Row as Starmer suggests landlords and shareholders are not ‘working people’

Comments

• WaxedWookie@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Owning shit isn’t working. Why is this controversial?

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  • HumanPenguin@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Because the right wing media wants it to be. The answer is simple.

    Cool if owning property is work. Let’s abolish capital gains tax and charge it as income.

    Because at the end of it. That is what the telegraph etc is saying. They are trying to argue Starmer agreed to hold all taxes when the manifesto clearly stated working taxes.

    Cool call their bluff all capital gains is now charged as income tax.

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    • WaxedWookie@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Ain’t capitalism grand.

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• Wrightfi@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  As a landlord (I own two properties) and as someone who also works full time I agree with him.

  It may take up some time but ultimately it’s an investment.

  Landlords like myself aren’t (typically) struggling, so we should pay more tax, especially now as the country needs it. I am proud to say I don’t tax dodge and pay what I owe. But unfortunately there are many loopholes that can be exploited to avoid paying tax. Just a few weeks ago someone was telling me how I should put my properties under a LTD company to avoid paying tax (I didn’t and won’t). I hope the Labour government does more to close these loopholes for tax dodgers.

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  • davidagain@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Thank you.

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• Hikermick@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  This man has never had renters

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  • StupidBrotherInLaw@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Oh do go get fucked.

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    • Hikermick@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      My last renter texted me and told me the toilet wouldn’t flush. She said she “took it apart” but couldn’t fix it so it needed to be snaked out. I go there and a neighbor told me she set a can of cat food on the tank for her kitten to eat and it knocked the can into the bowl. She tried to flush it down. Her boyfriend shows up and tells me the same story. She only took the tank off (nowhere near where a clog would be) and she replaced it without replacing the gasket so it had been leaking water. Once I knew what the problem was I fixed it in 30 minutes. Her keeping the truth from me made it take a lot longer and cost more. I charged her $300 less than the property next door in a trendy neighborhood because I didn’t want to be "part of the problem ". Long story short, not everyone is cut out to be a home owner.

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  • Pilferjinx@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Could you imagine a world where the word rent never existed. I bet it would be awesome.

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    • howrar@lemmy.ca ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      I’m pretty sure you mean that you’d like a world with no landlords and not a world where short term housing solutions don’t exist. No rent would imply the latter. Unless you know of a way to do it without paying rent?

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    • Hikermick@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      I’d rather the word homeless never existed

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• apotheotic@beehaw.org ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  I dont often agree with this Tory in disguise, but in this case he’s right.

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• chonglibloodsport@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Are you a landlord if you let a room to help you pay bills at the end of a month? Are you a shareholder if you have a pension?

  Judging by the answers here, the answer is no. But then we’re talking about millions of people who work everyday factory jobs, retail jobs, or low level office jobs.

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  • HumanPenguin@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Yes if you open rather then sublet and yes.

    Dose not mean it is wrong. But just like the others doing it it is not worked for income but investment income.

    Judging from the answers here everyone has a pretty clear idea of the difference between investment and work.

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    • chonglibloodsport@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Right, but I hope we’re able to see the difference between a working person who has investments and someone who earns the bulk of their income from investments. Similarly for real estate.

      Because calling someone who works and has investment savings for retirement (such as a pension) “not a working person” is not just plain wrong, it’s extremely offensive, especially coming from a career politician like Starmer.

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• njm1314@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  That may be the first things ever said that I agree with him on ever.

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• captainlezbian@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  I don’t know why they seem to think they are. Yes some landlords do labor, but that labor is to maintain and improve value of their income from owning things.

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• mindbleach@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Good fucking luck to any landlord looking to be named in a manifesto.

  You might get mentioned. You won’t like how.

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  • ShareMySims@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Tories also have a manifesto, it’s just the word used here for, well, a manifesto. Not specific to any political leaning.

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• echodot@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Well I remember when I used to rent I don’t remember my landlord ever doing anything. He owns the property but he certainly didn’t maintain it.

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• AFC1886VCC@reddthat.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Comrade Starmer lmao

  He’s right though. I’d very much like a PM to take a hard line on these chuckle fucks.

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  • jaggedrobotpubes@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Nothing “comrade” about it. It’s just sense.

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  • blackn1ght@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    He definitely is. It’s refreshing to finally even hear this sentiment from our government. However it’s just words, hopefully we start seeing some positive changes in the rental and housing market.

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    • Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Very small scale landlords are often working people, and lots of working people own shares. That said, the bigger landowners and stock holders are much less likely to be working people. Those fuckers contribute nothing of value to society.

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    • AnarchistArtificer@slrpnk.net ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      I’m super dubious because Starmer has done very little to earn my trust, but I would be very keen to be surprised, or even proven wrong

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• Reddfugee42@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  They do no labor, they create no good, they accomplish no service. Literal rent-seeking.

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• thesporkeffect@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Rare Starmer W

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  • ShareMySims@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Broken clock moment.

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• LainTrain@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  As that one song goes

  “But we can You know we can We can You know we can …”

  www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyCLcUv7RK8

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• HumanPenguin@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  And, as everyone here says. He is correct. It is an investment. Not work. Yes you are taking a risk, that is the point. If you work, you should not be taking a risk. But instead paid for your labour.

  Unfortunately, saying it here doesn’t matter. Papers like the telegraph and other Tory press are not going to care about the facts. They only care about creating division.

  More importantly, Starmer et al. Are also not going to make the effort to argue this case. No effort is going to be made to push forward the true difference between working class income and actual investment income.

  Anyone watching saw this argument starting during the election. It was clear then when labour started talking about working taxes. The Tories instantly started arguing that the Tories were talking about not raising taxers at all. Anyone watching saw this discussion forming.

  And Starmer et al. intentionally ignored it rather than raw attention to the difference. They will not bother to fight the terminology now either.

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• jabjoe@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Yer, I totally trust the Telegraph on what Starmer says on the lines in a class war. Completely trustable source on the subject. Not at all trying to put that line with as many people on its side not Starmers…

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• TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Based from Starmer there.

  Landlords and shareholders aren’t working people.

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  • nialv7@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Okay, so I can be working for 50 hours a week to make ends meet. If I put any little savings I have from time to time into stock, I am not working people anymore? Just because I want to be financially responsible?

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    • TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      This isn’t hard to understand.

      Owning stock doesn’t make you a worker. Being a landlord doesn’t make you a worker.

      If you work on top of the above, you are a worker. If you do not, you aren’t.

      There’s a big difference between “a landlord isn’t a worker” and “a landlord cannot be a worker.”

      An absolutely based comment from Starmer.

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    • thr0w4w4y2@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      you’ll put those savings into a stocks and shares ISA where any gains from stocks are tax free guaranteed.

      If you have more than £20k a year to put away into stocks and shares then yeah you need to pay some tax bruv.

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    • biscuitswalrus@aussie.zone ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      By your definition I should be called a footballer because I play football once a week casually. Ignore the 50 plus hour weeks of my actual job. I got $50 from football as season champions (it’s a gift card, for the bar, at the place I play). I better go update my linkedin!

      You’re funny, good one.

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  • Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    This might be my favourite thing he’s said yet

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• Rentlar@lemmy.ca ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Yeah, Starmer is right though…

  By definition if you make all the money you need to live from investments like stocks, bonds, or leasing out homes then you aren’t working class. If you work a regular job, but have some additional income from investment savings you are working class, but the Labour government isn’t having to focus on those investments going up as much as making your working life more comfortable.

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• AllNewTypeFace@leminal.space ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  I’m sure he’ll acknowledge his mistake, apologise profusely and make amends with a round of capital-gains tax cuts.

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• Hossenfeffer@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Of course they’re not working people. They are leveraging capital to give them an income. That is not the same as chopping wood and carrying water.

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  • HumanPenguin@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Or filing accounts.

    Yeah you may be younger, but let’s remember many folks my grandfathers age did not consider white collar work, to be work.

    That idea is as far from correct as this article. Anything that is taxed under PAYE is working taxes. As the Labour Party manifesto and Starmer called it.

    Shares growth of property and renting is taxed as capital gains.

    Owning a business is the one that depends on how you choose to do it. Most sole traders are by definition covered under Income tax if self filled rather than PAYE.

    If you have registered an LTD, you have a little more choice. And most accountants will advise you do not pay yourself as income tax. So you will be treating your labour as an investment. And here we see why the wealthy want false claims like thi in the right wing media. Because there is a possibility, that advice may change in the future and business owners will lose some tax advantages to a pay lower tax % than their employees.

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• kitnaht@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  I mean, he’s right. The whole point of my mother leveraging her home to become a landlord back then was because she had a stroke and literally could-not-work. Landlords aren’t working class. They’re just investors.

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• MrSilkworm@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  Because he is correct

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• ynazuma@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

  That is correct. They might work, but in context they are not “working people”

  Here “working people” is synonymous with “working class”. Thus, not landlords and shareholders obviously

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  • sunbeam60@lemmy.one ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    I’m curious about your definition of shareholder; what if I owe £80 worth of fractional shares in an app-based investment service? Does that make me a shareholder?

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    • davidagain@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Then your income wouldn’t be affected in any real way by raising taxes on those shares and getting cross that Starmer taxing unearned income is affecting you badly is bothincorrect and missing the point.

      Starmer is raising tax on unearned income instead of working people’s taxes, which is very fair for a change, and you’re splitting hairs over definitions of who counts as workers. You’re so missing the point.

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    • cook_pass_babtridge@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      It certainly doesn’t make you a worker.

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    • ynazuma@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      It’s not my definition. It is the definition that is being used in context in the article. Read it before commenting

      The definition being used is proper and common in modern usage.

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