Mozilla lays off 60 people, wants to build AI into Firefox
Submitted 9 months ago by einat2346@lemmy.today to technology@lemmy.world
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2024/02/mozilla-lays-off-60-people-wants-to-build-ai-into-firefox/
Comments
SteefLem@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Turun@feddit.de 9 months ago
We already have AI in Firefox. And not gonna lie, offline (I.e. absolutely private) translations for webpages is pretty neat.
Link@rentadrunk.org 9 months ago
It’s really good but I do wish it supported more languages like Russian or Japanese. So far most of the times I have had to translate a page, Firefox didn’t support the language.
Deceptichum@kbin.social 9 months ago
Let me share some fun Mozilla facts about their previous CEO who has now stepped down to “executive chairwoman “ earning:
She received 6.9 million dollars in 2022 and 5 million in 2021, 3 million in 2020.
Her replacement is an executive from AirBnB and eBay. We will find out how much both of these are earning in 2025 when they release their financial statements.
They fired 60 staff and are adding AI to their flagship program to earn more money.
Tell me this is a good thing.
spaduf@slrpnk.net 9 months ago
Tell me this is a good thing.
Mozilla has long been the most ethical player in this space (while still producing SOTA ML). All of their datasets/models are open source and usually crowdsourced. Not to mention, their existing work is primarily in improving accessibility.
ALSO, the other half of this story is that Firefox is becoming the primary focus again. Everybody’s freaking out about the AI stuff but that’s because they’re only reading the headlines. The programs they’ve shut down are things like Hubs (Mozilla’s metaverse platform), the VPN, and the sensitive data scrubber (which was using a third party service anyway).
aidan@lemmy.world 9 months ago
As a software developer I am huge supporter of Mozilla’s developer initiatives from Manifest V2 implementation to MDN. But it’s also important to be realistic Mozilla has long had major money problems, and not the kind that giving them more would fix.
FaceDeer@kbin.social 9 months ago
Tell me this is a good thing.
Ok. Mozilla was spreading itself too thin, spending resources trying to compete with multiple products against established brands that were already way ahead of them. They needed to focus down onto their core product rather than frivolously cast about.
And AI is the technology of the future, despite all the whinging and griping by commenters on the subject. It's being incorporated into the other major browsers, it's a must-have if Firefox is to remain relevant. I'm sure you'll be able to turn it off in the settings if you don't want it and if you're really concerned about getting AI cooties there'll be niche forks that are compiled without it.
Deceptichum@kbin.social 9 months ago
And the ever increasing CEO wages and hiring of AirBnB/eBay executive as CEO?
Flatworm7591@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 months ago
I agree with you that Mozilla is spreading itself too thin. And don’t get me wrong, I love Firefox and am a long time user. But they do need to understand their user base better.
They aren’t going to become a sustainable business by copying more popular browsers. It’s their differences from the mainstream that make them appealing as an alternative in the first place. I already don’t like them foisting Pocket on me, which 100% should have remained an extension. I don’t like the fact that Google is their default search engine, which goes against all their privacy messaging. I understand the reason is money, but that’s kind of the definition of being a sellout isn’t it? Their core values should always come first.
Fact is, those employees weren’t fired for any good reason other than to hop on the latest tech trend. It’s this sort of corporate “profit before people” bullshit that will erode any goodwill that people still have towards Mozilla. I couldn’t give a fuck about adding a stupid AI driven chatbot to Mozilla, and neither, I imagine, do many of their current users. Honestly, I think “AI” has ruined the internet in a lot of ways already. It’s already had a massive negative impact on the quality of search results, across all major search engines, because of all the low quality llm content that has been produced already, and it’s only going to get worse. And you can’t trust a single thing that comes out of those models, so what is even the point of them?
Sorry in advance for the old man rant lol.
deweydecibel@lemmy.world 9 months ago
And AI is the technology of the future, despite all the whinging and griping by commenters on the subject.
You have no idea, any more than the rest of us. Like, please tell me you understand “____ is the technology of the future” has been said more times than it’s ever been true.
The idea of AI is a technology of the future, but what we have growing now is not AI, not really, and this iteration can be just as big a flop as any other technology of the moment.
Shadywack@lemmy.world 9 months ago
And AI is the technology of the future, despite all the whinging and griping by commenters on the subject.
Yeah because we’ve never seen tech fads before heralded as the next big thing. If I could roll my eyes any harder we could harness that for power generation.
MajorHavoc@programming.dev 9 months ago
And AI is the technology of the future, despite all the whinging and griping by commenters on the subject.
The entire discussion is to distract ourselves from the raw truth: Fax machines are the technology of the future. Fax machines will outlive us all. AI and VR will reach their heyday, then wane with years and be replaced. But whatever replaces them will sit quietly in the shadow of the everlasting Fax machine.
deweydecibel@lemmy.world 9 months ago
You’re right. Mozilla is the devil. Everyone go to the better option in Silicon Valley for web browsing…
…
…
…
…
DarkThoughts@kbin.social 9 months ago
The answers to both of those things depends very heavily on the details. I think focusing on their main products is a good thing, but adding AI sounds like one of those likely terrible decisions. We definitely need privacy friendly & open source based AI though, in all areas, so I hope this is Mozilla pushing for something sensible here.
AnAngryAlpaca@feddit.de 9 months ago
Things to add to your product when you want to look hip and trendy, but dont have any real ideas how to make your product better:
1990s: visitor counter 1995: Popups 2000s: flash intros 2005: stock photography 2010: local weather widget 2015: share to social media widgets 2020: fullsize 4k background stock videos 2023: AI assistant
havocpants@lemm.ee 9 months ago
1995: animated gifs, <marquee>, guest books, site rings!
Twig@sopuli.xyz 9 months ago
“Under Construction” GIF
rottingleaf@lemmy.zip 8 months ago
I’m not sure if you remember, but site rings were what you used instead of Google. They were useful.
And I’ve seen some guest books with lots of people at some point in my childhood, but about half a year after that everybody firmly chose in favor of hierarchical boards.
And I don’t share that hate for <marquee>, it served the purpose of showing you a long line in a small space, implicitly saying that it’s secondary temporary information, a bit like on TV.
And what’s wrong with animated GIFs, animation is nice.
Rozauhtuno@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 months ago
You forgot about blockchain and NFTs.
shotgun_crab@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Remember all those IE toolbars?
hglman@lemmy.ml 9 months ago
I got enough installed once to fill the whole screen.
buddascrayon@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Ugh…please don’t remind me.
HawlSera@lemm.ee 9 months ago
I miss guest books tbh
AnAngryAlpaca@feddit.de 9 months ago
They would be abused by spam bots in an instant, even before you could write your own “welcome to my guestbook” post.
lud@lemm.ee 9 months ago
And yet Microsoft added a weather (and bullshit) widget to windows in like 2020
kilgore_trout@feddit.it 9 months ago
I suppose many people were already using a third-party Aero widget for weather forecast since Windows 7.
I know I did.
rottingleaf@lemmy.zip 9 months ago
visitor counter
I actually liked those.
flash intros
These could be used to create right atmosphere.
local weather widget
Back then I hated those, but maybe showing local weather on desktop is not such a bad thing.
share to social media widgets
Hate. Hate. Hate.
neutron@thelemmy.club 9 months ago
It really grinds my gears. Why does my bank insist on installing an app to approve transactions, and why does that app have a huge background video playing every time i open it? It really should consist of an MFA code generator.
100_kg_90_de_belin@feddit.it 8 months ago
2015: share to social media widgets on porn sites
HerbalGamer@sh.itjust.works 9 months ago
dangblingus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 months ago
How about, and run with me on this, Mozilla stops trying to be Microsoft and Google and instead just provides the cleanest, most barebones-yet-privacy-oriented browser? Will they ever have market dominance? No, and they never will even with AI tools. Fuck AI and what it’s doing to the planet and fuck all of the capitalists enshittifying The Last Browser.
Wiz@midwest.social 8 months ago
A browser could be top dog if it was just less shitty than the others, like the Brother printers, that print without bloatware and mob tactics of HP.
We want a browser that just browses.
MisterD@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
But what about AI ? It has to be everywhere! Somebody please think about adding AI to Firefox! I need it to do ???
/s
Virulent@reddthat.com 8 months ago
At this point the only thing that could save Firefox is a rewrite
DAMunzy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 months ago
No! Not again!
Gwaer@lemmy.world 9 months ago
uggggggggggh. I’m using Firefox because chrome is really going too far with it’s manifest v3 garbage killing decent adblockere and Firefox is basically the only non chromium based option. Please for the love of everything that is holy. Just. Make. Your. Browser. Better. Don’t need ai gimmicks. Definitely don’t need to lay people off. You need to get back on track. Holy heck. This is the worst.
iopq@lemmy.world 9 months ago
AI will be great for translation of webpages locally instead of sending content over the wire
FabledAepitaph@lemmy.world 9 months ago
I can get behind this if everything is processed locally. Let my computer do the computing and stop harvesting my data, internet
idefix@sh.itjust.works 9 months ago
If the only use case is translation, that’s probably not a good business case.
jaemo@sh.itjust.works 9 months ago
My brother, I weep with you and agree with angrily gritted teeth at all your words.
laughterlaughter@lemmy.world 9 months ago
its* manifest v3 garbage.
mods_are_assholes@lemmy.world 8 months ago
FUCKING NO MOZILLA YOU WERE OUR LAST FUCKDAMN HOLDOUT
EmperorHenry@discuss.tchncs.de 8 months ago
they sold out to google and other advertising trackers a long time ago. Librewolf
RanchOnPancakes@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Gonna have to pass on that one good buddy. Don’t shit up Firefox.
hornedfiend@sopuli.xyz 8 months ago
why the fuck would I need an AI in a browser? 0 fucks given for this “feature”. firefox is devolving into an edge.
red_pigeon@lemm.ee 8 months ago
Oh come on, don’t be a troglodyte. Nowadays we are supposed to need AI everywhere. I’m waiting for my AI bidet so that I can chat with it when I do my business.
havokdj@lemmy.world 8 months ago
“What is my purpose?”
“You wash my asshole when I poop”
“Oh my god”
MisterD@lemmy.ca 8 months ago
Wiz@midwest.social 8 months ago
“It looks like you are browsing porn. Can I help?”
UnityDevice@startrek.website 8 months ago
You already have AI in Firefox - local translations for example. Developing local AI aligns perfectly well with Mozilla’s goals, but it seems people panic as soon as they see the two letters together.
Flumpkin@slrpnk.net 8 months ago
Theoretically I can imagine AI in the browser to be awesome to combat AI on the web. Let the AI wars begin!
mods_are_assholes@lemmy.world 8 months ago
You really have no fuckdamn naive your statement is. You don’t want an AI war and we cannot avoid one.
mods_are_assholes@lemmy.world 8 months ago
Desperate to gain marketshare, fucking samsung to apple. I hate it and I have no other options left after Firefox is enshittified
A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 9 months ago
You were the Chosen One! It was said that you would destroy the Sith, not join them! Bring balance to the browsers, not leave it in darkness!
foggy@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Been saying the writing is on the wall for their enshittification for months. Every time I end up with 20+ downvotes.
Eat me. Here it comes.
Still using Firefox until it officially sucks, but if you haven’t seen it coming you’ve been willfully ignorant.
FeelThePower@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 months ago
oh hey it’s you! I actually thought about your comments as soon as I saw this headline. I switched from Firefox to brave a few years ago, then recently switched to waterfox as they are again independent of system1 like before. the browser itself removes a lot of unnecessary Mozilla integrations and also reverts the proton UI. maybe forks like this or Librewolf are the future for this browser?
LdyMeow@sh.itjust.works 9 months ago
Willfully ignorant until the end. single browser for everything will be worse for sure
PrefersAwkward@lemmy.world 9 months ago
From what I understan, they’re divesting resources that aren’t in Firefox nor a trustworthy/open source AI.
I see a lot of people in this theead are upset at this, but I’m tentatively excited. If they can pull off a good AI engine, especially built into the browser, that would be nice. If it had offline capabilities, that would be amazing.
Even if they can pull off a good AI solution that’s not built into Firefox but it’s offline, I’d be really excited. I’m not crazy about having especially detailed and intimate information being thrown to some vendor out there, not knowing where it’s going. Modern AI can do some amazing things, but a lot of them reserve the right to have a human read whatever you put in themand warn you about that. This is too limiting to me for my preferred use-cases.
TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world 9 months ago
People read the headline and get angry, then want to tell everyone how angry they are
Reading into their AI plans - it’s to be run completely locally using only the data you want to give it, and it doesn’t send info back to Mozilla.
Now, personally, my biggest issues with AI is data collection and where the training data comes from. It seems for FF, neither of these will be problematic, so I don’t see the issue.
KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 months ago
Training data could still be an issue, but if anyone is going to do it right it’s Mozilla.
spaduf@slrpnk.net 9 months ago
Though, it’s tough to pull from the headline/discussion this pivot is explicitly meant to refocus on the browser.
As far as the AI stuff goes, Mozilla has long been the most ethical player in this space. All of their datasets/models are open source and usually crowdsourced. Not to mention, their existing work is primarily in improving accessibility. It’s really hard to see how this is a bad thing.
DingoBilly@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Enshittification continues.
Shape4985@lemmy.ml 9 months ago
Fuck sake. Sick of ai being added into everything. Please dont ruin firefox
Xeroxchasechase@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Whyyyy Mozilla? I want to love you, rally, but you wont let me.
neclimdul@lemmy.world 9 months ago
I want a upvote for sharing, down vote the concept button. I hate it.
As much as I hate it, think it’s a terrible part for a free, open, and secure web; it’s probably a solid business move based on the hype.
Bishma@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
This is a pretty effective ad for LibreWolf
shotgun_crab@lemmy.world 9 months ago
What a sad day to be alive
laughterlaughter@lemmy.world 9 months ago
as Firefox is the only browser that can’t trace its lineage back to Apple and WebKit
What a slap on Konqueror’s face.
normalexit@lemmy.world 9 months ago
I hate that they are laying people off. I do however want to use some machine learning powered adblock, for those harder to block ads, otherwise I don’t feel like every app needs an AI assistant. It’s bad for the Internet generally and for the power grid.
doctorcrimson@lemmy.world 8 months ago
So to recap, your choices are
-
One of 70 flavors of Chromium including the “privacy centric” Opera who run Chinese loan shark gangs for some reason, Edge which is Microsoft Chromium and aside from hardware acceleration capabilities is pretty meh, and Brave which despite operating their own separate search engine index are one of the most likely to sell your data and/or kidneys
-
Rapidly Enshitifying Firefox
-
Safari - no comment
-
Whatever the fuck Gecko is…
-
witx@lemmy.sdf.org 9 months ago
That’s a very good way of me leaving Firefox behind…
OldWoodFrame@lemm.ee 8 months ago
The paradox of tech right now “we are going to build the most complex technology known to man into our product in the next 12 months. Are we hiring record numbers of people to get it done? No. We fired a bunch of people and everyone else will just have to be extremely hardcore.”
maniacalmanicmania@aussie.zone 8 months ago
I hope the folks laid off land on their feet.
I’m starting to think FF is being deliberately run into the ground by the higher ups. It would be good to hear from some of the devs about their thoughts on all this.
kttnpunk@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Okay, well I’m ready to write a angry email now who’s with me? Anybody know the best address?
CriticalMiss@lemmy.world 9 months ago
And I’m still waiting to open source Pocket. Silly me.
pendulum_@lemmy.world 8 months ago
This surprises people? Mozilla has always been Mozilla’s biggest enemy.
mellowheat@suppo.fi 9 months ago
lol rip
tigerjerusalem@lemmy.world 9 months ago
You were the chosen one!
deweydecibel@lemmy.world 9 months ago
I don’t see them joining anything?
I mean, let’s be real, what major function has Mozilla implemented into Firefox that hasn’t been opt-out? And no, UI doesn’t count, I’m talking features.
The problem isn’t the existence of AI. The problem is the inescapably of it and how, under Microsoft or Google, it will harvest your data whether you like it or not. When you tell them “fuck off, leave me alone, and keep my words out of your AI’s mouth”, they’re not going to listen. Profit motive requires them to invade.
Mozilla is a non-profit, and they’ve long been very good about letting you opt out things, and listening. I’m not worried about them putting AI into Firefox, because I can be reasonably sure it will be optional, in a way I know the others won’t.
daltotron@lemmy.world 8 months ago
I can’t contest the first point cause I’m not a firefox junkie, so I won’t.
What I will contest is that the existence of AI, or, deep learning, or LLMs, or neural networks, or matrix multiplication, or whatever type of shit they come up with next, I’ll contest that it isn’t problematic. I kind of think it is, inherently, I think it’s existence is not great. Mostly because it obfuscates, even internally, the processing of data, it obfuscates the inputs from the outputs, the works from the results. You can do that with regular programming just fine, just as you can do most of the shit that AI does with normal programming, like that guy who made a program that calculates the prices for japanese baked goods and also recognizes cancer, right. But I think AI is a step further than that, it obfuscates it more. I kind of am skeptical of it’s broad implementation.
For trivial use cases, it’s kind of fine, but I think maybe use cases we might consider trivial, otherwise are kind of fucked, maybe. AI summary of an article? I dunno if that’s good. We might think, oh, this is kind of trivial because the user should just not really trust what the AI says, but, as with all technology, what if the user is an idiot and a moron? They might just use it to read the article for them, and then spout off whatever talking points and headlines it gives them. I can’t really think of a scenario where that’s actually a good thing, and it’s highly possible. It might make it easier to parse an article, like that, but I don’t think that’s actually a good or useful tool, it’s just presented a kind of illusion of utility, most especially because it was redundant (we could just write a summary and have it at the top of the article, like every article on the face of the earth), and it was totally beyond our control, at least, in most circumstances.
Also, the Mozilla Foundation is nonprofit, but the Mozilla Corporation is not. The Foundation manages the Corp, which manages Firefox development. So depending on which one you’re referring to, it might be a non-profit, or it might not be. In any case, the nonprofit is a step removed from Firefox development, which I think is an important side-note, even if it’s not actually that relevant to whatever conversations about AI there might be.