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Mercedes becomes the first automaker to sell autonomous cars in the U.S. that don't come with a requirement that drivers watch the road

⁨331⁩ ⁨likes⁩

Submitted ⁨⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨MichaelTen@lemmy.world⁩ to ⁨technology@lemmy.world⁩

https://fortune.com/2024/04/18/mercedes-self-driving-autonomous-cars-california-nevada-level-3-drive-pilot/

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  • Jimmycakes@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    They got an army of thousands of Indians to watch the road for you?

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    • QuarterSwede@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      No, you’re thinking of Amazon.

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      • Deceptichum@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        They got an army of thousands of Amazonians to watch the road for you?

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    • DudeDudenson@lemmings.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      No they just got a few dozens good lawyers instead if the lawsuits costts less than the profits and you get publicity out of it then that’s business for ya

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      • simplejack@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        The best lawyers are going to use AI to create their legal arguments. And you know what AI stands for. Always Indians.

        No matter how you slice it, it’s Indians all the way down.

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  • cAUzapNEAGLb@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    …

    As of April 11, there were 65 Mercedes autonomous vehicles available for sale in California, Fortune has learned through an open records request submitted to the state’s DMV. One of those has since been sold, which marks the first sale of an autonomous Mercedes in California, according to the DMV. Mercedes would not confirm sales numbers. Select Mercedes dealerships in Nevada are also offering the cars with the new technology, known as “level 3” autonomous driving. …

    Drivers can activate Mercedes’s technology, called Drive Pilot, when certain conditions are met, including in heavy traffic jams, during the daytime, on spec ific California and Nevada freeways, and when the car is traveling less than 40 mph. Drivers can focus on other activities until the vehicle alerts them to resume control. The technology does not work on roads that haven’t been pre-approved by Mercedes, including on freeways in other states.

    …

    U.S. customers can buy a yearly subscription of Drive Pilot in 2024 EQS sedans and S-Class car models for $2,500.

    …

    Mercedes is also working on developing level 4 capabilities. The automaker’s chief technology officer Markus Schäfer expects that level 4 autonomous technology will be available to consumers by 2030, Automotive News reported.

    …

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    • Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Hmm, so only on a very small number of predetermined routes, and at very slow speeds for those roads.

      Still impressive, but not as impressive as the headline makes out.

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      • VindictiveJudge@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        And definitely not worth the $2500 a year they’re asking for the feature.

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      • Turun@feddit.de ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Yes, but it’s actually level 3.

        Not the Tesla “full self driving - no wait we actually lied to you, you need to be alert at all times” bullshit.

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    • jballs@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I’ve seen this headline a few times and the details are laughably bad. The only reason this can be getting any press is because the headline is good clickbait. But 40 mph top speed on approved roads in 2 states only if a car is in front of you in the daytime is entirely useless. I guess it’s a good first step maybe? But trying to write headlines like this is big news is sad.

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      • lemmyvore@feddit.nl ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        40 mph top speed on approved roads in 2 states only if a car is in front of you in the daytime is entirely useless.

        It’s specifically designed to navigate traffic congestion, which happens under 30 mph. It can keep up with the lane, deal with lane changes, honk if someone backs into you, let ambulances through, things like that. Not sure why the article presents it as generic driving.

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      • Turun@feddit.de ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        The reason this gets attention is because it’s the first level 3 sold to consumers.

        The tech is hard, of course it’s gonna start out with laughingly limited capabilities. But it’s the first step towards more automation.

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    • ripcord@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Fucking subscription. No.

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  • eee@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    U.S. customers can buy a yearly subscription of Drive Pilot in 2024 EQS sedans and S-Class car models for $2,500

    yeah, fuck that.

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    • AbackDeckWARLORD@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Those cars cost well over $100k each. The demographic buying that doesn’t care about $2500.

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      • MeatsOfRage@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        They’re also accepting full liability if anything happens while using this feature so it’s actually a type of insurance

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    • ricdeh@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I think you can afford that if you own an EQS

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    • AA5B@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Have you seen Tesla’s price for full self driving? And they don’t take liability

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  • deafboy@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    And they managed to do it without us obsessing about their CEO several times a day? I refuse to believe that!

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  • EurekaStockade@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    don’t come with a requirement that drivers watch the road

    Seems it’s like every other Mercedes then

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    • HolidayGreed@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Image

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  • nucleative@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Wonder how this works with car insurance. Os there a future where the driver doesn’t need to be insured? Can the vehicle software still be “at fault” and how will the actuaries deal with assessing this new risk.

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    • machinin@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I believe Mercedes takes responsibility if there is an accident while driving autonomously.

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      • HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Which is how it should be. The company creating the software takes on the liability of faults with said software.

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      • Sizzler@slrpnk.net ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        And this is how they will push everyone into driverless. Through insurance costs. Who would insure 1 human driver vs 100 bots, (once the systems have a few billion miles on them)

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      • Rinox@feddit.it ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Will it pull a Tesla and switch off the autopilot seconds before an accident?

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      • Hacksaw@lemmy.ca ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        No. I don’t think this is a good solution. Companies will put a price on your life and focus on monetary damage reduction. If you’re about to cause more property damage than your life is worth (to Mercedes) they’ll be incentivized to crash the car and kill you rather than crash into the expensive structure.

        Your car should be you property, you should be liable for the damage it causes. The car should prioritise your life over monetary damage. If there is some software problem causing the cars to crash, you need to be able to sue Mercedes through a class action lawsuit to recover your losses.

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    • Hugin@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Berkshire Hathaway owns Geico the car insurance company. In one of his annual letters Buffett said that autonomous cars are going to be great for humanity and bad for insurance companies.

      “If [self-driving cars] prove successful and reduce accidents dramatically, it will be very good for society and very bad for auto insurers.”

      Actuaries are by definition bad at assessing new risk. But as data get collected they quickly adjust to it. There are a lot of cars so if driverless cars become even a few percent of cars on the road they will quickly be able to build good actuarial tables.

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  • Strayce@lemmy.sdf.org ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    This is also the company that promises to prioritise the vehicle occupants over pedestrians.

    Linky

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    • geophysicist@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I mean that’s exactly what the driver would do, I’m not sure why this is controversial

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      • h3rm17@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Yeah, for real, “Someone will 100%, do you want it to be your friends/family/people you know or some absolute random stranger?” Some lemmitors would surely answer “My people, for sure”

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      • blackn1ght@feddit.uk ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        The human does it out of self preservation, but the car doesn’t need to feel too preserve itself.

        By getting the in the car, the passengers should be aware of the risks and that if there is an accident, the car will protect pedestrians over the occupants. The pedestrians had no choice but the passengers have a choice of not getting in the vehicle.

        I feel like car manufacturers are going to favour protecting the passengers as a safety feature, and then governments will eventually legislate it to go the other way after a series of high profile deaths of child pedestrians.

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      • Hacksaw@lemmy.ca ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Nah, I think most people would crash into a tree rather than clear a sidewalk. Cars are designed to protect you in a crash. Pedestrians don’t have seatbelts, crash zones, and airbags.

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    • Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Who would buy a car that will sacrifice the passengers in the event of an unavoidable accident? If it’s significantly better driver than a human would be then it’s safer for pedestrians aswell.

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    • Skates@feddit.nl ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Yes. As it should be. I’ll buy the car that chooses to mow down a sidewalk full of pregnant babies instead of mildly inconveniencing myself or my passengers. Why the hell would you even consider any other alternative?

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    • Rinox@feddit.it ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      It’s not really an issue. 99.9% of the time the passengers will already be safe and the pedestrian is the one at risk. The only time I see this being an issue is if the car is already out of control, but at that point there’s little anyone can do.

      I mean, what’s the situation where a car can’t break but has enough control where it HAS to kill a pedestrian in order to save the passengers?

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  • just_another_person@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    It will be litigated almost immediately. There is no current combination of model and hardware platform that a car could reasonably run that could be called “fully self driving” at any useful speed. This thing sounds like parking assist on steroids maybe, or “stalled traffic assist”. They will be sued.

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    • explodes@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Did you read the article? There are already plenty of conditions for activating the self driving mode.

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    • cm0002@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      There’s tons of conditions

      when certain conditions are met, including in heavy traffic jams, during the daytime, on spec ific California and Nevada freeways, and when the car is traveling less than 40 mph. Drivers can focus on other activities until the vehicle alerts them to resume control.

      I doubt this is a mistake, they must have really high confidence in the tech as well as with the restrictions, not even Tesla had the balls to announce that you could drive distracted.

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      • Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        esla had the balls to announce that you could drive distracted.

        That’s the difference between Level 2 and Level 3 full self driving. Teslas are Level 2.

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    • Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      There is no current combination of model and hardware platform that a car could reasonably run that could be called “fully self driving” at any useful speed.

      It’s still not flawless and reguires an attentive driver but Tesla FSD Beta V12 is pretty damn impressive. They made a huge leap forward by going from human code to 100% neural nets. I don’t think we’re too far a way from a true robo-taxi and there’s going to be some humble pie served for the LiDAR/radar advocates. I highly recommend everyone to watch some reviews on YouTube if you aren’t up to speed with the recent changes they’ve made.

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    • VelociCatTurd@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Sued for what?

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      • RvTV95XBeo@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        I mean I disagree with most of what the person you’re responding to is saying, but they are entering into a new stage of vehicular liability. By telling the driver they don’t have to pay attention there is an implied transfer of liability.

        It probably says somewhere in the terms of use that Mercedes isn’t at fault or that you have to carry some special kind of insurance, and frankly computers have a pretty good shot at being better than your average human driver so they’ll hopefully be easier to insure, but nevertheless, people on both sides of every accident for the first few years with this tech will sue. Any chance to squeeze a few milly out of a 100 billion dollar car company.

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  • BigTrout75@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I like to imagine somebody in a call center remotely driving your car.

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    • phoneymouse@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Fine print will say it’s still your fault though if they crash

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      • Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        On a lever 3 system it’s not. If it is then it’s level 2.

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  • blackn1ght@feddit.uk ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    On a slightly unrelated note, the Mercedes EQ class are really ugly, both internally and externally.

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    • TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I think most German cars have had a bad generation.

      Mercedes: recent designs have been divisive, sometimes I see one and think they look ok and other times they elicit a yikes. More importantly, Mercedes don’t have a single car in their lineup right now that outshines their rivals. Usually there’d be at least one.

      BMW: does it even need to be said? BMW has designs and recognisability that others would kill to have, yet they destroy that design language and pump out absolutely hideous cars. This is not a Chris Bangle moment. People aren’t initially reeling at these designs but coming around to them and seeing them as being amazing and ahead of the curve. BMWs are ugly now. I’ve seen car reviewers censor the grilles in their videos lol.

      VW: the drivetrains are still completely fine, but my god the cabin quality has suffered. The penny-pinching is insane. Touch controls galore, with no backlight for night time driving? Two window controls and a touch toggle to switch between controlling the front/rear windows? Are you fucking serious, VW? VW used to be the king of affordable priced car with an interior that was closer to the likes of Audi/BMW/Mercedes/Volvo than it was to Renault/Citroen/Honda/etc. but they’ve thrown that away to save pennies.

      Audi: ok their general design still holds up well. But their interior is being cheapened just like VW’s. No doubt a decision from the top. Also the e-Tron’s camera mirrors are unbelievably shit. The Honda e had a much better implementation. And it was fucking dumb to sell the e-Tron GT for £2k less than its Porsche equivalent. Who would buy an Audi when for £2k more you can buy a Porsche?

      Porsche: ok Porsche is still mostly excellent, but the first gen Taycan has a little more screen than I’d like. And Porsche is somewhat niche anyway, they’re not enough to make the overall German car market look better.

      The most frustrating one is VW. They’re supposed to be the mass-market brand. And of all times to fuck up, doing it in a time when people are still forming their opinions on EVs is such a massive fuck up. People will look at the ID.3, then look at the likes of the MG4 or upcoming Renault 5 and think “oh, so VW can’t make good EVs”, and that will stick to them for a long time. Look at how long people thought Skoda was a crappy brand for! It was only around 2010 when “huhu crappy communist 80s car” meme truly died. Perceptions last.

      Rant over. I’m pretty fed up with the car market right now. I’m gonna keep my MX-5 until the rust claims it.

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      • blackn1ght@feddit.uk ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        I’ve been watching a lot of car reviews lately and yeah, I think you’re right on all points. I watched a review of the new BMW 7 series and even the air control vents are capacitive sensors refer than little levers and it just seems unnecessary. What was hilarious was that the door release is right by the air vent control, so the review I watched saw the reviewer accidentally open the door when they were trying to control the air vent.

        There’s way way way too much reliance on touch screens in cars. I’m not even sure if you’d legally be allowed to use them in some countries, I feel like you’d have to pull over to just change the HVAC settings! You’d swear it was designed by someone that’s never driven a car. They’re decisions that are probably coming right from the top and the actual interior designers are pulling their hair out.

        There’s also a common theme across manufacturers where settings for features are lost when the car is switched off. So you have to go into the settings and change them back every single time you get into the car.

        If I were in the market for a car (specifically electric), I’d probably go for Kia. The ev6 and ev9 look really nice. I’ve seen a couple of EV9s on the road recently and I was surprised at how much smaller they actually seem than on videos.

        Like you though we’re going to keep our car (Nissan Quashqai) as long as possible. There’s no bullshit and it’s practical and comfortable.

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      • Sizzler@slrpnk.net ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Those grills are going to be modder meme material, they are basically ai designed grills anyway. Think cartoonesque, Roger rabbit ultra-exaggerated grills with detail highlighted.

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      • orenishii@feddit.nl ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Haha are you me?!

        I’ve just got a Landrover Defender 2023 (75th) and was so glad is just had buttons for everything. I had a touch screen but other than navigation no need to touch it. Even optional analog dials instead of digital.

        Was looking at the van equivalent of the new mercedes (v-class) but same ipad horror on the inside. Glad some brand are reversing this silly phase.

        And was long time BMW driver before that but I quit 5 series before electric and the hideous grills. Such a shame.

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    • Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Most new Mercedes are. Especially from the rear. I can’t imagine what they were thinking when designing those.

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  • qevlarr@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Autonomous my ass. Is a person remote controlling it from a low wage county?

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  • elrik@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    How is this different from the capabilities of Tesla’s FSD, which is considered level 2? It seems like Mercedes just decided they’ll take on liability to classify an equivalent level 2 system as level 3.

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    • vin@lemmynsfw.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Ummm, yeah, that’s the real difference between level 2 and 3 - who is liable

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      • elrik@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Ah so it’s marketing BS then, got it.

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  • Wanderer@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    This is really cool and you’re all sad wankers.

    Oh it doesn’t work in all these conditions.

    Well it went from not working at all to a completely self driving car in certain situations. That’s great. It’s the future. We are living in the future

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    • Hack3900@lemy.lol ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      The better future isn’t better cars it’s removing cars

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      • deafboy@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        We had that. It wasn’t a future.

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      • Cupcake1972@mander.xyz ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        how dare someone enjoy driving

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  • WamGams@lemmy.ca ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Had this been BMW I would have assumed it was an onion article.

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    • ripcord@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Why?

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  • 14th_cylon@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    archive.is/Mm7Q2

    Exclusive: Mercedes becomes the first automaker to sell autonomous ca… 4–5 minutes

    The next time you’re traveling on the interstate and see a fellow driver whose hands are full with everything but the wheel—scrolling TikTok, applying mascara, eating breakfast—don’t panic. It’s all legal in certain states, as long as they’re in a new Mercedes with autonomous driving technology.

    The luxury automaker has become the first in the nation to start selling self-driving cars—at least those that afford riders a hands-free experience—to regular consumers. So far, the company has sold at least 65 autonomous vehicles in California, Fortune has learned through an open records request submitted to the state’s DMV. Select Mercedes dealerships in Nevada are also offering the cars with the new technology, known as “level 3” autonomous driving.

    Level 3-enabled cars went on sale in December, Mercedes told Fortune. California and Nevada are the only two states where the company can legally sell the technology to consumers. The two state DMVs gave Mercedes approval to begin selling the cars last year—Nevada in January, and California in June. Mercedes announced in September its planned to begin sales, but this is the first news of the cars actually reaching consumers.

    Drivers can activate Mercedes’s technology, called Drive Pilot, when certain conditions are met, including in heavy traffic jams, during the daytime, on specific California and Nevada freeways, and when the car is traveling less than 40 mph. Drivers can focus on other activities until the vehicle alerts them to resume control. The technology does not work on roads that haven’t been pre-approved by Mercedes, including on freeways in other states.

    The sales mark a new echelon of autonomous driving available to the average American. Mercedes is the first automaker selling to customers to achieve level 3 capabilities in the U.S., with Tesla and others still offering technology at level 2—in which cars can perform specific tasks but require constant supervision from a driver. Some drivers, however, ignore those rules and operate the cars as if they are more capable than they are. Some drivers, however, ignore those rules and operate the cars as if they are more capable than they are. One family of a deceased driver has accused Tesla of hyping its assisted driving technology as fully autonomous, allegedly leading to tragic results, while California’s DMV last year accused the company of false advertising over the matter.

    Meanwhile, robotaxis from Alphabet’s Waymo and GM’s Cruise operate at level 4, meaning cars drive autonomously in most conditions without human interference. But these companies currently don’t sell vehicles to consumers, and Cruise recently halted its service after California’s DMV suspended its license due to an incident in which a car dragged a pedestrian under its carriage for 20 feet.

    U.S. customers can buy a yearly subscription of Drive Pilot in 2024 EQS sedans and S-Class car models for $2,500. Mercedes began selling level 3-enabled cars in its home country of Germany in May 2022. The European packages cost 5,000 to 7,000 euros ($5,300 and $7,500) for a three-year membership.

    The cars sport turquoise lights on its rear-view mirrors, headlights, and taillights to let law enforcement and other drivers know when the car is operating autonomously. Drive Pilot is only available on select models that have the built-in hardware, including a sensor at the front of the car and a camera in the rear windshield.

    Mercedes is also working on developing level 4 capabilities. The automaker’s chief technology officer Markus Schäfer expects that level 4 autonomous technology will be available to consumers by 2030, Automotive News reported. But the jump to level 4 is considerably more difficult than achieving level 3. While humans are still expected to take control of the car based on the circumstances in level 3, level 4 technology is supposed to offer near-total autonomy. At this level, a driver only needs to take over if the system fails. That means the technology must be able to safely respond to nearly all unexpected situations on the road.

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    • cm0002@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      The cars sport turquoise lights on its rear-view mirrors, headlights, and taillights to let law enforcement and other drivers know when the car is operating autonomously.

      That’s actually a pretty neat solution lol

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      • lemmyvore@feddit.nl ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        When Verge tested the EQS in September these turquoise lights weren’t road-legal yet. It’s been proposed as a standard by the SAE but each jurisdiction will have to approve it individually.

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  • Fredselfish@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Yeah I doubt this can drive American roads in any weather condition and not have issues.

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    • czech@lemm.ee ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Correct, it only works when certain conditions are met.

      Drivers can activate Mercedes’s technology, called Drive Pilot, when certain conditions are met, including in heavy traffic jams, during the daytime, on spec ific California and Nevada freeways, and when the car is traveling less than 40 mph. Drivers can focus on other activities until the vehicle alerts them to resume control. The technology does not work on roads that haven’t been pre-approved by Mercedes, including on freeways in other states.

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    • ripcord@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Read article

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    • NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      in any weather condition

      LOL. Weather is probably the smallest of the problems they have solved.

      German car makers have a habit of testing all their models in all weather conditions, routinely, around the globe.

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  • bobburger@fedia.io ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Break down of different self driving levels

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