Submitted 1 year ago by L4s@lemmy.world [bot] to technology@lemmy.world
https://www.businessinsider.com/tech-workers-comments-170k-ups-driver-deal-anger-admiration-2023-8
Tech workers react to UPS drivers landing a $170,000 a year package with a mixture of anger and admiration::Some tech workers questioned whether UPS drivers deserved high pay — others jumped in to note the importance of the jobs and harsh working conditions.
tech workers: i’m underpaid and everyone else should be too!
fucking unionize already. tired of this crabs-in-a-bucket mentality
Or, perhaps this article is just trying to sow discord between workers.
One of the old tricks in the books to make people despise unions is to take the very best union deals and sensationalize them, so that others hate the union out of jealousy.
Make it appear like the UPS driver is getting paid $170K for 32 hours of work, in a fully A/C’d vehicle on a short, easy route, starting pay, right out of college without a degree, four weeks of vacation yada yada.
When in reality, the $170K probably only kicks in if you take the absolute worst routes, worst shifts (weekend/night) with max overtime and even then, a third of it is retirement, insurance and health care contributions. And you only get the max after 10 or 20 years of service, if they didn’t fire you as you increased.
During an earnings call on Tuesday, UPS CEO Carol Tomé said that by the end of its five-year contract with the Teamsters union, the average full-time UPS driver would make about $170,000 in annual pay and benefits, such as healthcare and pension benefits.
The headline is sensationalized for sure. But the article itself actually makes the point that the tech workers are misunderstanding that the $170k figure includes both salary and benefits.
“This is disappointing, how is possible that a driver makes much more than average Engineer in R&D?” a worker at the autonomous trucking company TuSimple wrote on Blind, an anonymous jop-posting site that verifies users’ employment using their company email. “To get a base salary of $170k you know you need to work hard as an Engineer, this sucks.”
It is important to note that the $170,000 figure represents the entire value of the UPS package, including benefits and does not represent the base salary. Currently, UPS drivers make an average of around $95,000 per year with an additional $50,000 in benefits, according to the company. The average median salary for an engineer in the US is $103,845 with a base pay of about $91,958, according to Glassdoor. And TuSimple research engineers can make between $161,000 to $250,000 in compensation, Glassdoor data shows.
On the whole though this is a useless article covering drama on Blind, wrapped up with a ragebait headline.
I think people just don’t realize how underpaid they are. They think that because they make six figures, that means they’re getting paid what they’re worth.
If you were paid what you were worth the company wouldn’t make any money.
Corporations exist by the excess value of their workers’ labor, by definition.
Some tech workers. This is just a stupid ragebait piece.
They’re quoting Blund users though, Blind is a cesspool of silicon Valley tech bros. It’s often just a dick measuring contest between FAANG workers about who makes more money.
Fuck off with this class war baiting bullshit
Tech workers need to ask themselves why their boss makes more than them for doing nothing
There’s no way any substantial amount of tech workers are concerned about what UPS workers are making. These kinds of articles are rage bait targeted at “low skill” workers to make them furious at what they perceive to be high salary earners complaining about “blue collar” workers earning more money.
All of this bullshit is a distraction from the fact that the middle class is shrinking at a massive rate and the lower class is being turned against itself so nobody can rightfully blame the rich.
Fuck this article and the hatred it’s designed to generate. This is all bullshit.
Tech worker here. I’m gd pleased to bits for anyone making a decent income. Congrats UPS drivers. Do teachers next!
Ah. The anti-union propaganda has begun to stop the tech industry from unionizing, lol.
They are scared they will and with good reason. A strong union will level the playing field.
You’d think these complainers would realize it’s great when other jobs get a massive raise… because those engineers can now say “Why should I work here and deal with your nonsense when UPS drivers are making near 100K in low cost of living income areas?”
Like, please please please let the cashiers at walmart start making 30 dollars an hour so I can tell my boss that I need a raise or I’m dipping to walmart.
Holy hell, I wish more people got this concept.
They don’t have to worry too much about us tech workers unionizing because the tech world is full of more introverts on average than other (especially blue collar) fields. And a lot of us are constantly scared of getting fired or replaced.
So many of us still believe the lie that our individual hard work will be rewarded.
It’s going to be a while.
I was fantasizing a bit about becoming wealthy enough to stop working, and it occurred to me that the actual best thing to do if I’m ever in that position would be to start talking with my coworkers about unionizing. Then maybe even get fired for it and sue for more money. Money I’d probably plow back into unionizing tech workers.
I like your way o thinking
As a tech worker, I say good for them.
As a fellow tech worker, I agree. Probably most tech workers would agree, but since that’s boring, this article focuses on the opinion of just “some tech workers on social media”. So dumb.
Like 3 ancient jaded guys that are working on network infrastructure for a small hospital in Montana posted on Xwitter that they’re upset. 10000 bots reposted it…now it’s newsworthy.
“some tech workers on social media”. “some tech workers on blind”. Even worse
As a tech worker in Europe, the concept of “deserving” or “not deserving” a specific number has always been a total joke. Your salary is like 80% determined by location alone.
This is a little misleading. It’s $170k in pay and benefits, not just salary. Still, UPS drivers deserve it and this will make everyone’s experience with UPS so much better.
“This is disappointing, how is possible that a driver makes much more than average Engineer in R&D?”
Because the engineer is being exploited and refuses to unionize.
“To get a base salary of $170k you know you need to work hard as an Engineer, this sucks.”
Bitch, UPS workers work harder than I ever did as an electronics engineer.
“To get a base salary of $170k you know you need to work hard as an Engineer, this sucks.”
Bitch, UPS workers work harder than I ever did as an electronics engineer.
If he wants the $170k so badly, he should go get a job as a driver then.
“To get a base salary of $170k you know you need to work hard as an Engineer, this sucks.”
As someone who has worked as a UPS driver and now as a software developer, I can say that the UPS drivers definitely work harder than your average engineer.
That quote is also deftly ignoring the fact that you’re generally paid for the value you generate, not how hard to you work.
Generally you’re paid the least they can get away with (with some variance in what they think that is).
It generally requires a union to get paid closer to the value you generate.
As a tech worker in rhe U.S. we are definitely not being exploited. I’m all for unions but we’re doing just fine.
Narrator, as Elon dances over Twitter headquarters with strobe lights and Google charges employees $99 per night to stay at their own hotel:
“They were being exploited.”
Let’s just say that some tech workers in the US are being exploited more than others. A lot more
I hear what you’re saying: we’re very well compensated. But think of the profit your team helps generate for your employer. It is a lot more than the combined salaries of the people who actually make the product / service.
Fucking truth, especially for software engineers. I spent most of today debating whether to use npm or pnpm for some project that’s probably just going to get mothballed anyway.
I mean I know my worth, but I definitely don’t work even 1/23rd as hard as even the laziest delivery driver imaginable. Even pretending to be a delivery driver is more work than my actual job.
I’m starting to think people should be forced to have at least 1 year of experience in a, so called, blue-collar job before they are allowed to have an office job.
As one of the tech workers: fuck yeah, good for them for negotiating well, and getting what they’re owed.
This is also why most jobs should be unionized
Maybe. I know shipping things via UPS is about to get a lot more expensive, and maybe it should be.
I have worked as a driver helper in the past. This pay makes sense. It’s a demanding job mentally and physically. With the pay being good it also means people work really hard to get that job and really hard to keep it. Congratulations to them.
As a tech worker, good for them. Why would I be opposed to someone else getting paid more, especially if they’re being paid by a private company whose services I enjoy?
My guess the naysayers are toxic tech bros. There are some really toxic tech bros. More accurate, there are some really toxic people in tech only as a means to a high salary.
Same reason straight people are opposed to gay marriage? Who the fuck knows
Blind is a tech bro incel cesspool sometimes.
Wow good for UPS workers. As a tech worker I can say I’m genuinely happy for them. They have a hard ass job. A win for labor is a win for labor, regardless of which type.
And it’s not like their win is our loss. Why would we fight amongst ourselves? It’s the ultra-rich we should be sizing up.
If we divide, we’ll be conquered. That wisom is at least two thousand years old by now. Better to unite and defy.
I have a pro-driver pro-union UPS placard in my window and a “Unionize Amazon” sticker on my hoodie. I’m happy for UPS workers. They fought and won a much better contract. It’s genuinely exciting that there’s so much positive union activity in the USA right now.
It’s because people are realizing it works. Like airline attendants are on the picket line with the actors and the writers now. A win for any of them is a win for all of us. Power to the people baby
We had decades of low union activity that gave corporations the chance to show how well they would take care of us on their own.
And they super fucked entire generations of workers.
Now people must unionize, or their dirt salaries will lose them their rented homes and starve their kids. So we’re seeing a blossoming of union activity in many sectors.
It’s time for workers to have a tiny slice of those mega-profits corporations have been earning off our backs.
Unionize America!
A UPS driving job is a hell of a lot more difficult and tiring than most tech jobs. It might take less skill, but tech workers don’t have to be out in the heat or freezing cold all day carrying heavy loads and dealing with angry people who blame them for a late package or, worse, get shot at for the crime of being in the neighborhood while black.
Driving quickly but safely with an oversized vehicle is a skill.
Preparing so you can survive on the road for an entire day, is a skill.
Delivering loads of items on a tight schedule, despite all the shit that life is going to throw at you (accidents, roadworks, dog attacks, etc) is a skill.
Can we stop with this “low skill” bullshit? Most white-collar workers wouldn’t last a week in one of these jobs. The low/high skill classification is just a way for the managerial classes to justify their outsized profiteering remuneration.
This is true. Hence why garbage men are paid quite a lot. Low skill but a very difficult job.
Some tech workers on social media
This isn’t fucking news! Enough of this dumb ragebait bullshit.
Omg you wouldn’t believe, someone on the internet was an asshole!
It’s a tactic to pit us against each other rather then the proper people running to the bank.
Well shit, if you look at the top comments in this thread it’s absolutely working
I think many people are misreading the article. The package is 170k. That doesn’t mean the driver is making 170k.
Even if they did. Good for them.
I’m glad the new trucks will get AC. I thought they was insane they didn’t have it.

We all do better when we all do better.
As someone who has only worked freight in an air-conditioned warehouse, moving boxes is not easy work and not many people will be able to do it their whole careers. I’m personally glad I argue with computers for my job now and I have much respect for those lifting things in the elements.
“A rising tide lifts all boats” is something Republicans say is impossible because God wouldn’t let the liberal commie boats rise with the patriot boats.
“A rising tide lifts all boats” is something Republicans say is impossible because God wouldn’t let the
liberal commie boatspeasant fishing rowboats rise with thepatriot boatsyachts.
The context is all wrong. It is less money for CEOs, not less for tech workers. Good job teamsters.
My UPS guy deserves every penny of it.
My housing development is a confusing maze of twisty streets. The street I live on takes multiple turns where another street starts when my street should have gone straight on. My UPS person deserves every penny just for being able to figure out which house is which.
They earn every dollar because I would nope the fuck out of there so fast
yep
I’ll take my lower salary to sit in my home office with central air
I wouldn’t last a day as a driver with their expectations and the need to move/lift heavy packages in the heat
Can we react more about trust fund managers and CxO salaries instead?
Interestingly, we sort of can’t. Someone would have to write an article about it and no large, for-profit media company would publish it.
As someone in tech who also has a friend that works for UPS, this is amazing for them! Anything that can improve their lives is a win. UPS people who incredibly hard (regardless of how much shit I give my friend when UPS does something silly with my deliveries)
Complaining about this is dumb. Someone else’s gain isn’t your loss. Everyone outside the top tier earners should be paid more. Period. I’m happy a union had the national stage representing UPS workers and showed why unions are important.
I work in tech and have enjoyed good salaries, I wish everyone was so fortunate.
It would actually be a huge relief to know that there are many career options for me, because sometimes I really want to do something else.
Tech workers have no right to be angry. Unionize or shut up. (Excluding all the supportive tech workers, including those in the comments.) Source: am a tech worker
I’ve never understood the idea of being mad about what another industry is making. They make more money than you? Great go put in an application. Don’t want to work in that industry? Then maybe they deserve the better pay. If you truly think you are that superior to the other industry then use their pay to bargain at your own job.
If you’re a nurse who’s working long hours at a job that requires an education and you’re getting paid the same as a McDonald’s cook, don’t be mad at the cook, be mad at your employer. Go to them and demand a raise, and say I could work there for the same pay, spend more time with my family and not be responsible for keeping people alive. Pay me or I’m going to peace out.
The drivers deserve the pay more than the C Suite.
I’m a tech executive… good for UPS workers. That’s what unions are for, to balance out investors’ demands and get people paid fairly.
I know someone in his 20s who makes $41 and some change per hour plus $150 per diem…
7 days on and 7 days off…
“Unskilled” coal mine work.
It’s pretty damn insulting to be honest as someone who’s been in the technology industry for over 25 years when I have to deal with companies and recruiters thinking that my labor is somehow worth less than that.
Hell, I made more than that 18 years ago (and I still do as an hourly without the per diem) but now I get dipshit recruiters emailing and calling me constantly thinking I should be willing to work for $25 an hour or even sometimes less.
It’s like I’m living in fucking crazy world.
Not sure why that is but energy jobs pay a lot. Had a friend who worked on an oil rig and made about 400k
Seems pretty crazy really…
As a tech worker for over 25 years, I say good for them.
Hell, if my back, knees and neck weren’t already fucked, I’d be damned tempted to start driving for UPS.
I’m already kind of nearing a point where a move away from tech is appealing, but even if I accept the idea of some reduction in pay, I’m at a loss for what I can do that wouldn’t see me losing half my income which would just be more than I’d like to bear.
Yea. Theres assholes with shitty opinions in all fields of life.
I’ve been in tech for 3 decades now…and I have nothing but applause for UPS drivers landing this package.
Why would tech workers have a problem with this? From my perspective, that’s just one more industry I can consider hopping to if my employer doesn’t start getting their shit together when it comes to compensation packages. The more choices available to tech workers, then less beholden they are to their own employers.
UPS drivers getting this deal is better for everyone, in every industry.
BonesOfTheMoon@lemmy.world 1 year ago
The amount of shit a delivery driver puts up with? They certainly deserve it. Good on them, we should all be well paid, and thinking otherwise is Stockholm syndrome.
HerrLewakaas@feddit.de 1 year ago
Meanwhile software devs? We sit around in a comfy meeting room sipping coffee and are occasionally a bit stressed. Sure there’s exceptions, but most devs I know have it pretty good while making a shit ton of money
BonesOfTheMoon@lemmy.world 1 year ago
And I will add that you also deserve to be well paid and have your own stressors and those matter too. We all deserve a good wage. What’s the point otherwise?
But I’m especially glad because delivery drivers are often treated poorly.
oakey66@lemmy.world 1 year ago
This is in no way to undermine the argument that UPS drivers deserve every penny they get paid. I am regularly very stressed out by my current client. Consulting can be an absolute bitch.
ShowMeYourLemmies@lemmynsfw.com 1 year ago
100%. Besides, a rising tide lifts all boats. Personally I’m thrilled for them. If anything I see this as an agenda piece. “Hey group 1, talk trash about group 2”.
jecxjo@midwest.social 1 year ago
Damn, I must have had the wrong dev job. Did one for 13 years where i had to wear flame retardant clothes, drive up mountains in the winter and sit out in the desert in the summer, annual training as a first responder. But I did sip a lot of coffee and have a lot of stress.
alchemist_28@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Well the one thing that pandemic has taught us is that people are never satisfied no matter how much they get. Before the pandemic, nobody gave a flying shit in the tech world, specifically the devs about work from home or hybrid work nature. But somehow now they are entitled to it. Still the tech giants obliged and are allowing them to work from home. Now they are pissed that someone who works physically and deliver items to their door steps is earning as much as they are while they sit on their fat asses watching a screen. Sure they have other deadlines and stuff which the drivers won’t have to face, but don’t be so fucking greedy and jealous when someone is getting paid for their hard work.
C4d@lemmy.world 1 year ago
That crab mentality (crabs in a bucket) can be hard to shake but it’s got to go. The Boondocks explained it nicely (short SFW extract from an otherwise NSFW TV programme here - www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipg4EL_JUyE)
PipedLinkBot@feddit.rocks [bot] 1 year ago
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