Tech definitely is. Gate-keeping, stupid pricing, etc. done by few corporations and individual isn’t.
I'm Tired of Pretending Tech is Making the World Better
Submitted 1 year ago by juergen@feddit.org to technology@lemmy.world
https://www.joanwestenberg.com/im-tired-of-pretending-tech-is-making-the-world-better/
Comments
cley_faye@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Rekorse@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Is it a shocker most people in tech are selfish, short sighted, and self-aggrandizing?
Evil_Shrubbery@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Tech =/= megacorps
That’s like saying food doesn’t make the world better where you mean megacorps producing hunger & poverty.
jsomae@lemmy.ml 1 year ago
I like playing video games…
HasturInYellow@lemmy.world 1 year ago
The dissatisfaction is in regards to the imperative that you use all forms of tech in all aspects of your life. It is with the fact that all tech is designed around making money, not improving life. If your video games were designed around bringing joy and entertainment, then you would probably like them even more, and get more benefit from them. Instead there are loot boxes and gambling in nearly all large games.
jsomae@lemmy.ml 1 year ago
I have never played loot box / gambling / gacha games. I will admit that I have given in and I do play games with DRMs, which are most games these days.
Rekorse@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Luckily some games are still made for fun. And some gambling games were fun before they were monetized, and still are in spite of it.
aesthelete@lemmy.world 1 year ago
The overwhelming majority of software ever written is fucking terrible and causes more problems than it solves.
Since software is easily copiable and mutable, that small sliver of good software gets replicated all over the place and serves as a foundation for other software, both good – and at the risk of repeating myself – and mostly bad.
People would be better off considering new tech as the tool it is rather than seeing every piece of software as inherently better than the thing it replaces.
leadore@lemmy.world 1 year ago
As someone who grew up before the negative effects of computer/internet technology, and was excited and impatient for it to develop, I agree with the points made in the article. It didn’t have to be this way- in a different kind of society it could have been a boon to everyone. But in our society all the benefits of good things are appropriated by the powerful so they can more readily exploit the less powerful for profit.
So many wonderful possible benefits that might have come from these technological advancements, to help people lead better lives, to address many of society’s issues (hunger, climate change, disabilities, education, etc) simply never happened, because in our society money must be invested to develop them, so only things that would make more profits for the greedy were able to be developed. Yes, some things did get funded by governments or foundations, but they’re only a drop in the bucket to what could be done.
aesthelete@lemmy.world 1 year ago
It didn’t have to be this way; in a different kind of society it could have been a boon to everyone.
Please hold onto this viewpoint even under serious argument from those opposing it. Technology isn’t inevitably shit. There are other types of software we can write, and other types of technology we can develop that isn’t the result of some sweaty CTO hovering over our shoulders demanding that we make the software shittier for the sake of the shareholders.
We have to imagine better choices. We have to imagine that we can change the course of things.
KeenFlame@feddit.nu 1 year ago
Literally just one billionaire could end world hunger. It’s such an easy way to go to history forever as a good guy. But they all become corrupt in the soul as soon as they have more than they can use. It’s a systematic problem and the problem is the demonic capitalist entities known as the megacorps
leadore@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Well said.
prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 year ago
Thanks Adam Smith…
Evkob@lemmy.ca 1 year ago
I work in a coffee shop; I already feel sufficiently dehumanized by the amount of people who answer my “how are you today?” with “cappuccino to-go”. I would hate to work in a café where you order via your phone.
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 year ago
Not everyone wants to socially interact. That’s something to respect.
I tend to prioritize not-human services, as social interaction exhaust me.
Evkob@lemmy.ca 1 year ago
I get that and totally respect it, and I never pursue further conversation unless I get a chatty vibe from the customer.
However it’s insanely rude to ignore me to my face after I’ve just asked you a question. If someone answers “Fine. Cappuccino to-go.” that’s really all I’m asking for. I’m not simply an interface through which you get coffee, I’m a human person, and I think customer service staff deserve to be treated as such.
LH0ezVT@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Honestly? Cool that you are asking, but I just want a coffee, not a conversation.
Yes, I’m German, how could you tell?
Evkob@lemmy.ca 1 year ago
You can just answer “fine” and I’ll be satisfied though, it’s really easy to sus out who wants to chat up their barista and who just wants to go in, order, get out. I’m not seeking to force anyone into a conversation they don’t want, I just want a faint acknowledgment of my humanity, you know?
Tja@programming.dev 1 year ago
I feel the same. Find it annoying when in the US the waitress introduces herself, asks where I’m form, etc. Do you work for a diner or the CIA? Just bring me a steak with fries, medium rare, please and thank you.
LordCrom@lemmy.world 1 year ago
“In some parts of the city, you can’t even park your car anymore without downloading an app.”
Omg, this. I left my phone at home by accident and quickly found out that I could not pay a meter on the area I went to … You had to download an app to pay or use you phone to register a phone number and manually enter a plate and credit card.
No phone…meant no parking.
Good luck too if your phone happens to run out of battery.
daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 year ago
Times change. I see nothing wrong with it. Same as you used to be able to park without paying, then you started to pay, and now it’s moving from those machines to phone apps.
It’s just nostalgia working. Things change. You were more capable of dealing with change at a younger age and that’s why you see the older the people get the more they complain about everything.
But is just a change, like many other that came before that.
Korhaka@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
Yet more benefits to cycling then. Just lock it to any reasonably sturdy object.
apfelwoiSchoppen@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Yep, technofeudalism is here.
OhNoMoreLemmy@lemmy.ml 1 year ago
Yeah but parking has always been bad.
You had to carry change. Meters were always out of order or would just eat your change without issuing a ticket, and the people checking never gave a shit and would give you a fine anyway.
My only complaint is the app, everyone should offer a website or an app, but if you’re going to park there a few times an app does make sense.
T156@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Neither a phone nor website would work if your phone battery is flat. The meter should at least have a way for someone to park their car if they don’t have a functioning phone, or internet access, even before the hellscape of needing a separate app for everything.
corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca 1 year ago
Scenario1:
“Um, hi. Can I just order here inside? Thanks. I’m really hating the apps now. For sure: one medium cold-brew, please. Yes, thanks, to go. Okay; tap here? Excellent. Oh. Put ‘guppy’ on the cup. Thanks! [pause] Oh, perfect. Hey, thanks again for letting me skip the app. Those are so frustrating! I’m really starting to avoid any place that uses them, and I’m so grateful I can still come in. Have a great day!”
Scenario2:
“Um, hi. Can I just order here? No? Just the app? That’s too bad: I’m really getting frustrated with the app and I’m starting to avoid places that need them. Nope, that’s all I needed, sorry. Thanks anyway, and have a great day!”
I like this idea because
- you’re affirming the target behaviour
- you’re getting a coffee and going
- you’re being chipper so they don’t feed off your grumpy face
- you’re providing feedback without being too much ‘that guy’, I hope, to the serving staff.
In all things, you don’t wanna be That Guy, because you know servers don’t need that shit. But, while the odds are slim of feedback getting up the chain of command, you’re being clear (and probably more concise) as to how to get more of your business in case the feedback DOES go up.
Korhaka@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
I just take my brick phone out and say that I can’t use their app on this. Although once went to the pub after work and it meant I didn’t need to pay for any of my drinks which was nice.
Tregetour@lemdro.id 1 year ago
because you know servers don’t need that shit.
No. Dead wrong. It’s precisely the frontline staff who need customer feedback, and if makes them uncomfortable then so much the better.
It’s the rank and file’s job to pass criticism of the service offering on in team meetings, culture surveys, etc. My job sucks this week because I have to do x and yet the customers all hate it. Staff will drive change to policy when it’s their ears copping the response day-to-day.
‘I couldn’t possibly bother the floor person’ is code for ‘I am going to tolerate in silence any corporate policy no matter how obnoxious’, and line management and the executive know it.
AlligatorBlizzard@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
LOL, as a rank and file, corporate doesn’t care. I pass along feedback, but even if they lose 1% of their business, corporate won’t stop their bullshit.
LovableSidekick@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I’m tired of everybody wanting to see everything in binary good/bad terms.
Eezyville@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Tech doesn’t make the world better. It’s a tool that’s been used to make rich people richer. Everyday people coming together for a greater cause makes the world better.
barryamelton@lemmy.ml 1 year ago
Tech is a tool. It can be benefitting the oligarchs and restrictive, or benefitting society and open source.
ragebutt@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 year ago
Tech was ruined in the 90s when capitalistic influences (microsoft being the dominant force but far from the only one) propagandized the industry and eventually populace at large with the idea that competition in the industry is what drives innovation.
Granted, much of their work was already done for them thanks to western influence perpetuating this ideal for ages. But when the frameworks for open standards, interoperability, and collaborative development were being proposed and put into place they were shot down and/or actively sabotaged
As a result 40 years later we have this mess. A landscape filled with nightmare tech. Fragmentation everywhere, design heavily influenced by a small handful of sociopaths with no empathy and active disdain for users, the idea of open standards is something that requires government intervention (and still rarely occurs), interoperability is something that has to be hacked around and frequently breaks as a means to encourage purchasing a competing product.
What could have been. Tech designed for people’s needs rather than tech designed to extract income
Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Tech was ruined in the 90s
40 years later
Pick one. I’m 41 and was born in 1983.
ragebutt@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 year ago
My basic math skills have been terrible lately. I made a basic math error in a post the other day too. I was a strong student in math too
Is this cognitive decline? I’m not even 40
sbv@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
tbf, the past few years have felt like decades
MusketeerX@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Technology has started to make it easier and easier to be anti consumer. To maximise how much you can extract out of consumers.
It is making it easier to understand and control exactly how they use products and services. This allows you to structure your price and offering to give them the minimum amount they’ll accept at the maximum price. Allows you to strip features out and offer them for extra. Allows you to hide things behind ongoing subscriptions. Allows you to better lock people into products and services, making it more difficult to switch/leave.
All of this was possible (and being done) before, but technology makes this so much easier/better.
Technologies often start out by making something easier for the consumer. But beyond the early stages, it’s all about making the world better - for the corporations developing and selling products and services.
socsa@piefed.social 1 year ago
Something, something, the industrial revolution and its consequences...
Imgonnatrythis@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Technology and progress were at one time closer to synonymous but those definitions have forked widely. It’s important to identify what is a development that brings value and pushes progress and what is a use of technology that punishes us, controls us, or simply makes life more complicated. The vast majority of technology now falls into these categories.
Telodzrum@lemmy.world 1 year ago
For the past 20 years, tech has promised to make things more efficient while making almost everything more complicated and less meaningful. Innovation, for innovation’s sake, has eroded our craftsmanship, relationships, and ability to think critically.
I feel this in my bones.
Zorque@lemmy.world 1 year ago
They’re conflating tech with tech bros.
Tech can and does make lots of things that make our lives longer and better. Just not most of the consumer level shit that is constantly peddled by snake oil sellers. That tech is not meant to make your lives easier, it’s meant to get more money out of you without giving it up to the little people at service level.
The problem isn’t the tech, it’s the people who are controlling the tech.
metaldream@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
The problem isn’t the tech, it’s the people who are controlling the tech.
The tech is literally made by those by people. The tech itself is in fact the problem. You will never have a version of something like social media that’s actually healthy. One way or the other someone with power will get their hands on it and abuse it.
SocialMediaRefugee@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I feel this every time I just want to see a restaurant’s menu and instead I have to pretend I’m making an online order.
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Yeah, just print it and stick it on the table. Or have a tablet or something at the table if it changes frequently.
Don’t make me use my phone to look up your menu, that’s just tacky.
qjkxbmwvz@startrek.website 1 year ago
For many things I completely agree.
We just had our second kid, and neither set of grandparents live locally. That we can video chat with our family — for free, essentially! — is astonishing. And it’s not a big deal, not something we plan, just, “hey let’s say hi to Gramma and Gramps!”
When I was a kid videoconferencing was exclusive to seriously high end offices. And when we wanted to make a long distance call, we’d sometimes plan it in advance and buy prepaid minutes (this is on a landline, mid 90s maybe). Now my mom can just chat with her friend “across the pond” whenever she wants, from the comfort of her couch, and for zero incremental cost.
I think technology that “feels like tech” is oftentimes a time sink and a waste. But the tech we take for granted? There’s some pretty amazing stuff there.
The_v@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Tech tends to goes through stages:
A need or idea is created. Usually by a small independent entity.
A proof of concept is developed and starts to gain ground.
Investors poor money into the concept to an extreme degree. Tech grows in functionality, matures and develops into a useful tool.
The the investors demand a return on the investment and the money dries up.
Company either goes bankrupt or their product goes to shit.
lordbritishbusiness@lemmy.world 1 year ago
There’s magic and then there’s complexity in tech (at least this is how I think about it). Video calling, pure magic, simple to use with major benefits. Complex business management software that requires a degree to use? Complexity almost for complexity’s sake to lock an organisation into a support contract. Web stores? Usually magic, especially with refined payment processing and smooth ordering. Can verge into over complex coughAmazoncough. Internal network administration (Active Directory) and cloud tech, often complexity for complexity’s sake again.
ch00f@lemmy.world 1 year ago
for free, essentially!
Say that to the Facebook Portal a fantastic product five years ago that is now having its features gutted because Meta couldn’t figure out how to make money off of it.
htrayl@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Tech has made things more efficient - the rewards of such are simply being funneled from the average person to the wealthy.
Telodzrum@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Maybe some tech has increased efficiency (although, when it does that increase is more often than not temporary and short lived), but there is even more “tech” that swarms that space rent seeking any time, money, or other resource saved by that increased efficiency. After the efficiencies degrade, the tech-as-a-scam persists and you end up with less efficient systems than you started with.
Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Yeah, just watch what AI does. The generation after Gen Alpha is going to be unable to imagine the concept of being self sustaining, and problem solving without machines. The same way Gen Z today can’t imagine the concept of just NOT having internet. Or any internet connected devices.
mox@lemmy.sdf.org 1 year ago
I’m tired of people saying “technology” when they mean an application of a narrow subfield of technology. Quite often, they’re not even talking about the tech at all, but instead the practices, leadership, or stock market performance of some corporation that happens to use or produce such a thing in the course of its business.
I do share the sentiment in this article, though. There’s way too much stuff that we don’t need being pushed upon us in order to extract wealth or power.
Technus@lemmy.zip 1 year ago
My phone struggled to load the site to order a single cold brew, pop-ups to install the custom App kept obscuring the options, and I had to register with my phone number, email address, and first and last name to buy a $5 cup of coffee.
Then walk out. Don’t reward the bullshit with your money. The coffee shop ain’t gonna give a shit if you keep buying coffee just to go home and complain on your blog.
Ulrich@feddit.org 1 year ago
Maybe they did? You’re kinda missing the point though, which is that this stuff is becoming more and more common and will be nigh-unavoidable in the future.
Technus@lemmy.zip 1 year ago
It’s clear they did not walk out.
By the time I placed my order - paying a 1% fee to the app makers in the process - I would have happily paid double for the experience of simply flipping through a menu and talking to another human being.
(Emphasis mine.) This is from the very next paragraph after what I quoted.
You also clearly missed the point of my comment, which is that unless consumers start refusing to take this bullshit lying down, this stuff will be unavoidable in the future because there will be no other choices left.
Krelis_@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Or… ask the staff for a menu, order with them, respectfully let them know how you feel about the qr/app thing (unlikely it was their decision to implement but they can pass on the complaint), and if they’re unwilling to take your order (which is hopefully unlikely at this point) feel free to make a little stink (if you feel inclined) and walk out. Still ok to complain on your blog about being spammed with the app but I’d rather try the obvious options first.
fan0m@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Boy do I have a story for you.
I tried to order a quesadilla from chipotle. A online exclusive. Turns out online ordering for the location nearest me was broken so I went in and explained that I was unable to order it, and I asked if I can just get one anyway. They flat out said no.
They refused to sell me a cheese quesadilla simply because it wasn’t ordered through their app/site which was broken. I just left and got food somewhere else.
I’ve been boycotting chipotle ever since.
Technus@lemmy.zip 1 year ago
That’s assuming the employees give enough of a shit to pass the feedback on to the owners, and that the owners give enough of a shit to listen.
Yeah, it’s better if you make it known why you’re not giving them your business, but if it doesn’t appreciably impact their revenue then most owners won’t care either way.
multiplewolves@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Came here to say this. I will never be compelled to install an app on my phone by an eatery the first time I go there. That is severely hostile design. Don’t willingly inconvenience yourself just to freely provide them your tracking info to sell.
VerticaGG@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 year ago
I remember Andrewism’s take on Luddites dispelling a lot of common misconceptions (and results of propaganda, iirc) on the topic
Xerxos@lemmy.ml 1 year ago
Tech could make our life easier, if only the fruits of increased efficiency would go towards us all instead of the few rich people at the top.
DJDarren@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
If only the goal of the tech firms was to make the world better while making enough money to achieve this, rather than their goal being to make as much shareholder value as possible while ekeing out improvements on a schedule that fits their need to maximise profits.
hsdkfr734r@feddit.nl 1 year ago
I don’t agree. Technology in itself is not helpful nor harmful. It’s a tool like a hammer or a knife or a pen and a block of paper.
I agree if one says that technology makes it easier to do harm.:) People and their motives and actions are the same as always, since the stone age and ago.
metaldream@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
Good God you people are deep in the sauce. Just straight up ignoring the fact that tech enabled propaganda to be spammed in people’s faces 24/7. It’s so obviously a net drag on society at this point.
NewAccountEachYear@discuss.online 1 year ago
Technology is not neutral, and philosophers have known this since the middle of the 20th century. See for example Heidegger, Ellul, Arendt.
Technology makes us relate to the world and others in a distorted way. Instead of speaking to you directly, and see your face and features, I relate to you through pure text… A whole lot of important factors disappear as I do. Compare this then to politics, earth, society, where technology have the same effect
lobut@lemmy.ca 1 year ago
Or like the death ray!
(Futurama reference)
meyotch@slrpnk.net 1 year ago
I think a clear distinction to make might be:
“Tech” as used in this sense is the industrial complex around mobile and web technologies dominated by a few players who might just be evil.
“Technology” is, of course, everything you mentioned and more. A rock that fits nicely in your hand becomes technology when used to crack a coconut.
It’s a weird linguistic murkiness, isn’t it?
hsdkfr734r@feddit.nl 1 year ago
The field of language, the meaning of words in different contexts… Communication in general, they wrote books over books about it…
Yes. Murky. :)
jsomae@lemmy.ml 1 year ago
the article is talking about both, or perhaps conflates the two. QR code menus.
Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 1 year ago
The original use of what we now think of as a “spoon” originally had nothing to do with food.
1000 years ago they would chain slaves neck to neck. They’d use the spoon to carve out everybodies eyes except the first guy in the line. Slaves don’t need to see. They just need to carry heavy shit. The first slave can see. The rest just need to go where their neck drags them.
I say all this to agree with you. Technology isn’t the source of corruption and evil. It is just a tool. Just like a spoon. I use my spoon to eat cereal. Others use the spoon to carve out peoples eyes. The spoon is not evil. The spoon is a tool.
hsdkfr734r@feddit.nl 1 year ago
Never heard of this spoon invention story. I have doubts.:) I’m almost certain that eyes have been carved out by means of spoon. War, civil unrest and suppression of weaker minorities show that we have it in us.
JollyG@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I think when most people say something like “technology is making the world worse” they mean the technology as it actually exists and as it is actually developing, not the abstract sense of possible futures that technology could feasibly deliver.
That is clearly what the author of the piece meant.
If the main focus of people who develop most technology is getting people more addicted to their devices so they are easier to exploit the. Technology sucks. If the main focus is to generate immoral levels of waste to scam venture capitalists and idiots on the internet then technology sucks. If the main focus is to use technology to monetize every aspect of someone’s existence, then I think it is fair to say that technology, at this point in history, sucks.
Saying “technology is neutral” is not super insightful if, in the present moment, the trend in technological development and its central applications are mostly evil.
Saying “technology is neutral” is worse than unhelpful if, in the present moment, the people who want to use technology to harm others are also using that cliche to justify their antisocial behavior.
hsdkfr734r@feddit.nl 1 year ago
When the discussion is about whether technology + an unregulated human society is likely to end badly, then there is not much to discuss.
There are real life test series. In the 80s many countries put rules into place which forced the industry to filter/ treat their emissions. Technology gooood.
Some countries restrict their people’s access to personal fire arms more than others. Statistics show that shootings are more likely, when everybody has a gun. Technology baaad.
In my opinion it is mostly about the common rules a society agrees on. Technology amplifies both ways and needs to be moderated when it is misused.
ShittyBeatlesFCPres@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Fentanyl is a technology.
Dagwood222@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Atomic bombs are also tools with no moral compass of their own.
Reverendender@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
I don’t want to read this article, because I know it’s right, and it’s depressing.
shortrounddev@lemmy.world 1 year ago
The internet peaked in utility around 2004. Most, if not all, developments since then have only made things worse
demizerone@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Worst thing to happen to tech is ads.
Tja@programming.dev 1 year ago
People weren’t willing to pay with money. Usually every tech product with ads has an “insert coin to remove” option. If you don’t insert coin, advertisers will.
Tamo240@programming.dev 1 year ago
Paying for the product and paying to not be inconvenienced by ads have become separate things. The first is standard business, the second is extortion.