Good. It was a naked attempt at a shakedown, and also 100% a bluff. TSMC honestly should cancel/rescind all the fab construction they’re starting to spin up in the US, honestly. Now is emphatically not the time to undermine their strategic defense policy, which largely revolves around “if the CCP invades, we will melt our chip fabs to slag”.
Taiwan refuses to move half of U.S.-bound chip production to American shores — trade discussion to be focused on Section 232 investigation for preferential deal on semiconductors
Submitted 1 day ago by commander@lemmy.world to technology@lemmy.world
Comments
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
MITM0@lemmy.world 40 minutes ago
Why do you assume China is inferior in Chip manufacturing ??
takeda@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
The idea behind that fab was so US can continue to build weapons if Taiwan was under attack, this why it wasn’t the latest technology. The weapons would still be important to defend it, but yeah this admin is signalling Taiwan won’t get help and is asking for 50% so it won’t suffer consequences of not helping them.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
seems very dumb
Kinda the MO of this regime, if we’re being honest
Dozzi92@lemmy.world 15 hours ago
Yeah, I think the whole idea of the US wanting the chips produced inside its own borders makes sense in a vacuum. China fucks around (which, sure, is against their character), chips are safe.
Obviously we don’t live in a vacuum, and the US diplomatic mission is, at best, totally unreadable, and at worst, won’t help anyone but itself.
As with just about any other nation, the US is using what is ostensibly it’s only bargaining chip these days, their massive consumerism, knowing that Taiwan sells the majority of its chips to the US.
This play seems to be Trump’s only play: Demand something outrageous, with some thinly veiled threats overlaying the demand. Get rejected. Receive counterproposal that is far, far less than initial demand. Tout superiority.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Good. It was a naked attempt at a shakedown, and also 100% a bluff.
It takes more than a few years to spin up a chip fab, with an outlay on the order of hundreds of billions to trillions of dollars. Even if they’d been eager to take the US up on the deal (and why would they want to relinquish a functional monopoly on cutting end processors?), there’s no way they’d be dealing with the same administration by the time it was completed. Even if Trump was still in office, the fucker changes his mind every five minutes. Not conducive to long-term economic projects like this.
Now is emphatically not the time to undermine their strategic defense policy, which largely revolves around “if the CCP invades, we will melt our chip fabs to slag”.
TSMC won’t have their edge forever. China’s fabs are catching up quickly, with 5nm chips in production and 3nm chips possible in a few more years. This was a good strategy when China needed to import these chips and Taiwan had the market cornered. But if TSMC’s rigged-to-explode labs go up in smoke after China’s a major player in the market, that actually benefits Beijing.
Strapping yourself with Semtex might be a savvy play in a single moment, but it’s not going to work long term.
That’s before you consider the real threat Taiwan poses to China is as a launchpad for US strikes into the interior.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
Oh I know - but I’m saying they should halt efforts now, because they’ve been going on for several years (I think close to 4-5?) at this point.
I was also under the impression that Mainland was still meaningfully behind the cutting edge, that TSMC was absolutely not resting on their laurels, and that the prospect of the CCP fabs fully catching up isn’t super likely. Out of curiosity, do you have any references/articles about recent CSMC/etc lithography advancements?
CIA_chatbot@lemmy.world 1 day ago
This, moving chip production is basically telling China to invade
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 11 hours ago
plus its likely not go to built domestically anyways, all the logistic and costs, plus hiring more expensive domestic employees.
DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works 17 hours ago
“Give up your only bargaining chip otherwise we’ll hurt you!”
Hmm wonder where I’ve seen this before…
ahem Russia-Ukraine ahem
elucubra@sopuli.xyz 4 hours ago
Bargaining chip. Hehe, I see what you did there.
DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works 3 hours ago
Lol, pun wasn’t intended, but this is such a lovely coincidence
Inaminate_Carbon_Rod@lemmy.world 10 hours ago
It probably would have been on the table if Kamala had won.
I mean, the democrats just had to have a primary, put in a populist and watch Trump get buried.
Instead we have this.
phoenixz@lemmy.ca 22 hours ago
Hey, why don’t you give us the one thing that protects you and floats your economy?
Just do it!
sbv@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
What? Taiwan doesn’t want to give up its only strategic advantage? I’m shocked.
/uj
I’m curious how long it would take to build the supply chains and fabs to make the 50% things a reality.
Zombiepirate@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Gee, I wonder why other countries would not want to move production to the US after ICE arrested the Koreans who were doing exactly that?
No way to know, I guess.
floofloof@lemmy.ca 1 day ago
Especially when the only thing keeping you protected from invasion is that only your country has those production facilities.
gian@lemmy.grys.it 7 hours ago
And probably it is also the only thing that China wants so that can try to corner the market. But if they move half of the production oversea then they probably will become less appetible for China since they cannot really control the production.
Not that they must do it, just a consideration.squaresinger@lemmy.world 23 hours ago
It’s quite interesting that no other country has managed to build a chip foundry that would even remotely rival TSMC.
Especially considering they use third-party lithography machines.
DarkCloud@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Between an Authoritarian and a Fascist.
teft@piefed.social 1 day ago
A ROC between two hard places.
DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works 17 hours ago
LMFAO
So… is PRC pronounced… PRiCk?
Btw, USA pronounced OOo-sah
ThePyroPython@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Poland: First time?
oce@jlai.lu 1 day ago
Not sure which is which, it seems to be applicable to both.
whereyaaat@lemmings.world 14 hours ago
Honestly, the best option for everyone involved except warhawks would be to literally fund the Taiwanese to relocate to the US.
DupaCycki@lemmy.world 3 hours ago
I’m sorry, but who is “everyone involved”?
vane@lemmy.world 7 hours ago
Taiwan Population 23 396 049. To give some example NYC population 8 478 072. So you need to build 3 NYC to move Taiwan. You might as well build a big spaceship that can pick island and move it next to Hawaii.
M0oP0o@mander.xyz 13 hours ago
Or and hear me out on this, americans can learn to stop using semiconductors. Maybe go to abacus and toes.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 11 hours ago
abacus might be to complex for the inbred R voters.
takeda@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
No surprise, when this admin is sending signals that it won’t help. Doing what they are asking would allow US to give Taiwan to China without much consequences to US.
altphoto@lemmy.today 16 hours ago
Wait hold on, I gotta take my wife over to the neighbor. He just wants to abuse her. Oh me? Oh okay, I suppose so! Well I’ll be back in a few hours he actually wants to do me only, he says. Ofcourse that’s what I would have to do if anyone else needs my body. How about 50%?
redbrick@lemmy.world 1 day ago
feels almost like someone asked to give up their nukes. Okay maybe that was a bit exaggerated…
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 11 hours ago
giving up thier sole resource, more like giving thier OIL reserves up.
goatinspace@feddit.org 1 day ago
betanumerus@lemmy.ca 32 minutes ago
Who the heck wants to move production to such an openly racist country.