Submitted 9 months ago by L4s@lemmy.world [bot] to technology@lemmy.world
https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/14/24072792/apple-vision-pro-early-adopters-returns
Apple fans are starting to return their Vision Pros::The return window for the very first Apple Vision Pro buyers is fast approaching — and some have taken to social media to explain why they won’t be keeping their headsets.
These are the same complaints most report for most vr headsets, headaches, nausea and dry eyes… Disappointing article.
Some are, sure. But others have to do with the weight. The most interesting rationals for returning it are because it’s shit as a productivity tool. So if you can’t really use it for work, there aren’t many games on it, then why are you keeping it? At that point it’s just a TV that only you can watch (since it doesn’t support multiple user profiles).
It’s obviously made for porn only, that’s they only thing you can do with it
Same Apple story: great hardware, but their walled ecosystem. They would sell so many more units if they were compatible with software used by millions of people and corporations…
The other thing I keep hearing is that it’s a super expensive purchase that people don’t know what to do with once they’ve got it. I’m old enough to remember when they said the same thing about early home computers from the late 70s and early 80s.
Silicon and engineering has come down in price and vr is hardly revolutionary at this point so yea price point is stupid high but what do people expect from apple
Given the odd weight distribution, it’s also unfortunate that this may have been their first headset.
Making a VR headset from aluminium and glass with nothing to balance it in the back is yet again another perfect example of Apple going hard with form over function.
Your comment suggests you read the first paragraph and didn’t read the rest which is disappointing.
The article talks about the most common complaint being comfort, then goes on to other complaints like the fact it offers no productivity savings and is expensive.
It’s a bit of a no brainer though at end of day. Anyone surprised this is just a gimmick like any other is new to the VR space.
Yea looking at the site I mistook the large gaps between paragraphs to be the end of the article. Going over it and I can see I missed a large deal. But I am still unsurprised with the reasons why people are returning the headsets. Its expensive, sold for productivity yet is restricting and uncomfortable. Vr has a place in the world and that is mostly media consumption.
Some people are returning it because they had expectations that using VR would be immediately comfortable. The headset is heavier and more poorly strapped/distributed than ‘alternatives’ but it’s also graphically far more stunning. I honestly hope they stay in the game and push the competitors to up their game. maybe we can get pancake lenses, foveated rendering and eye tracking in a $1500 package.
So the quest pro? Foveated rendering only matters if you don’t have the graphics throughput to render it all, so I don’t totally buy that it’s key to a good vr headset so much as helps you get away with cheaper silicon. Maybe enough-lower tdp that it enables slimmer design.
I think foveated rendering also helps with immersion. Being able to blur things you are not specifically looking at and are farther away is a closer match to reality.
I don’t really look at it as a symptom of lack of graphics throughput, but more as a benefit of eye tracking, which is also potentially something that benefits, say, the immersion of others through portraying your facial expressions more realistically, or something to that effect. You could also use it as a kind of peripheral for games or software, and apple currently uses it as a mouse, so it’s not totally useless. But I also can’t imagine that most developers are going to be imaginative enough to make good use of it, if we can’t even think of good uses for basic shit, like haptic feedback.
Perhaps it breaks even in terms of allowing them to save money they otherwise would’ve spent on rendering, but I dunno if that’s the case, since the camera has to be pretty low latency, and you have to still dedicate hardware resources to the eye tracking and foveated rendering in order to get it to look good. Weight savings, then? I just don’t really know. I guess we’ll see, if it gets more industry adoption.
Sounds exactly what pimax crystal offers
Problem is it comes with pimax customer support
Make it standalone and there you are.
Portal buyers would be suspicious
The problem with this article is that it’s all circumstantial. Sure these are people complaining of problems and critiques, but we’ll never get the full report of how many returns there actually are and why they were returned. That’s just not data Apple will ever give out.
it’s probably not even circumstantial. I think it’s just a cool trend to write articles about how bad the next new experimental tech product for rich people is.
Can’t use it for games. Can’t use it for porn. What is it for?
For showing off. Of course.
It runs Steam Link very well and has a number of built in games too. And it runs porn great, just not the stereoscopic videos by default, but you can sideload an app for that too.
Yeah, but surely you’d want actual VR games, rather than just Steam Link to a big virtual screen.
Half Life Alyx is a great game, but there’s no way it would ever come to this headset just because of the lack of VR controllers.
Wait why couldn’t you use it for porn
3D VR porn. You can still watch 2D pornhub porn.
some are rieviwers, i betcha.
Some? Probably most. The others are social media “influencers” making it look like someone would actuality want to buy it.
Yaaah.
Don’t most reviewers get their sets for free?
That depends on the company that is selling the product, and the reputation of the reviewer.
IGN always give 9/10 for every game they review so they are high on the priority list to get review copies. But they won’t get any if the seller isn’t interested in sending any.
I don’t think Apple is giving away 3500 devices for free to a long list of people.
not the freelance ones, or not always anyway. i think you’re right about the ones that wrote for tech blogs.
The problem with AVP is that it constantly feels extremely lonely. The fun part about VR is playing stuff together, games, being in the same room even if others are in different countries jave funny full size avatars, interact in a “vr-chat” kind of way. VR is supposed to be a fun version of our world. AVP is extremely serious, too “professional” focused, and especially b o r i n g. All you do on AVP is exactly the same that you would do by yourself with your current devices already. Just even more isolated from the world.
I keep reading AVP as Alien vs. Predator, which makes this hilarious. Sorry… that’s on me.
AVP is extremely serious, too “professional” focused, and especially b o r i n g.
But what about the part where the Predator body-slams an Alien? That wasn’t boring! :P
Nah, me too. My A-Level Physics teacher had it on Atari Jaguar.
AVP, yes its well crafted and polished, but it does basically nothing and feels lonely inside it
Gilded cage sort of vibe, yes.
Apple deserves to be humbled for once!
Apple sucks.
I’ve been in the Apple ecosystem for pretty much most of my life, and I’m all for what the AVP is bringing to the table. However, one VR enthusiast Youtuber I watched recently (Thrillseeker) put down the most compelling argument against the AVP I’ve seen thus far. The AVP does well what all the other headsets don’t, but the AVP also kind of sucks at what other headsets have learned to do well. At the price of the AVP, not only could you buy a Quest 3, but you’d have enough leftover to just build an entire VR Gaming rig to back it up. Then you’d have a setup exponentially more capable than what the AVP is offering.
There’s a lot of salient points here, except I have a gaming rig and a high end headset and it’s tied down to one room. The sensors are mounted on the wall and my gigantic PC isn’t going anywhere. The controllers are usually dead, the sensors disconnect when my cats pull the cords. It takes a while for anything to load up and my room has to remain clean and empty. The Vision Pro can just go on anytime anywhere and I just gesture to use it. I can stream Steam Link from my gaming PC to allow me to game anywhere and AVP pairs with my Xbox controller. I can take the AVP to work and look at my Mac mini and start working in it. Sure, the setup you describe is more capable for gaming, but AVP fills a wider role, at least for me personally.
That’s a solid argument toward using an AVP vs a traditional PCVR set up.
… So why not just do that for a fraction of the price on the Quest 3? I do everything you listed on mine, I even take it with me when I travel without any perceived constraints. I, too, can use Steam Link (although I prefer Virtual Remote Desktop currently) and even found myself making some use of the new Xbox GamePass app, and yes, it also pairs with my controller, and my Logitech keyboard and mouse too.
I understand the AVP can fill a wider role than a standard PCVR gaming rig set up, but I feel what you describe as something to compare the AVP is honestly kind of outdated.
Open Source and Open API or bust. Simple as that for me.
I’m not surprised. Apple Vision Pro is junk. Zuckerberg released a short video giving his opinion and he’s right::Quest is way better in every way and 7 times cheaper.
The Quest is lighter, has no cables, can do AR and VR, has better controllers, has way more apps and games and costs 7(!) times less.
The Vision Pro is bulky and heavy, cords get in the way, the battery only lasts 2 hours, you need special lenses if you use glasses, it barely has any apps and it’s watching you all the time.
Apple should really be embarrassed at how bad this product is after years of R&D and millions spent. They can’t even compete against Quest. All they had to do was copy it but they couldn’t even manage that.
What a joke!
Quest is better in every way
Zuckerberg can’t even buy an SOC to put in the quest to compete with Apple. Qualcomm doesn’t make one. So it can’t be better in every way.
It can be better subjectively to some people. But objectively the Vision Pro has specs other manufacturers literally won’t be able to do for at least 2-3 years, and not for 500 bucks.
The SOC isn’t the whole story. The user experience is what counts. But Qualcomm do hehe a chip as powerful as Apples. Zuck should just buy that
Have you used them both?
No. Who has that kind of money? Lol
All those things also apply to the quest besides the controllers and cables…
Can you use the Vision Pro while wearing glasses? I can use my Quest without special lenses because i can just wear my glasses while using it.
They’re two different market segments. The Quest is definitely more practical for most people, but to just day it’s better in every way is a disservice to the fact the tech in the Vision Pro is the best version of VR out there. It’s just way too expensive.
Oh but it’s not though right? I’m not big into that space but there are professional VR headsets that costs several thousands of dollars, like apples, but still lead it in tech, which to me seem to leave apple’s device in this weird cost middle ground between professional headsets like varjo and consumer headsets like oculus.
Eh, it also doesn’t support much in the way of software, so I wouldn’t call it the best version of VR just yet.
Sorry you’re getting downvoted by crying Apple fanboys lol
Lol. Thanks. But I take don’t give a crap about up or downvotes. I literally never look at that ever. I just want to get my opinion out and see what other people’s opinions are.
But you’re right, it’s probably the isheep…
Is it a flop after all?
We’ll never know. This is all based on people’s complaints online. Apple will never actually release how many were returned and for what reasons.
They’re a public company, we’ll get sales figures and enough proxy numbers to have a good guess. Shareholders are going to want to know.
Tbh as someone who is unironically into a lot of VR stuff and even owns a pricey headset myself, I did not understand the appeal from what I’ve seen. Even the stuff that looks at least somewhat cool or useful doesnt even seem worth it considering the price, and that there’s also apparently a lot of basic features that other headsets preform much better at.
Fr, I love VR, but this headset is just Apple trying to cash in on the VR market without understanding what people actually like about VR.
I think they totally understand that there is a legitimate mixed reality / AR use case that people have wanted addressed for decades, but the hardware has never been able to pull it off well.
If I could pop on a light weight headset, and have a desktop with infinite 4K monitors, with a high refresh rate, without breaking my wallet, I would 1000% buy that product.
The hardware isn’t there yet, but I’m glad to see people are investing in platforms that could get us there in a decade or two.
It has some neat features and ideas, but nothing I haven’t seen in other products before. Definitely more polished, and it brings all of those big features together in one package. But for me, it’s the price that kills it. Maybe Apple had a hunch that all of this might happen and they just wanted it out as a setup for the next version?
I dislike Apple, but this is the way future will like. AR (and maybe VR, but who knows) will definitely be amazing in a decade or so. BUT I think some people will still stick to smartphones, especially ones who don’t want to spend their whole day with technology and social media.
Microsoft barely made a PC interface, they’re the last ones i would expect make a proper AR interface.
Aren’t they removing the AR they built into the OS? I swear I read recently that they gave up on their customers that bought their headset so people that have it are forced to stay on an old version of windows just to use them.
Not sure what do you mean by PC interface. Do you mean interface between user and computer? (which has nothing to do with software) Or like GUI in an operating system?
If by “PC interface” you mean GUI, then I still get you, because there’s real alternative to Windows UI in any desktop operating system. Sure Apple has macOS with its simple UI, and may be good for users that need to do only basic tasks, but if you need to have powerful (and in some parts customizable, although Unix desktops like KDE or Xfce may be better suited for max customization) UI with great UX for power users and without need to get to command line often nothing beats Windows.
Windows is actively removing AR support with an upcoming update.
Well, that’s kinda stupid on their part, but I bet they will be rejoining AR race later though, probably too late while Apple and Google creates good AR platforms with massive support of 3rd parties. And I expect Google (or, ekhm, Alphabet?) to show something similar in next few years.
I think they mean a full windows OS for AR, which doesn’t currently exist.
Flying cars will be the future but I wouldn’t buy a flying car today.
Brain-computer interfaces will be the future but I wouldn’t implant a chip in my brain today.
Personal AI assistants will be the future but I wouldn’t pay $350 for ChatGPT today.
Lot’s of things will be great in the future. Bringing it up in the context of existing, silly products is a bit pointless.
It needs controllers and PCVR support. Then it might be worth it.
Most people should just buy a Quest 3
SOME WOULD SAY you don’t need the controllers. Then you’re just a regular VR headset. Would Apple say that? No. I think this boils down to a dumb product with lackluster payoff at $3.5k.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Parker Ortolani, The Verge’s product manager, told me that he thought using the device led to a burst blood vessel in his eye.
“Despite being as magical to use as I’d hoped, it was simply way too uncomfortable to wear even for short periods of time both due to the weight and the strap designs.
For smart glasses and headsets, having a low nose bridge can mean the device just slips off your face or fails to adequately block out light.
Another engineer wrote on the social media platform X that the “coding experience failed to convince [him]” and focusing issues caused headaches.
“If I’m not using this for productivity, and if I don’t love it for entertainment, and if there aren’t enough games to play on it - I just can’t justify keeping it,” one Reddit user wrote.
While these users are speaking out on social media, we have no idea of the actual return rate — or what Apple’s internal expectations for the Vision Pro are.
The original article contains 621 words, the summary contains 168 words. Saved 73%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
Called it.
So, is VR actually good, or is it mostly just for wealthy silicon valley furries to hang out with each other in VRchat, like everyone used to do in second life? The only game that really comes to mind as being something that’s even close to a killer app is beatsaber, and that’s basically just DDR with your upper body. I really haven’t seen much support, both in the way of games, and more importantly, in the way of, say, 3d modelling apps, or something to that effect. Utility software, stuff that’s useful, but is specifically more convenient in virtual reality, stuff that might be benefited by the platform. But then, it’s not really something I’ve looked into much.
So…stupid people with too much money to burn jumped on something they neither wanted nor needed and then got bored.
Apple pitched the Vision Pro as if VR hadn’t wasn’t already a thing that’s been around for a while. While the VP has some higher specs particularly in its display it lacks in areas like field of view, comfort, game selection and portability. The first group of people that would be interested are those who already own or have used other VR systems. They those people won’t see the VP as such a jump. Especially considering it’s locked to the Apples app store with not many VR options. The second group is composed of people who have been out of the loop and think this is the begining of VR. I think thats the camp more likely to return the unit once they realize it’s just a novelty in its current state.
Here’s an application…every fridge would have a visor on the door. Stick your face in the visor and you’ll be able to see the fridge from the webcam in front of it… including your self!
JeeBaiChow@lemmy.world 9 months ago
The influencers got their videos, I guess.
moistclump@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Yeh I’d be curious if these people ever intended to hang on to it or off it was just for the grams.
Patches@sh.itjust.works 9 months ago
It was always for the gram. Influences don’t actually buy anything.
kevincox@lemmy.ml 9 months ago
Or just to try it out. I would totally like to try one on for a few days.