an alternative, is insane. Just setting up the OS itself is another fucking hobby.

    Great OS, too bad most people aren’t savvy enough to tweak minor settings.

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• MudMan@fedia.io ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Microsoft has given users fair warning, and said that users can get a year of updates for free but eventually the company will have to face facts and extended support beyond October.

  We can’t recall a time where Microsoft has done such a thing but these are extenuating circumstances given that most users just aren’t budging.

  WTF is this guy talking about? Far as I can tell this is the Win7 playbook all over again. Looking it up, this was the timeline:

  Jan. 13, 2015: Microsoft ended Mainstream Support for Windows 7.

  Sept. 6, 2018: Microsoft announced the ESUs for Windows 7. The ESU program is a paid service that provides critical security updates for legacy products for up to three years after Extended Support ends.
  
  August 2019: Microsoft announced a year of free ESUs, but only for select users, including customers with an Enterprise Agreement or Enterprise Agreement Subscription with active Windows 10 Enterprise E5, Microsoft 365 E5, or Microsoft 365 E5 Security subscriptions. This was limited to only Government E5 stock keeping units.
  
  Jan. 14, 2020: Microsoft ended Extended Support for Windows 7.
  
  Jan. 10, 2023: The ESUs reached their end of life on the first Patch Tuesday of 2023.
  

  That's almost a decade of post-end of support updates. If anything, MS confirmed ESU support before trying to shut down home user patches this time, so it looks less like terrified backpedalling now. And as the linked article itself admits, the data they're reporting on still shows a significant number of users still on Win7. The article waves it away as just "too many", but the original report says 8.5%.

  Because, as it turns out, the kind of people using Kapersky antivirus software and the number of people who would not upgrade from a 16 year old OS that has lost support half a dozen times over the past half a decade show significant overlap. Don't be that guy. On the Steam survey right now Win 7 is only 0.07%, for reference.

  While we're at it Win 11 is 60% vs 35% for Win 10. For all the headlines when Steam shows Linux growth you don't often hear over here that Win 11 went up by 0.5% and Windows overall went up by 0.36%.

  I've said it before and I'll keep reality checking it: the Win 10 end of support process has been wildly overhyped, particularly among Linux-friendly circles. It is not meaningfully different to moves out of other "good" versions of Windows and it's not a catastrophic crisis point for MS, for better and worse. They'll keep support up for the people who need it for as long as they're willing to pay and most legacy home users won't even know their old Win10 is unsupported because it'll just keep happily chugging along with all the same malware it already has until something breaks and they have to buy a new laptop with a preinstalled Win11 or 12 or whatever.

  The most the Win10 death hype is doing to hurt MS is create a flurry of social media posts that can make tech savvy, Linux-curious users who were previously held back by lack of gaming support to give user friendly distros a try.

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  • FishFace@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Uh, sorry, we don’t allow sane takes here. Get out.

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    • Reverendender@sh.itjust.works ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      This person with their “logic.” Honestly.

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• salacious_coaster@infosec.pub ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  11 was fine until they forced Copilot Vision on everyone. That was the straw for me to finally bail to Linux

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  • zrst@lemmy.cif.su ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Nah.

    It was never fine.

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  • MudMan@fedia.io ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    They did what, now? I have no Copilot features turned on in my PC, and I actually have a certified Copilot+ laptop.

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    • salacious_coaster@infosec.pub ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      theverge.com/…/windows-11-microsoft-ai-features-c…

      I don’t care how much Microsoft tries to assure me that a screen scanning and indexing software can be toggled off. I don’t want that kind of spyware on my computer at all.

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    • DarkDarkHouse@lemmy.sdf.org ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Recall

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• Zier@fedia.io ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  You will be shocked to learn that you can upgrade, for free, to Windows 12.
  It's called Linux.

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  • leriotdelac@lemmy.zip ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I’d go for Lunix, if the software I need for work would I run on it. Thinking about keeping Win 10 on a separate disk, since my laptop is not eligible for Win 11.

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    • rozodru@piefed.social ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      not trying to be one of those guys but trying to be helpful. What software for work do you need that won't work on a linux distro?

      I mean wine/winetricks is pretty much to the point now where you can simply download an .exe or whatever, double click it, and it'll launch. I do this for several Windows only programs I have and they all work. And the thing with the Linux community is that there's always SOMEONE that will insist on getting the most obscure drivers working on it. I once had this dongle from like the early 2000s that would allow you to plug PSX and PS2 memory cards into it. I thought "yeah I'd like to use this again, no way it'll work on linux" and sure enough someone had actually made the drivers for it. I think it's only me and the guy who made the driver that actually use the thing.

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• yardratianSoma@lemmy.ca ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Funny how Kaspersky thinks what it comes down to are people who are afraid of change, when there’s also just people who are also not too happy with the direction Microsoft is taking their OS. And then there’s the fact that their stats only come from users who still use Kaspersky, which might be mostly businesses, instead of the average joe, skewing the data.

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• troed@fedia.io ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  My elderly parents got the "your computer cannot be upgraded" and my somewhat tech-litterate mom asked me to move them to Linux.

  Microsoft should've realised at some point that the only thing most people need today is a computer that can run a web browser and connect to a printer.

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  • troed@fedia.io ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    (They're now moved over)

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  • Inaminate_Carbon_Rod@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    It boggles my mind that tablets didn’t take over already as peoples “At home” devices

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  • CileTheSane@lemmy.ca ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I moved my MIL to Mint. It runs faster and she hasn’t had any issues accessing Internet and email.

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  • SaharaMaleikuhm@feddit.org ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    My old printer got better support on linux than modern windows. HP has long since took the driver off their website.

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  • MudMan@fedia.io ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I swear to Torvalds, if the amount of old ladies using Linux because their Fedi relatives installed it on their laptops is accurate we are in the middle of an major demographic crisis.

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    • fading_person@lemmy.zip ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      For every one, there’s the younger relatively who installed it for them, so things are in perfect balance in the end.

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• Bonesince1997@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Read the room, Microsoft.

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• YogaDouchebag@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  If they just sold a very simple lightweight barebone version of Win 10 for 30-40 usd with regular security updates for the next 200 years, they could make so much money for eternity. Just sell those Apps/Widgets as additional paid apps, that is all you need.

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• judgyweevil@feddit.it ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  It convinced me to ditch dual booting and to go full Linux

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• Multiplexer@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Wait…
  Excluding half of the active PCs or so from upgrade due to arbitrary hardware constraints didn’t push upgrading?
  How can this be??? 😯🫢

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• Infernal_pizza@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  How much of this is people not wanting to upgrade vs not being able to upgrade because their PC isn’t supported?

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• solrize@lemmy.ml ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Makes me miss windows 7.

  xkcd.com/528/

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• tanisnikana@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I sidestepped to Mint. Sorry, Microsoft, your shit’s untenable and disappointing.

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