Open Menu
AllLocalCommunitiesAbout
lotide
AllLocalCommunitiesAbout
Login

DOGE Plans to Rebuild SSA Codebase in Months, Risking Benefits and System Collapse

⁨0⁩ ⁨likes⁩

Submitted ⁨⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨oakey66@lemmy.world⁩ to ⁨technology@lemmy.world⁩

https://www.wired.com/story/doge-rebuild-social-security-administration-cobol-benefits/

source

Comments

Sort:hotnewtop
  • Gerudo@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Months? I don’t k ow how to code, and even I know that’s impossible.

    source
    • futatorius@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      I know how to code, how to manage programs, how to architect huge safety-critical systems, and quite a few other things, and I know that you are right. I’d give it 5 to 7 years if it were adequately resourced, there was political commitment, and the stakeholders could be made to agree a set of requirements, then not change them unless there’s a really convincing reason (conflicts with other requirements, impossible to implement, breaks everything, etc).

      And the validation and verification of such a system could itself take a year or more, if it’s well-planned and correctly executed.

      source
    • nullPointer@programming.dev ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      you know they will make chatGPT do it and then not verify.

      source
      • painfulasterisk1@lemmy.ml ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        They will cross-check with Grok.

        source
      • derGottesknecht@feddit.org ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Vibe Coding. I can’t see a way for this to go wrong…

        source
        • -> View More Comments
  • renrenPDX@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Oh no, he wants to “rebuild the stack” from the ground up again.

    source
  • kibiz0r@midwest.social ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    There are only two reasons softwares goes for decades without being replaced:

    1. It’s so unimportant that nobody uses it
    2. It’s so important that the last major bug was squashed 15 years ago
    source
    • futatorius@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      It’s so important that the last major bug was squashed 15 years ago

      There are no such systems. What instead happens is that the surrounding business process gets distorted to work around the unfixed major bugs. And then, everyone involved retires and nobody knows anymore why things are done that way.

      source
      • kibiz0r@midwest.social ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        I know devs like everything to be perfect, but if your business can work around it for 15 years without fixing the bug or replacing the system, I dare say it doesn’t qualify as a major bug.

        source
    • EarlGrey@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      But dude, bro, we could put the entire system on the blockchain man, and make it super efficient with an AI backend that will remove all errors bro.

      Dude it’s not even written in Rust bro. WTF is this dinosaur shit?

      source
      • rottingleaf@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        I don’t think Rust is a bad language for doing same things people do with C++, but with a smaller standard and less legacy.

        But yep, that’s the kind of people.

        About dinosaur things - I’ve started learning Tcl/Tk and it’s just wonderful.

        source
        • -> View More Comments
  • geoff@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    This is how you know Musk is a fraud. This far into his career and he’s leading teams into rookie mistakes.

    Or, he knows this will break it and that’s the goal. I’m just not sure how he avoids the blame.

    source
    • futatorius@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      When he suggested PayPal convert its data centers from Linux to Microsoft Server, I knew he was a wrong’un. That was one of the reasons he got booted out of PayPal, by the way. Even the other bullshitter tech bros knew how stupid that idea was.

      source
    • bugg@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      DARVO is all you need to avoid blame. Deny. Reverse Victim and Offender. Incredibly effective either way everyone except the genuinely principled.

      source
  • Xaphanos@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    If SS payments stop, there will be hundreds of thousands of people with nothing left to lose.

    source
    • futatorius@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Suicide bombers on mobility scooters. Be very afraid.

      source
    • whotookkarl@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Over 70 million including many retirees, orphans, and disabled workers. The people most in need of help and the reason that trying to run a government like a capitalist business is one of the dumbest forms of government organization ever. A quick way to radicalize someone against you is to harm their family or take their money.

      source
      • Xaphanos@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        My mom is over 80. Little old suburban white lady. She already volunteered - “Just get me close.” She’d be super-thrilled to have her shot with a suicide vest.

        source
        • -> View More Comments
  • einlander@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    This idea is terrifying in the most insidious ways. Who has access to the code? Who is auditing the code? Are they putting in code that may disenfranchise “the right people”. How long will it take to come to light? When found out, provided ‘Adults’ are running the country again, how much and how long would it take to fix it? And what backdoors are in the code?

    This is bad news all around.

    source
    • Eezyville@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      How many bugs? How will they secretly siphon money to their accounts? How much access will the Russians have? Who’s gonna get discriminated against?

      source
      • AbidanYre@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        It rounds to the nearest penny and the fractions of pennies that get cut off are used to buy Bitcoin for Big Balls.

        No one will even notice.

        source
  • darkpanda@lemmy.ca ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    GitHub Copilot about to be clocking some overtime on COBOL conversions.

    source
    • Eezyville@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      You mean Grok, right?

      source
      • darkpanda@lemmy.ca ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Grok has said disparaging things about Elon Musk so I’m assuming it’s going to be disappeared to El Salvador soon.

        source
  • PiJiNWiNg@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    The first step towards privatizing an industry is eroding public confidence in the existing program. They have absolutely no intention of improving the program, they just want to make it shitty enough that people stop believing in it. Once that happens, 45 will start shilling, and some lucky company will swoop in and take it over.

    Textbook…

    source
    • will_a113@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Yep, this is it. Show how “broken” it is by breaking it, and enough of the population won’t even notice when it’s “fixed” and they’re only getting 2/3 of what they were before (and are entitled to). Plus grift, etc.

      source
  • Rentlar@lemmy.ca ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    If you want the source of any future “technical glitches”, it’s this wilfully negligent act. Courts, take note.

    source
  • WolfmanEightySix@piefed.social ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    That’s the idea. Then they say anyone who complains about not receiving benefits is a fraud.

    source
  • Dragomus@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    If it fails spectaculairly who will take the blame? Will there be any repercussions at all?

    Or will Musk and Trump shrug their shoulders? Halfheartedly blame Biden for badly programming the original database then go play some golf/videogaminges?

    source
    • jonne@infosec.pub ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      If Trump is smart, he’ll let Musk do all the unpopular project 2025 stuff, then throw him in prison at the end and escape the blame personally. This way he gets to keep popularity with his base while telling his donors they got everything they asked for. It’s what all dictators do, really.

      source
      • futatorius@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        I’d be fine with the Musk in prison part. Launching him into the sun in one of his own rockets would be cooler, though.

        source
    • Grunt4019@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      I think the hope is that it fails, they don’t want social security to work.

      source
      • PiJiNWiNg@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Bingo

        source
      • ReallyActuallyFrankenstein@lemmynsfw.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        “Whoops, we pushed to prod and have no backups. Sorrryyyy!”

        source
        • -> View More Comments
  • thebestaquaman@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    This is just another step down “I honestly just can’t comprehend the stupidity of what is going on in the American government”-alley…

    source
    • MisterOwl@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      They are trying to break the government beyond all repair. At that point they’ll say it’s the Democrats that broke it.

      Their cult members will swallow the lie hook line and sinker, and continue to keep them in power. (Side note, this will be made easier by gutting all election oversight as part of the package.)

      Meanwhile, all that money that used to go to Social Security, SNAP, Medicaid and Medicare… basically any other program meant to help people, will flow into billionaire’s pockets.

      source
      • RedPostItNote@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Idk I think these old people will riot tbh

        source
  • ThePowerOfGeek@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Ah yes, a classic tale…

    “We’re going to take this perfectly efficient and functional COBOL code base and rewrite it in Java! And we’ll do it in a few months!”

    So many more competent people and organizations than them have already tried this and spectacularly crashed and burned. There’s are literal case studies on these types of failed endeavors.

    I bet they’ll do it in Waterfall too.

    It’s interesting. If they use Grok, this could well be the deathknell for vibe programming (at least for now). It’s just fucking traffic that their hubris will cause grief and pain to do many Americans - and cost the lives of more than a few.

    source
    • jonne@infosec.pub ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      They’re not going to use Java, it’s going to be typescript.

      source
      • lepinkainen@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Or Rust

        source
        • -> View More Comments
    • DJKJuicy@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      I bet they’ll do it in Waterfall too.

      Nah B. This will be Extreme Agile XP with testing exclusively in Prod. Xitter will be the code repository.

      source
      • futatorius@lemm.ee ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        I’d think they’d put the commits onto the blockchain.

        source
      • ThePowerOfGeek@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Pair programming with Grok.

        Spotty DOGE intern developer: “what’s a for loop?”

        Grok: “Look it up yourself, noob! Holy shit do I hate Elon Musk in every fucking way!”

        source
    • criss_cross@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      I’ve worked on these “cost saving” government rewrites before. The problem is getting decades of domain logic and behavior down to where people can be productive. It takes a lot of care and nuance to do this well.

      Since these nazi pea brains can’t even secure a db properly I have my doubts they’ll do this successfully.

      source
      • gedhrel@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Not just domain logic. The implementation logic is often weird too. Cobol systems have crash/restart behaviour and other obscure semantics that often end up being used in anger; it’s like using exceptions for control flow, but exceedingly obscure and unfortunately (from what I’ve seen of production cobol) a “common trick” in lots of real-world deployments.

        source
    • Clent@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Bold of you to assume they’ll use Java and not some obscure language picked based on the need to pad their resumes.

      source
      • acchariya@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        We all know it’s going to be nodejs, backed up by mongodb. This is because LOC on the commits can be maximized for minimal effort, and it will need to be rewritten every 2-3 years.

        source
        • -> View More Comments
    • 7U5K3N@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      screams in quality assurance

      source
    • Corkyskog@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      What’s “vibe programming”?

      source
      • acchariya@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        It’s understanding code like chatgpt helps me understand Hungarian.

        source
      • golden_zealot@lemmy.ml ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        It’s when people try to have LLM’s generate code and then try to assemble the pieces produced into semi-functional, usually really bad, software I think.

        source
        • -> View More Comments
      • rikudou@lemmings.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        Stupid term for when people who don’t know how to program ask AI to generate code for them which they have no expertise to actually validate.

        source
        • -> View More Comments
    • ricecake@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      It’s worth noting that one of those organizations is IBM. Mostly relevant because they’re the ones that originally built a lot of that cobol, the mainframes it runs on, and even the compilers that compiled it.
      They’re basically the people you would expect to be able to do it, and they pretty quickly determined that the cost of a rewrite and handling all the downstream bugs and quirks would exceed the ongoing maintenance cost of just training new cobol developers.

      My dad was a cobol developer (rather, a pascal developer using a compiler that transpiled to cobol which was then linked with the cobol libraries and recompiled for the mainframe), and before he retired they decided to try to replace everything with c#. Evidently a year later their system still took a week to run the nightly reports and they had rehired his former coworkers at exorbitant contractor rates.

      source
    • zqwzzle@lemmy.ca ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Image

      source
    • Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

      Functional, yes. But rarely are these sorts of things efficient. They’re covered in decades of cruft and workarounds.

      Which just makes them that much harder to port to a different language. Especially by some 19 year old who goes by “Big Balls”

      source
      • Telorand@reddthat.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

        My company actually wrote their flagship software in COBOL starting in the 80s, and we’re only now six years into rewriting everything in a more modern language with probably four years to go.

        I can’t imagine trying to start such a project like rewriting all of Social Security and thinking it will take months. You have to be a special kind of fatuous to unironically think that.

        source
        • -> View More Comments
  • spankmonkey@lemmy.world ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

    Ow, my sides.

    source
  • Telorand@reddthat.com ⁨1⁩ ⁨year⁩ ago

    How this will go:

    “Okay Grok. Convert this COBOL code into Python.”

    “Certainly! Here you go.”

    System crashes and exposes all Americans’ SSNs

    “Fuckin’ DEI hires…!”

    source