If this works out it might be a nice place to migrate to away from my self-hosted e-mail provided they eventually let you bring your own domain. Just sucks that e-mail is essentially the most secure thing you need to have since compromising that can compromise every account attached to the e-mail. That’s a lot of trust you need to instill in your e-mail host.
Mozilla Thunderbird Challenges Gmail With Its Own Email Service
Submitted 5 weeks ago by ComradeRachel@lemmy.blahaj.zone to technology@lemmy.world
Comments
conorab@lemmy.conorab.com 5 weeks ago
Photuris@lemmy.ml 5 weeks ago
I have fond memories of self-hosting a qmail setup for a long time, then eventually migrating to a postfix configuration, back in the day.
Keeping up with spam filtering finally did me in.
conorab@lemmy.conorab.com 5 weeks ago
The spam filtering is painful. I kinda work around it by giving a unique e-mail for everything and of one starts getting spammed I just rid of that e-mail. Tends to give you advance warning of data breaches too since you’ll start seeing the spam come in before the announcement.
Kidplayer_666@lemm.ee 5 weeks ago
You say you’re self hosting your email, how are you doing that?
Reygle@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
I think it’s incredibly important that people know, with absolute certainty, whether or not the new Mozilla/Firefox privacy policy in any way applies to / covers such a service.
I’m not saying I know the answer- What I’m saying without a concrete, permanently applied answer it’s not even considerable.
ComradeRachel@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
There is no email service that exists without a terms of use and privacy policy. I still feel everyone overreacted about Firefox. It’s funnier how many people said they switched to Brave because of it and all the super shady stuff Brave has done.
Reygle@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Firefox/Mozilla operated without any of the new additions for nearly the entire history of the internet until this year. If anything, “over”-reacting to the new policies was too weak a reaction. You do you and all, but I’ll agree to very strongly disagree.
infinitesunrise@slrpnk.net 5 weeks ago
You can’t know that with absolute certainty. Sorry, but if you’re using someone elses server for your communications and they’re not end to end encrypted, you should just assume that they can and do read your emails.
SaltSong@startrek.website 5 weeks ago
What is it that you’re concerned about? Assume that I have no idea what either the new or old Mozilla privacy policy is, please. I tend to assume that all such are a pack of lies and everything is spying on me.
Reygle@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
zdnet.com/…/the-firefox-i-loved-is-gone-how-to-pr…
That article says it better than I can in s short post. Firefox’s terms of use/privacy policy went over like a lead balloon last month.
leraje@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
Thunderbird Pro will apparently be:
This email thing plus Thunderbird Send (which is basically send.vis.ee), Thunderbird Appointment - a scheduling tool and Thunderbird Assist, which is:
“…at least for now, being cautiously labeled as “an experiment” that will allow users to take advantage of AI features within their email. However, the goal is to be lightweight enough that the language models can be run locally on a user’s PC in the interest of privacy. This service is being developed in partnership with Flower AI, which leverages Nvidia’s confidential compute to provide private remote processing in the event a user’s PC isn’t powerful enough. Sipes emphasizes that any remote processing features attached to Thunderbird Assist will always be optional, in the interest of ensuring complete user privacy.”
So AI shit that nobody asked for or wants.
SaltSong@startrek.website 5 weeks ago
This covers my thoughts about damn near every “helpful” feature this side of auto-complete email addresses.
mke@programming.dev 5 weeks ago
They said it will be opt-in and are trying to make it local-first. Their provider(?) apparently allows fallback to nvidia cloud compute when the hardware can’t handle it.
I’m not using AI to write my fucking emails, regardless. Just wanted to let people know.
lka1988@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
"[…] This service is being developed in partnership with Flower AI, which leverages Nvidia’s confidential compute to provide private remote processing in the event a user’s PC isn’t powerful enough. Sipes emphasizes that any remote processing features attached to Thunderbird Assist will always be optional, in the interest of ensuring complete user privacy.”
That’s a lot of words to say “we made an AI that totally won’t suck up your data, trust me bro”
cley_faye@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
“nvidia’s confidential compute” had me choke when reading it. Sure bro, sure.
freely1333@reddthat.com 5 weeks ago
This sounds like proton except I haven’t heard a thing about cost or encryption which leads me to believe you will pay with your data and there will be no encryption.
Proton is the bare minimum for email services. Email should be fully redone at its core.
magic_smoke@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
I hope to god one day the developers at Mozilla finally get tired of this shit and fork everything under a new org.
Fuck off with more services and give me my integrated FTP client back.
Brkdncr@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
lol @ ftp client
mke@programming.dev 5 weeks ago
No one who uses Mozilla software wants more cloud shit or online services from Mozilla.
I don’t think that’s unanimous. I’d like to use Firefox Relay, myself, and I’m willing to give thundermail a chance.
Used to think I’d go full Proton eventually, but leaning more towards a diverse set of service providers, nowadays. It’s also my hope that these services allow Mozilla to depend less on companies like Google, and more on the users they ought to serve.
lka1988@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
integrated FTP client
Why though? SFTP is leagues better.
magic_smoke@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
For transfers between systems you own yes, but when grabbing a Linux iso from a public server FTP works fine.
For years Firefox allowed you to crawl FTP sites natively.
Tea@programming.dev 5 weeks ago
Out of all the articles and the official, you could share, you shared forbes.
Why?
ComradeRachel@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
Tbh because it was the one shared on Reddit. Though if you have the right browser extensions when I wouldn’t worry about it too much.
misteloct@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Upvoted for honesty lol.
3laws@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
You imply OP knows how to read & they read the whole article and noticed the source. 💀
null_dot@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
I went looking for something official but couldn’t find it.
arch@feddit.nl 5 weeks ago
I was thinking ab this being april fool bcz it’s posted on 1st…
lars@lemmy.sdf.org 5 weeks ago
Google announced Gmail on April 1
werefreeatlast@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Here’s what I want… I leave a computer on at home and it checks my email. I get emails from it at my phone. No setup. Make it work like Sinkthing used to work. I don’t want cloud anything. Fucking backup nightmare where my shit ends up kidnapped by a company for monthly ransom.
cupcakezealot@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
if it’s anything like gmail, they’d offer imap so you can set it up in thunderbird and download your messages locally.
shiroininja@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Syncthing still works like that. It’s completely self hostable. I have it on a pi 1B+ lol
werefreeatlast@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
I have it but it eats up battery on the phones and the Dev left so it’s probably going to go caput at some point.
lka1988@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
Syncthing was only ever self-hosted…
exchange12rocks@lemm.ee 5 weeks ago
Sooo… where will be your email server then? On your home computer?
werefreeatlast@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
At home but separate computer with reverse proxy.
A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
welp I signed up for the waitlist.
I’ll use it for a disposable email at first, and if it endures and does well I’ll move my main shit off to it.
Geetnerd@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
I’m listening…
But how is a small non-profit going to afford a free email service? Ads in every email?
ComradeRachel@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
Based on what I’ve seen in their forums it will be a paid service. I think it will be free at first for beta testers but I assume they are targeting people who currently use services like Proton.
Geetnerd@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Thanks for the info.
But I think they’ll still need an ad driven free version to gain acceptance.
BrilliantantTurd4361@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
If its not zero access its just more ameritech bullshit.
KingDingbat@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
I have a 20ish year old history in my Gmail account organized in labels and all that. I wonder if it will be viable to migrate?
TheEntity@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Considering labels are very non-standard, which caused trouble over IMAP since forever, I wouldn’t count on that part.
Scrollone@feddit.it 5 weeks ago
Labels are displayed as folders on IMAP, which means that a single message could appear in multiple folders. Are there any other problems you’re talking about?
dustyData@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Please archive shit. It’s OK to save old data, but not on the service. There are ways. Even banks, the most obsessive and legally strapped data hoarders keep their 5+ year old data in deep cold storage, away from the active services. 99.9^% of information that old won’t be looked at by anyone.
Brkdncr@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Not true.
It’s much easier to keep old data in active storage where it can be classified, searched, and have retention/deletion policies applied. Moving it elsewhere makes it more likely you’ll just hang onto it forever while not using it at all.
finitebanjo@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Doesn’t like 90% of Mozilla’s funding come from Google? At least expanding their paid services could be seen as trying to turn that around.
ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca 5 weeks ago
The anti-monopoly lawsuit against Google fixed that
fortune.com/…/mozilla-firefox-biggest-potential-l…
Now Mozilla has to find a way to offset that loss
finitebanjo@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Nice! Good for them.
Sunny@slrpnk.net 5 weeks ago
From my understanding thunbird is somewhat separated from this. From the article linked by OP it says:
What’s crystal clear is that Thunderbird’s ever-increasing donation revenue (currently its sole source of income) is allowing for some explosive growth that’s long overdue. To add some context to this, Thunderbird received $2.8 million in donation revenue during 2021. Two years later, in 2023, it received $8.6 million in donations. I’m told that total financial contributions for 2024 were even higher, though the final amount hasn’t been officially released.
mke@programming.dev 5 weeks ago
I should donate again. As someone who still depends on gmail, I keep forgetting how annoying it was to get ads every time I refreshed my inbox, before I switched to their app.
lumony@lemmings.world 5 weeks ago
Err… does this mean we can get a Mozilla or Thunderbird email address?
mke@programming.dev 5 weeks ago
Yes, sort of. Thundermail addresses, apparently, or bring your own. From the linked article you’re commenting on:
Users can send and receive email using new Thundermail accounts they sign up for. The service will also allow using your own custom domain (e.g. your.name@yourdomain.com).
buddascrayon@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
You have always been able to use your own domain email with Thunderbird. The big news here is the fact that they are launching not only a web based mail service a la Thunderbird but also providing an email server for addresses of [yourchosenname]@thundermail.com. which is gonna be pretty great.
0x0@programming.dev 5 weeks ago
So the Mozilla Foundation is gonna waste google money on email infrastructure? Hmmm… 'k… it’s not like their browser could use some love…
hamsterkill@lemmy.sdf.org 5 weeks ago
Thunderbird’s corp (MZLA) does not get Google money so far as i’m aware. It is a different subsidiary corp from Firefox’s Mozilla Corp.
FiskFisk33@startrek.website 5 weeks ago
are you implying firefox is in a state of neglect?
Zidane@sh.itjust.works 5 weeks ago
I personally would love profiles akin to how does it.
0x0@programming.dev 5 weeks ago
No there yet but not getting the love it deserved either.
Maybe they oughta try asking for money like Wikipedia and KDE, maybe then they could become independent from Google and focus on actually developing a quality browser instead of making every app be about profit.
commander@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
I’d consider it. If they host things outside of the US/start moving operations overseas, it’d be a lot more interesting. I sub to Proton for email, VPN, and drive support. Still hoping someday for proper Linux drive support so Mozilla/Thunderbird can target that
drmoose@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Yet thunderbird still can’t single click open an email in a new window. If I recall correctly the request has been filed in 2014 or smt 💀
cupcakezealot@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
Sam_Bass@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Sounded great until the “assist” ai feature. I friggin hate Gemini in gmail so any other kind of ai is an automatic nogo for me
gamer@lemm.ee 5 weeks ago
Lol sure destroy all the trust with your users THEN launch an email service. Hard pass fro me.
I guarantee you they’re already planning to train an LLM on everybody’s emails, or at least sell them to AI companies doing training.
leraje@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
Archive link for anyone else for whom that article crashed their tab.
MrFunkEdude@piefed.social 5 weeks ago
People still use Email???
ProfHillbilly@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
I looked at this but it asked me to download it. Can I access it through a browser like I can Google?
Dead_or_Alive@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
Thundermail… yeah yeah. :gently pushes my aol.com account under the sofa:
ray1992xd@feddit.nl 5 weeks ago
No matter how much I hate Mozilla’s new path, companies like this challenging big tech are bold and have a lot of courage. If I set aside my personal op opinions about Mozilla, I actually admire them for this. They can actually dent big tech with funding from big tech itself.
danc4498@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
I keep hearing a lot of negative comments about Mozilla lately. I’m wondering if this move is more in line with then just turning into another google rather than disrupting the marketplace.
knighthawk0811@lemmy.ml 5 weeks ago
yeah, might seem good to have yet another choice, but it’s an illusion
JuxtaposedJaguar@lemmy.ml 5 weeks ago
Google only checked out and cashed in after getting a monopoly. Mozilla let themselves fade into irrelevance.
umbrella@lemmy.ml 5 weeks ago
yes but this takes time.
fuck google in tge meantime.
Cethin@lemmy.zip 5 weeks ago
For now, they’re better than Google. I have some bad opinions about them, but anything better than Google competing with Google is an improvement.
FundMECFSResearch@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 weeks ago
Yeah it’s not even close.
sihil@lemm.ee 5 weeks ago
…and then join the big tech at some point.
0x0@programming.dev 5 weeks ago
It’s a saturated market and email is starting to disappear (it’ll take years, but the signs are there).
They’d be better using it on the browser and ditching other products.
scratchee@feddit.uk 5 weeks ago
Email isn’t going anywhere. It’s the ipv4 of communication. You can list 100 things bad about it and none of it matters, too many things are now built on top of it, no competitor can possibly have a chance without first reimplementing email, and then they’re just adding extensions which everyone else ignores, and email continues.
The more plausible threat to email is that it gets siloed into the top 5 or 6 providers and everyone else gets filtered out as spam (ie you need gmail, hotmail, etc or your emails will never reach anyone)
1984@lemmy.today 5 weeks ago
No its never going to disappear. If you are referring to people using slack and chat apps, those are locked in walled gardens where your messages cant ever leave.
Email can be moved anywhere easily.
moitoi@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
Email won’t disappear sooner or later. It’s a huge part of communication between companies, nonprofit, state, etc. It may be less between people or with consumers. But, it still is widely use otherwise.
JustAnotherKay@lemmy.world 5 weeks ago
I’m curious, not bashing. What signs have you seen that lead you to believe email is dying?
Kualdir@feddit.nl 5 weeks ago
Any business2business or consumer2business communication will likely still happen over email for a very long time
lka1988@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 weeks ago
The fuck it is lol, do you have any idea how much email is used in literally everything? How old are you?