Submitted 2 weeks ago by 58008@lemmy.world to nostupidquestions@lemmy.world
https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/ccd53ba0-c68f-4271-b4f1-abc251ef110e.png
Is it an affectation that they’re trained to deploy? (If so, why?) Or is it just a natural thing that happens in the very specific circumstance of being a politician on the campaign trail, and that’s why no one else seems to do it?
I don’t think I’ve seen it in any other context 🤔
Cheers!
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chironomia
They are taught by “experts” that pointing is an ugly aggressive hand gesture.
It’s silly how some of them do this while simultaneously pushing ugly and aggressive policies.
Gotta make those policies seem friendly and non-aggressive!
They’re squeezing their hands like that so they don’t accidentally do the nazi solute again.
That’s neat.
Why does that article contain no references more recent than 1806 though. Is it called something else these days? It seems like there should be more modern information on the practice.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_jive
Not really tho.
honestly with drawings like that I half expected at least one panel be involving bloodletting
And this is safer than “air dicking”.
wow, so Trump is doing “Liberatem resigno” (“I give up my freedom”) but with rubber shackles.
It’s one of many gestures that are used by trained public speakers as non-verbal communication cues. Here are some examples, including the one you asked about: qz.com/…/a-guide-to-ted-talk-hands-seven-signatur…
There are many more beyond those. Using hand gestures in public speaking has been around since at least classical times.
Nobody likes being pointed at. The fist point, then, is a way to underscore an important point without the scolding, accusatory associations of a raised index finger—because it uses a thumb instead. Clinton Thumb works best when paired with an intellectually complex point, making it a TED talk favorite. “It is articulating that you’re focusing on something, and that you’re grasping it cognitively,” body language expert Joe Navarro told Business Insider.
Thanks for posting that quote from the article.
They all go to Ivy League colleges, and they all take the same public speaking classes.
It’s a big club, but we’re not in it.
This is the real answer.
No the real answer is that literally nearly every possible configuration of your hands and movement is offensive and rude to some culture, person or religion.
It’s fucking damn near impossible to find ANY that are actually safe.
This has been a problem of public speaking for longer then America has been a country, and longer then the ivy leagues have been a thing.
Public speaking hand gestures go back literally hundreds of years.
Its what you do when you naturally want to point but dont want to be seen as rude and aggressive.
Correct answer right there. Politicians and business people are very aware of their body language. Another rule is never touch your face. When they do, photographers will snap a picture. In the photo they will look frustrated
LOL that’s why I will never be a politician. I would be so frustrated by not being allowed to touch my face! The irony of it would just overwhelm me.
I wanna say I’ve heard that be referred to as the “Clinton thumb” since Bill Clinton did it a lot when president.
I’ve heard that before too but being an old bastard, I’m pretty certain Clinton didn’t do it until after he was debating Bob Dole. Bob Dole used this gesture because he held a pen during debates. And he held a pen in his dominant hand because he had an injury in WWII and the way his hand curled made him look weak.
I remember it as a Dole gesture originally, too
There are very few configurations of the hand and fingers that aren’t offensive to someone. This one is one of the last few remaining, with “thousand points o’ laght”, a list that doesn’t include “yuge” or the double “okay” sign.
So everyone does it.
“How dare you insult me with your flaccid mockery of a fishing pole grip, you will pay for your insolence”
If you work for a large company, ask around if there is a toastmasters group. If so join it and you will be let in on all the secrets of public speaking.
Jerking themselves off to the idea of fucking their citizens over
trump and his accordion hands are very noticible, especially when he has to make a lie on the spot.
It’s the I’m-pointing-at-you-with-a-pen-but-I-forgot-my-pen gesture.
Remember Biden’s “I did that!” (lying) stickers that were placed on gas pumps by maga freaks? It’s trivial to put your political opponent in an ad where they are saying something they’re not, because pointing is seen as an aggressive gesture by the people coaching them for speeches, debates, etc. So they do the silly thumb-point for emphasis recommended by political strategists…
It’s a wand. They are actually enchanting you, the first spell always makes the wand invisible. That’s why you never see it.
“People who are more emotive with their gestures than me must be fake”
“People who are less emotive with their gestures than me are robotic lol”
Most people hold both of those views but have wildly different levels of emotiveness… The result? Posts like this
Oh that?
Thats the motion you make when fanning through dollar bills, to count em.
They’re doing a pavlovian reflex everytime they need to remind themselves where their money comes from, and how its time to focus in on delivering shareholder lobbyist value.
It’s more of a public speaker thing than just a politician thing, but… Well, politicians are all public speakers, so it makes sense that that’s the context you’ve seen it in.
It’s literally a practiced gesture - public speaking makes use of some gestures that telegraph well to crowds, but seem unusual otherwise. IIRC, that fishing rod grip is an alternative to gesturing with a fist - it looks less aggressive, but gets the point across.
Trump just channels his childhood accordion lessons. He doesn’t even realize he’s doing it.
It’s not a fishing rod, it’s something much more personal
Like… your favourite PH2 driver?
Torx is superior. I could accept Robertson as well.
their fishing rods are invisible for you? including the hook and line? that must be rough. how do you avoid getting caught when you can’t even see them?
Esoterically speaking, it is a modification of the sign of the fig—a vaginal hand symbol indicating that you are creating with your words. The traditional sign of the fig has the thumb placed between the index and middle finger, which you see Bill Clinton do a lot. Others put the thumb on top, I imagine for plausible deniability of being satanic or something. The gesture is very old, going back to Ancient Greece or earlier.
Historically, politicians have been influenced by groups such as the Masons and the Rosicrucians who would have been aware of the meaning of these gestures, and then it filters down over time to become standard political gestures for people who aren’t aware of their origin.
this could be total bullshit but i wouldnt know. seems legit but ya know? lacks references but has the air of authority
I’m a practicing occultist, so my knowledge of the gesture is from that angle. I’m at work right now, so I can’t drag up the best sources at the moment, but here’s a Wikipedia article about it:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fig_sign
And here is a Wikipedia article about hand gestures that mentions the “Clinton Thumb” under the single handed gestures section:
I believe I first heard the Masonic political connection from Lon Milo DuQuette, who I believe is a Mason as well as a practicing occultist like myself. He has over 1000 videos on occultism on YouTube, and I think I probably heard it from there as well as other sources about occult hand gestures.
For the record, I’m not saying it is an occult gesture to imply any conspiracy—just that the history of Masonry and other occult interests in politicians over history have led to certain themes and gestures blending in to the common political vernacular.
The gesture is very old because, and I know this is a wild unsubstantiated theory, it’s a pretty natural and organic way to hold your hand when speaking to or before a large group? I suppose magic makes more sense.
These gestures aren’t exclusive to any particular group—part of the reason they last is that they are easy to discover multiple times and use in multiple ways, plus they seem somewhat natural. It’s similar to how the “devil horns” gesture can also be seen as an owl, a longhorn, or an I Love You. They’re multi-purpose, which is part of why they end up being commonly used.
I’m not suggesting that everyone who uses the sign of the fig is using it in a Masonic or occult way, but rather that some politicians probably picked it up from that background and began using it, and then it was copied by other politicians who liked their style. Eventually, it just becomes a standard political gesture, and only some politicians would be aware of its roots.
It’s possible that they just came up with it independently and copied each other, but if that were the case, I’d expect to see more closed fists with the thumb around the fingers mixed in rather than them synchronizing to the thumb on top (the “fishing reel” as described in this post). This is just my theory—I never had the chance to ask Bill Clinton where his thumb gesture came from, but it aligns with what we know about the connections between American politics and Masonry.
Bill Clinton started it. Drives chicks crazy.
Way before Clinton. Jfk was doing it in black and white days.
As I said, drove chicks crazy, even Marilyn Monroe could not resist.
You have to do something with your hand. This one’s pretty neutral, because it’s nothing.
I always thought it was so comedians can do impressions of them.
My guess is that they’re accustomed to holding note cards and it’s just a reflexive stance after a while
The “counting money” gesture? You still have to ask this?
Public speaking is a performance and like any performance some people are good at it and some become good at it and some aren’t really good at it.
It’s so other lizard people know.
Actually it’s only a small part of the secret handshake that lets you into Epstein island. But it is a prerequisite.
They learn it at The Bohemian Grove.
It’s so they don’t point their finger and wag or shake a fist while they are taking. It is seen as a less offensive gesture to people watching body language.
yum_burnt_toast@reddthat.com 2 weeks ago
from what i remember, they are coached to do it because pointing is seen as too aggressive but not making any hand gestures is too robotic. so its a way to make a non-aggressive emphatic hand gesture.
Marshezezz@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 weeks ago
Which, ironically, makes them seem even more robotic
NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Only to people who are actually paying attention to a lot of politicians and likely looking exactly this up.
For the majority of the public? it is just “good public speaking”.
TheV2@programming.dev 2 weeks ago
Thanks for pointing that out.
netvor@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Still, maybe if Zucc did it people would actually find him cool.
(“Cool” as in, like an average politician, which is still way cooler than he is now.)
the_q@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Marketing is always the answer.
RaoulDuke85@fedia.io 2 weeks ago
I feel it also adds cadence to a speech, which can help people listen more to what you’re saying.