Submitted 3 weeks ago by schizoidman@lemmy.zip to technology@lemmy.world
cross-posted from: lemmy.zip/post/55094411
How do you "ban VPNs"? That's not how software works, and VPNs are... you know, a key part of a bunch of online infrastructure. I get that they mean "ban them to bypass restrictions", but the entire point of a VPN is you can't tell from the outside what it's being used for. You may as well ban thinking about butterflies. You can write it down, but you can't enforce it.
I actually want one country to ban VPNs just so every other country can see the fallout or complete lack of enforcement
VPNs are banned in some countries. At least in practice. China comes to mind and please nobody tell me „I have a friend in China and they use one!“ That friend is either breaking the law, or a state agent or foreigner where that law doesn‘t apply. Hotels have that as part of their service for tourists because why the hell would anyone travel to a country with basically no internet? Of course they are exempt.
But Chinese citizens are absolutely not allowed to use VPNs to break through the great firewall. The overwhelming majority wouldn‘t even know how. But of course most of them know at least one person who can.
So in theory the law is useless but in practice it‘s very effective to control information. Whatever the case it‘s nothing a democracy should pursuit. Ever.
They’ll do what Russia does with their online services. Have a registration scheme with noncompliant VPNs being outright banned.
Simple when you know which dictator to copy.
I guess that works for VPN services offering servers outside the country. That's not what VPNs are, though, and you still can't ban the concept of VPNs having a connection outside the country. VPN software is available open source and all it takes for it to connect abroad is my phone with a VPN connection to my home computer being abroad.
I mean, Russia (and even China) still have people using VPNs all over the place. This (and a lot of the push for age verification and comms backdoors) reeks of barely understanding the desired result and entirely misunderstanding how the tech works.
VPN bans amount to only allowing private companies to operate vpns for the purpose of infrastructure and commerce. It wouldn’t ban vpns entirely, but no average person would have the means within his country to be able to purchase or use one… legally.
While it would be sorta bad, it’s like taking the top layer off of the cake while leaving the rest.
There’s ways out, still, and there always will be. They can’t ban buying a vps from next door, and putting wireguard on it.
Precedent is already set by countries blocking them, it’s been done.
i guess we all should have fought back on internet censorship, rather than fallen back on “well i can still vpn”.
We really should have and we have had a good track record in doing so.
SOPA, PIPA targeting online piracy have not passed in the US because of the fighting efforts.
We shouldn't be content just because we use a VPN. Companies are getting smarter about handling VPNs by putting pressure on the companies themselves.
Yea, and by pressure you mean giving a big fat fuck you and sail the high seas? 🏴☠️
Denmark seems to want to fuck everything up lately, what’s their problem?
There’s a good chance this guy is just a moron.
The powers that be really don’t like the idea of unmonitored secure networks do they?
The whole country wants to ban VPNs?
Or just a small subset of politicians in the pocket of big corporations who see their profits meld because of their own greed?
What’s the difference?
Are you actually suggesting that the entire population of Denmark (aka, the entire country) is just
politicians in the pocket of big corporations
???
Gotta give Denmark credit, they're really going for the Shittiest Western European Country Award. Granted, I'm from the USA and we're obviously an unmitigated disaster, but like, what the fuck are you guys doing? Competing for attention?
The UK has entered the conversation, we will not be unseated in Europe. But yeah as hard as we try we pail in comparison to you guys, hopefully your inevitable implosion will serve as a warning to the rest of us aspiring authoritarianists… Probably not.
Are you kidding? Whatever collapse they are trying to cause over there will inevitably be done here too once they’re done. It’s like a concerted global fascist effort, and people are sleepwalking straight into it, it’s like they have some brain control machine.
Wait, shit, they do- the Internet.
Some US states are in the process of banning VPNs too, though. I’m afraid the USA remains the uncontested champion of being a shitty western country and it‘s not even close.
Some US States
None of the even remotely good ones. Why is Denmark trying to be Alabama, again?
Denmark is trying to implement a lot of straight up fascist laws lately…
maybe lemmy at large should see the commonalities between all govts of the world making these moves instead of picking on the most obvious example and taunting citizens to “do something”. It’s as if there’s a coordinated effort to lock the lower classes down before some kind of technology creates civil unrest worldwide.
But then again, I’m just a stoopid murican who should have fixed this by now. Not aimed at you, just a relevant jumping off point for the crap that floods these threads.
I notice this mainly from western countries. Asians and South Americans seem to recognize they arent immune from corruption and bullshit policy. Yet for some reason their western counterparts like to point the finger at other countries (namely the US) and diminish their VERY real problems. “You Americans elected a facist, what are you doing?!” Yet far right parties have been surging for the past decade in Europe and Australia.
Facism was literally birthed in the west yet they never think it will come back
Pls, technology?
Climate change and a war against china are the two triggers.
Shit’s getting extra shitty everywhere. Its like a couple of countries went a little fash and every politician across the globe went FUCK YEAH, LET US IN ON THAT SHIT!!!
Denmark is attempting Schrodinger’s VPN ban. Seems like every week it’s defeated and re-emerges. What a waste of administrative time.
What is happening with Europe and the countries within it?
Surveillance capitalism
Give it time, there are bills proposed in some states to do the same.
They are not the bastion of liberty that everyone thought they were. Oh look, proved once more. Capitalism corrupts and corrodes every single social program, legislation, and benefit in society.
In a turn that so many people saw coming, social democracy is not immune to the wiles and whims of capital and corruption. Just like any other form of capitalism, it too will decay and dissolve. The rich want nothing but literal, chain and whip slavery over the poor of the world. These assholes are so mentally ill, they genuinely CANNOT stop hoarding, and they are so twisted by power and wealth, they wholly envision themselves as gods.
This is what liberals fail to see: if the rich truly got/ will get their way, we will be chattel slaves for them and then when their AI gets good enough, they will hunt us for sport.
I don’t mean to sound like a tweaking lunatic, but I am so positive that if there is anything that we enjoy or have, the rich want us not to. They are so petty and obsessed, any situation we are in that is not literally beneath their feet is too good for us worthless poors.
We are standing on a MAJOR precipice, the liberal capitalism of old is gone, and they are gunning for everything we are and have now.
Not just capitalism but more Centralization of power in any of its many forms. We have way too much Centralization.
they didn’t pull back on chat control
Yea they did, it was revised to whatever this bs is, which is now also being revised.
Once again, I would like to thank stupid politicians and greedy media conglomerates for their contributions to media piracy. If not for all their hard work, we would still be playing Russian Roulette with shitty DIVX rips on Limewire.
What the hell is a foreign illegal stream?
I think they are a series that are not available in some countries.
“Oh no! We must protect the poor MPA! The poor organization that’s been hell bent on policing what films and media ought to contain and ensuring the multi-million dollar corporations make their millions in peace!” ~ Denmark’s Ministry of Culture, probably
It’s already been taken off. The guy who requested this is a complete asshole that needs to be thrown out of office immidietly.
I hate journalism so much these days…
Random dude in the parliament: “Let’s all shit our pants.”
“Journalists”: “Denmark wants to shit its pants!!”
The Supreme Court equivalent tried that in Brazil, but soon discovered all government digital infrastructure depends on it and backpedaled.
I’m hearing a lot about zero trust infrastructure lately and I wonder if this is the reason - the desire to eliminate VPNs. I honestly don’t know enough about IT to know if that even makes sense but it wouldn’t surprise me if these big corpos see the writing on the wall and are figuring out how to work sans VPN.
Denmark: everything is hygge unless you are Inuit or a Refugee. Now add free Internet to the exception list.
Until someone tells them how corporate IT works.
If the corporate VPNs keep logs and allow government access, they will be allowed. That’s how it works in some (authoritarian) countries.
It’s really telling how over the last few months, the overlap of “Oh, WTF is this?” between Privacy and Technology communities have aligned more and more.
utskitet av kalk och vatten…
I mean, logically, it would make sense to push VPNs into illegality or create a lot of gray area there if you’re also planning to introduce the Aussie social media ban. Logically. I personally think both are no good.
I’ve read some headlines about illegal streaming being targeted and shut down in Europe. If there was lobby money invested, I suspect it is the likes of sports rights holders who would like you to pay them extortionate amounts of money and not sail the high seas for the price of a VPN.
Modstå, kære dansker.
If omnipotent deity of your choice forbid this ever lands at the ECJ I’m not sure they will side with the privacy/freedom of speech side of the argument.
What is going on with this vpn banning bullshit. This would render so many banking apps completely useless.
FINALLY! What took them so long!? I mean it’s a totalitarian grab, but seriously, if I was behind this. I would have immediately made VPN’s illegal. Then tracking what my citizens do online, would have been made much easier!
Don’t worry, the EU would never let this happen…
The EU that seems to be considering the evil “chat control” law to spy on everyone’s private messages? Yeah, right. Von der Leyen is a snooper at heart.
They’re probably referencing Chat Control (fightchatcontrol.eu)
Multiplexer@discuss.tchncs.de 3 weeks ago
What the hell is happening in Denmark at the moment??
First forcing chat control upon Europe, now this?
I looked up their government, would have expected far right or so, but it is liberal social democrat…
So what happens here?
gratux@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 weeks ago
My bet is on a lot of bigtech
bribeslobbyingMultiplexer@discuss.tchncs.de 3 weeks ago
Big Tech has no interest in chat control, though.
They vehemently opposed it from the start.
How the Danish are acting just doesn’t make sense…
WereHacker@lemmy.ml 3 weeks ago
Don’t be fooled by the party names. You have to look at the policies and consequences. Danes like to feel progressive, have left leaning stuff like free education and totalitarian measures against stuff they fear. The social democratic party remained in power after Germany moved troops into Denmark in 1940. It should tell you a lot.
cecilkorik@piefed.ca 3 weeks ago
There are fascists subverting every location on the political spectrum, none of them are immune. We’ve been trained to think in terms of “left” or “right” but these fuckers are coming at us sideways and corrupting our whole politcal spectrum at once. Don’t fall for it, pay attention to actions, not labels.
eleitl@lemmy.zip 3 weeks ago
Denmark resistance lasted for the whole 6 hours.
EndlessNightmare@reddthat.com 3 weeks ago
Something is rotten in Denmark.
Dojan@pawb.social 3 weeks ago
It isn’t just Denmark. You see it here in Sweden, too. I’d be surprised if you didn’t see it across Europe.
I’m not really happy with any of the big political parties here in Sweden. The Greens hate nuclear power so much they’d prefer to open up fossil fuelled power plants than keep nuclear ones up and running. The Left party work really hard to get out of the EU. These are both parties I align the best with.
The Social Democrats are just these milquetoast soft-core conservatives, pretending to care about issues but turning their coats the second they get the chance. Unfortunately they always end up leading any of the left-winged government coalitions, typically with the help from the Centre who then gets to dictate all the policies.
It’s been like this for well over a decade at this point. Useless bunch, the lot of them.
bumblefumble@mander.xyz 3 weeks ago
The soc.dem. are not a left party anymore. The current government consists of three different center-right parties. And they have some weird priorities sometimes.
tjoa@feddit.org 3 weeks ago
The social democrats copied a lot of anti immigration talking points from the right because this seems to be just popular in Denmark. I guess they are just weird.
stoy@lemmy.zip 3 weeks ago
But these laws are not anti immigration, they are anti freedom in general.
evilcultist@sh.itjust.works 3 weeks ago
I wonder how much it has to do with the success and subsequent loss of this operation: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Trojan_Shield
Because it seems like a lot of countries in the west are pushing this kind of thing rover the last several years and there’s a heavy push right now. privacyguides.org/…/taylor-lorenz-on-kosa-the-scr…