Submitted 1 day ago by doopinglouie@feddit.org to technology@lemmy.world
https://obsidian.md/blog/free-for-work/
I just don’t see the point of obsidian et al.
Just use a directory structure and save markdown files in it.
There are many apps that are great editors for this structure on every platform. IDK exactly what obsidian does but many editors have zettelkasten (fancy cross links) functionality, just no fancy graph.
Ghostty + helix is the sexxy RN.
the extensions mostly
Read whole page. Not sure what Obsidian even is?
Note-taking app. Each note is a markdown file, so you can add formatting.
A very successful one with a large extension ecosystem to boot.
It’s like trillium, but not open source Here is an enthusiastic person talking about the state of the art of one year ago for 20 minute. youtu.be/XRpHIa-2XCE
It’s interesting that a closed-source app has good reputation among FOSS enthusiasts. Surely they are not a Microsoft or Apple, but still who controls your computer, you or them?
It stores your data in plaintext, and simply uses the program to parse special formatting characters. The program itself is closed-source, but anyone could write an open source version to parse the same info. Even if Obsidian ceases to exist overnight, the data itself is still safe on your machine and readable by anyone who cares enough to try.
Hol up. Are notes stored in files in a directory structure or a single file? Just that you said “the file” so I’m wondering.
If so, that’s lock in.
There in fact are FOSS alternatives like Joplin. Personally, I actually switched from Joplin to Obsidian due to a larger community (and therefore community-driven plugins) and overall a more polished UX. That being said, I have the security of switching back if Obsidian ever becomes evil or unusable.
Another aspect is that the entire source code is technically viewable (partially obfuscated) since it’s a web app. Having written plugins for Obsidian, you’re very much interacting with the source code itself. Feels like open source with extra steps and I wish one day they will finally make the switch to true FOSS.
And the old version you have on the pc still works, since there is no cloud communication needed to run it.
Markdown is also an open format. You aren’t forced to use Obsidian for everything, and there are already numerous programs that are capable of displaying the formatted end-file, because it’s standard markdown.
It’s not some proprietary thing that only Obsidian uses.
True. The other day I uploaded a photo that should be portrait instead of landscape. I opened Nemo ( Linux file explorer), right clicked to edit image, fixed it, and automatically my note picked up the change.
Similar thing when storing a 1000 line json in the notes
I just wish the price of having the publish feature was slightly lower. They’d get much more subscribers, including me.
I just cant wrap my head around why they willing to go so far to gain good will from people by having such a generous free tier, but somehow licensing the code under a FOSS license is out of the question??
Why not just go all the way and make sure everyone who cares about reading the souce could also give you free contributions?
Yep and the Android app is full of small things to improve, for sure someone would put in contributions for free
Well, the good news? A wider audience most certainly means a FLOSS suite that can parse the data from it. It doesn’t seem very opaque, but more like Markup++.
I think the big difference is that you can use it for free without any account needed, and all your data is stored locally in a format that remains accessible to alternative apps.
So the moment they start doing questionable stuff you are not a hostage to their app. There are alternatives, they are just not as nice as this currently.
Obsidian stores the notes in a well known plaintext format on your computer. They can’t easily hold you hostage like with other closed source apps.
I couldn’t get work to pay for it so I found a better, cheaper alternative, Notesnook. It’s open source (client and sync server), you can publish notes, and it’s end-to-end encrypted.
It says it’s free, but then there’s a pricing and plans page?
Thanks for sharing I didn’t know about this one and it’s robust as keep
i use notally for quick notes and reminders but i needed another organizer for longer text
i started trying notesnook after reading your comment and it looks like what i needed. The only problem is that constant login reminder. Is there a way to get rid of it?
The community plugin “Google Drive Sync” is free, open source, and lets you (clunkily but effectively) bypass Obsydian Sync. One less server to manage.
There’s also syncthing, which allows syncing a folder… Hell theres even a git plugin to bypass obsidian sync, so you can get version controlled notes (which might be desirable in a work setting)
Can you selfhost a sync server? Be completely independent of them?
technically yes. they just recently made the sync server open source - github.com/streetwriters/notesnook-sync-server - but their documentation for it is still pending.
I’ve been following their progress for a while and can say that they appear to be following through on all their goals. and are very responsive to issues on GitHub. but don’t take my word for it, check out their roadmap to see when they release the self hosting documentation- notesnook.com/roadmap/
It is a really good app. But was a pain in the ass to keep the archive in sync using multiple different platforms without paying for their sync addon in my experience. You can roll your own sync with stuff like Syncthing, cloud storage, etc. But the archive had a bad habit of seemingly finding ways to get out of sync.
The biggest issue I had was with folder permissions on Android. I also ended up paying for the sync functionality and have zero regrets.
I just paid for the sync 🤷🏻♂️
It’s $4 a month, I drink one beer less a month and I actually save 3€ 😀
Oh I don’t disagree, it is worth it. I ended up paying for it myself before I switched to Joplin. I just went down a rabbit hole of realizing I technically could self host the backend, stubbornly trying to make it work well well beyond what was good sense. 😅
I’ve had zero problems with Dropbox.
This post was how I learned about Obsidian.
For those of you that love it, how do you use it daily?
Daily notes. I have a template that prompts me to fill out a number details I might otherwise forget.
A wiki of people that helps me remember details about people I meet or have worked with. Makes it much easier to keep in touch and to remember important dates in their lives.
Sortable todo lists, with due date and urgency information. I can add to the lists directly from any other note using a Dataview formula with the Tasks extension.
Career plans. Project plans. Gardening plans. Recipes (there’s an awesome extension that imports recipes from the web).
Any random writing I might want to do, from short stories to rough drafts of letters to stream of consciousness mind spew that I want to review later.
I use the Auto Note Mover and Dataview extensions, along with backlinks and tags, to keep all of my notes organized automatically. I use the Linter extension to make sure things are formatted nicely. When I started using Obsidian, I used the Importer extension yo easily pull in all of my existing notes and lists from Evernote and Google Keep.
Honestly, that barely scratches the surface.
Daily journal Task list / project management Note taking Mind mapping Resource archive
I’ve got my vault automated pretty well at this point. I honestly don’t know what I would do without it.
For those of you that are wondering, everything is markdown independent, all of my plugins address UI or vault automation processes that leave all of my information entirely portable.
here’s a bunch of possible applications:
so you watched a movie and wonder what other movies you own have the same starring actor: search movie, click link to the star page, check backlinks.
obviously not the best use case because imdb exists but this is personal and could be extrapolated to any collection you have, maybe even all of them. why not have the movie adaptation link to the original book?
you can think about it like: imagine if you could make a bunch of wiki pages. the formatting isn’t quite as nice but essentially that’s what you’re doing. a bunch of pages with text, images, links and tags, that you can browse through. what would you use it for?
I use Obsidian as a tool to help my shitty memory.
I want to have one single place where I can go search for a thing I know I saw somewhere but can’t remember where or what it was exactly
“Did I watch movie X” -> Obsidian -> Watchlist -> Movies and there it’ll be.
Same for tv-series, anime, books, games. Yes there are services that do it like Trakt, Imdb, Letterboxd, TVMaze and god knows how many for games. They all get enshittified eventually requiring you to pay for basic functionality (looking at you trakt…)
I’m building a tool for getting my data out from all those services into Obsidian markdown format, maybe It’ll get finished some day :D (IMDB and Goodreads work, but you need to do a manual csv export)
“How did I install that finicky piece of software last time” -> Obsidian, I wrote something down because I knew I couldn’t remember it. Then I’ll improve the guide + refresh with new data.
Now I have a pretty good step-by step guide on how to set up a computer, no matter the OS, just how I like it - all in Obsidian. Mostly just commands I copy-paste and some manual steps that I can’t be arsed to automate.
Same with my daily notes, I just write down what I did maybe with some tags so I can find them when I start wondering when did I visit X or put up the curtains in the bedroom.
How did I install that finicky piece of software last time
This. So much this. Every time I start a new project I’m so glad to have these notes to refer back to.
For the movies I use Jellyfin/Trakt and for what I still want I use the *arrs.
Weekly.
As a personal knowledgebase and todo list.
I use it to track everything…
Quick notes knowledgebase Follow up (personal and work)
The great thing about Obsidian is how flexible it is. The bad thing about Obsidian is how flexible it is… 😀
I have seen may people comment, or outright leave, Obsidian because because there was too much to learn… or too many plugins to explore…
Personally, I only look for plugins if I need something specific. Don’t see the point of trying random plugins. Is like spending time finding solutions to a problem you may not have…
Also, I work on tech and many documents are in markdown. Obsidian makes it easier to read those. Specially the collapse / expand functionality is really great for exploring large docs… as long as the creators properly used sections (basically # for level 1, ## for level 2…and so on)
I use it as a work journal and personal knowledge management (PKM). Each day I open a daily journal note (built from a template with an easy shortcut) that contain rough notes on what I did that day. From that note I link over to project notes for any project I worked on or complex issues, scratch notes, etc. I do split windows, one with a narrow view of the daily note and then a larger panel for content notes (like documenting the project or create a scratch note or searching for a note on a problem I had 2 years ago that I need to remember about). There are many useful plugins but Templater and “Various Complements” are my favorite. Templater allows me to configure a template for any note I want to configure, so I can create a new note then hit a shortcut that will prompt me for a page title and auto fill the note with my template (that includes tags, headings, etc) for a meeting or new project or scratch note. Templater can also organize the note and move it around on my filesystem. Various Complements plugin allows me to build a dictionary of anything I want that will then fill in like an IDE when I’m typing in a note. So I use it for all my coworker names, I type 4 letters of someone’s name and it pops up suggestions where I can tab-complete their full name.
It’s truly a great program, better for me than all the others I’ve tried: OneNote, TiddlyWiki, DocuWiki, Dendron, and emacs. I used TiddlyWiki for years and had to bend it to my will in many wonky ways, then Obsidian came around and did 90% what I wanted out of the gate and the 3 or 4 plugins I use did the rest. I’ve been using it for a few years now.
Now that it’s free, are its users the product?
Holy shit this is huge. I can finally use obsidian at work! I was avoiding it due to the license and using Logseq. Which, to be fair, did admirably. But it’s much more and Outliner or journaling system than a knowledge base I feel.
Switched from Onenote to obsidian. There was a small learning curve and I had to install some plugins, but I love it. It looks amazing and runs so much faster than OneNote ever did.
I like the Markdown-based approach but Sync is way to expensive for my use-case…
I thought this was about a different obsidian lol
Saw this, super cool. Hope they make tons of money with Obsidian Sync
The android app want to quit when you hit the /acl button and it drives my nuts
Use Logseq. It’s amazing IMO. And OSS
Cool. Available for windows, linux and iOS. I tried to use todoist, but it has some real problems syncing and arranging data. I spent hours creating a worflow only to lose more than half of it when trying to sync it across devices. I hope Obsidian will do better.
This is the same conversation they had with reddit for years. It’s being developed for everyone and we’ll make it open some day. Now look what happened.
I use obsidian but only with the bare minimum knowing that I may have to jump ship at any moment.
Whoo, some good news. Time to ask “Central IT” for it and get ready for another six month rodeo.
I assume this means free for local use? Not any kind of backups?
It’s always been free for me using Mobius Sync…
prof@infosec.pub 1 day ago
I don’t necessarily like a few takes in the comments here.
Vibes wise the Obsidian team seems to be great and they don’t seem to have shown any reason why I should distrust them. I love FOSS but gifting others my work doesn’t put food on my table, so in that sense they need to have a lucrative business model which they seem to have established.
I could use SyncThing, Git or other solutions to do synchronisation between my devices but I choose to buy their Sync offer, since I want to support them (they also have EU servers, which need to be GDPR compliant by law afaik).
The closest comparison I could make is NextCloud. NextCloud open sources their software, but they sell convenience. Sure, you could self host it, but paying them to do so for you may be more attractive. In comparison Obsidian is not really complicated to set up or maintain. It’s literally just a MD-editor. So the only convenient thing to sell is synchronisation if you don’t want to put a price tag on the software.
If they open source all their code, some tech wizard will implement a self hosted obsidian sync server with the same convenience as theirs in a day, and the company will lose their revenue stream.
We’ve all been burned by tech bros in one way or another, but I think it’s ok for people to profit off of their IP. And they seem to be doing so with a positive vision. Feel free to let me eat my words if they ever go rogue, but that’s my 2 cents.
ChickenAndRice@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
Thanks for the rare, rational comment regarding Obsidian. Many people here seem to think releasing software as closed source automatically means you have something to hide; seemingly forgetting we live in a capitalist system in which you must constantly sell your services to survive. (I am saying this as someone who adores FOSS and donates to most of my homelab software on a regular basis).
I think a more productive way to look at is: is the closed source dev friendly (or at least non-hostile) to the open source community? In the case of Obsidian, they haven’t done anything egregious, and regularly contribute to open source plugins. Furthermore, the notes are stored as markdown files. This gives the user strong resistance against potential enshittification, so even if they did go rogue you can just move to some other text editor lol. Granted, you would miss out on plugins but otherwise that’s a good reason to keep your plugin usage light and plan your Obsidian vault accordingly.
nickwitha_k@lemmy.sdf.org 1 day ago
Absolutely. I just have trust issues with closed source software and platforms. Burned too many times.
nahostdeutschland@feddit.org 18 hours ago
Obsidian is storing everything as plaintext files. Those convenient selfhosted sync solutions have been out there for years.
prof@infosec.pub 18 hours ago
It’s not just about syncing files. It’s also the fact I can edit stuff on my tablet and see the changes in almost real time on my laptop with Obsidian Sync. I believe most other solutions wouldn’t play nice with such a workflow.
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
I absolutely agree. That doesn’t mean the software has to be closed source though, a lot of software works well when sold with paid support, especially to companies.
If the price is low enough, companies will often just pay even if they don’t need the support.
prof@infosec.pub 18 hours ago
That’s a bit naive imho. Remaining closed source is a form of IP protection and that’s really ok for what Obsidian is (a markdown editor). There’s just not any benefit for them other than appreciation from FOSS enthusiasts. Also maintaining an open source repository causes a higher workload and they lose a lot of freedom.
If privacy is your concern you don’t need source code anyway. It’s quite easy to sandbox an application like that and analyse network traffic and such. Also Obsidian is built using Electron. That means with enough motivation one could quite easily reverse engineer most of the app. Most of the applications behaviour can also be observed via the integrated dev console, which lets you view source code.
In short I don’t really see the need, unless I want to build or maintain it myself. And I think the negatives far outweigh the positives from the perspective of Obsidians team.
Daeraxa@lemmy.ml 17 hours ago
Joplin is more directly comparable. The apps are open source and it offers sync with all kinds of targets. It monetises through a source available sync server (i.e you can run your own but you arent allowed to run it commercially) hosted by Joplin (Joplin Cloud)
For transparency im directly involved with Joplin as a volunteer (less so in recent months admittedly) so yeah, im a bit biased.
magikmw@lemm.ee 17 hours ago
One thing that keeps me really calm about obsidian is the plaintext database. I can live with a proprietary db if the code is foss and I can fudge my data out if I need to. If code and db are proprietary, I’m not putting my data there if I can help it.