“Struggling” implies the American Auto industry is at least trying to keep pace. But really, they aren’t trying at all. They are content to sit back thinking their current flock of geese will lay golden eggs forever even as more and more of those geese drop dead from old age.
BYD Reveals the ‘World’s Longest-Range EV’ as American Auto Industry Struggles to Keep Pace
Submitted 2 weeks ago by return2ozma@lemmy.world to technology@lemmy.world
Comments
Vieric@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
CosmoNova@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
That‘s the main problem in Europe as well. I don‘t mind tariffs on heavily subsidized cars that are designed not to make profit but to destroy our industries. However, even then our manufacturers are in a constant crisis mode and unable to adapt. It‘s really pathetic.
But hey, when the car lobby is dead maybe that means more trains and cycling paths in the long run? Perhaps there‘s an opportunity here.
SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
It’s all thanks to Germany though. They are the ones who have succeeded in scrapping the bill to ban new ICE vehicle sales after 2035
BoJackHorseman@lemmy.today 2 weeks ago
Isn’t profit supposed to bring prices down?
Looks like crapitalists are scared to shit of free market competition.
Riverside@reddthat.com 2 weeks ago
China has the battery production technologies and capabilities, the electric motor production, an unbelievable economy of scale, and insane levels of automation in their EV Factories, those are the main reasons behind their pricing and not “subsidies to destroy our industries”. Most subsidies, AFAIK, were tax cuts to purchases in China.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
our manufacturers are in a constant crisis mode and unable to adapt
in 2023, Tesla released all the specs to move EVs to a 48V architecture to Detroit, saving a tremendous amount of wiring and eliminating the need for most sub systems and secondary computers. Detroit just ignored it, until 2026, and now Ford invented 48V architecture.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
But really, they aren’t trying at all.
GM’s biggest sales increases are with Cadillac EVs last year.
Detroit followed the Tesla model, with the highest profit margins in the industry because their CEO convinced simps EVs should be expensive. So they jumped in early with poorly designed and expensive vehicles, thinking Tesla stans were everywhere.
There was a time, worldwide, if you just wanted a reliable and low cost sedan, you bought a Ford or Chevy, and they sold millions. But round 2016, Detroit lost interest in lower cost vehicles, and by 2020, they got addicted to price gouging cheap vehicles to make them expensive, and why not, people were paying $70,000+ for a Jeep and just taking it up the ass.
Given Detroit abandoned that part of the market, they shouldn’t care if Chinese EVs arrive, right? Because their $60,000 EVs are a better product, right?
ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net 2 weeks ago
Tesla was definitely trying…
paper_moon@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Ah yes, I too attempt to accomplish tasks by being a leader and going completely insane.
dude@lemmings.world 2 weeks ago
Half of the Tesla vehicles are made in China, they are not competing with the Chinese EVs but they are the Chinese EVs themselves instead
dan@upvote.au 2 weeks ago
The Teslas that are made in China are noticeably higher quality than the ones made in the USA. Fewer panel gaps and better fit and finish.
The only reason Teslas are decent quality is because the majority of them are made in China. Over 50% of Teslas are made in China, using over 90% local (Chinese) parts.
DupaCycki@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
American Auto Industry Struggles to Keep Pace
You mean lobbies the government to ban Chinese EVs, because they have no means of competing whatsoever? Free market for me, but not for thee.
innermachine@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Has always been this way. Back in the late 70/early 80s, Harley couldn’t compete with the Japanese bikes so they lobbied to daddy fed to make sure all the foreign bikes got tarriffed out of existence over 700cc. So the Japanese said “hold my soju” and made 699cc motorcycles that still made more power than the gargantuan Harley bikes of the time. USA has always tried to give US based companies a leg up over objectively superior products. Our tax dollars are why there are any American car companies left, sure Ford didn’t get a direct bail out but we use them for police and other service vehicles across the country which has helped keep them afloat. Plus obviously Chrysler and GM taking govt bailouts and still flailing desperately while making trash vehicles and wondering why they don’t sell. The American auto industry doesn’t struggle to keep pace, it has NEVER caught up to or even compared to the rest of the world. They have always been 30+ years behind any European or Asian vehicle.
lechekaflan@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
So the Japanese said “hold my sake”
FTFY. Soju is Korean.
commanderschlepper@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
I love history like this! Thanks for sharing! (Hold my sake might be more accurate lol)
Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
Not like other countries arent doing the literal same.
But we also dont scream into the world that we are “LaNd oF tHe FrEe”Soggy@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
There was a while when the US was on top, revolutionizing automotive manufacturing. Ford’s Model T and later Model A sold like crazy.
Bieren@lemmy.today 2 weeks ago
It’s not struggling to keep pace. It’s not trying to keep pace.
KimjongTOOILL@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Dealers arent incentivized to promote a vehicle that requires less maintenance they can mark up.
nomy@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Maybe car dealerships are part of the problem.
AA5B@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Someone should tell them “struggle to keep pace” is different “abandoning the attempt”
chiliedogg@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Not having to keep pace. They just get the competitive cars banned in the US, then charge so much fucking money here for their shit products it’s worth losing the rest of the world.
Ilovethebomb@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
1,036 km (644 miles) on a single charge under China’s CLTC testing standard.
Does anyone know how realistic this range is? You can get some absurd range from a vehicle if you’re driving on a closed course at 60kmh with no air conditioning or entertainment.
zer0squar3d@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
en.wikipedia.org/…/China_Light-Duty_Vehicle_Test_…
The CLTC testing accounts for the country’s higher congestion levels with more frequent stop-and-go and lower speed limits, which lead to increased low-speed driving and longer idling times that benefits electric vehicles.
Ilovethebomb@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
Right, so you’re not getting anywhere near that on the open road.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
WLTP, which is closer to US Highway driving, estimates 800 km. Or 500 Eagles.
frank@sopuli.xyz 2 weeks ago
According to wiki
CTLC 509 km (316 mi)
EPA 390 km (242 mi)
So yeah take a solid 25%+ off
postnataldrip@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Came across this which I’ve not validated but does seem to make sense at a glance: Comparison of WLTP and CLTC
Based on that the WLTP range would be 828-900km (515-560 miles).
Real world, 6-700km at a guess?
dupelet_comments@piefed.social 2 weeks ago
The WLTP is pretty accurate to the actual range I get on my BYD.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
Cut another third off that in cold weather.
jjlinux@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Sounds about right. My experience in range difference is very similar.
AlternatePersonMan@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Yeah, the EV range is frustrating.
270 miles? Pretty good. Except you shouldn’t drive it below 20% or above 80%, so really the range is like 170. Cold winter? Now it’s like 75.
No regrets on our EV, but I would feel a whole more more comfortable with 2x the capacity.
Too bad we can’t buy BYD here.
jjlinux@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
I can attest that the blade battery doesn’t seem to care if you take it all the way to 100% or drop it as low as 5% regularly. I’ve had my car for over 3 years now, and the battery degradation has been negligible. I’ve lost 1% over all this time, and both our cars (BYD HAN and Tang) are consistently allowed to drop under 10% before we decide to go charge them back to 100%. Granted, we live in the Caribbean, so we don’t have to deal with cold weather ever.
Cethin@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Never heard the “above 80%” thing. I’m pretty sure you’re wrong about this. With lead-acid batteries, this was optimal. I’m pretty confident that lithium ion batteries it’s best to keep the charge as high as possible. Ideally you’d only ever use it fully charged. It’s health is harmed by draining it low/fully.
I don’t own an EV, but I know enough about it that I’m pretty sure this is the case. You should look it up for your vehicle though. This advice also applies to phones and other lithium ion batteries too. Lead-acid was damaged by keeping the charge high, but lithium ion is damaged when low, and almost all devices are lithium ion now.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
Your mileage may vary.
1000km range is fucking stupid. No one should be driving that far at once, and they rest of the time you waste energy and money just carrying around thousands of pounds of batteries.
Then there is the fun of a car crash and shorting out over 120KW of energy.
Entertainmeonly@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 weeks ago
Ya, why do those big trucks have 40 gallon gas tanks? Not like anyone ever needs to drive that far at once.
daychilde@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
No one should be driving that far at once,
What a ridiculous blanket statement.
Nobody should make such silly blanket statements. :P
nyan@lemmy.cafe 2 weeks ago
1000km range is fucking stupid. No one should be driving that far at once
I take it you’ve never had an emergency while living in a remote area. Especially not one with cold winters that will tank your EV’s range.
driving_crooner@lemmy.eco.br 2 weeks ago
How much is the average used by daily drives? What about the 90% percentile. Something like 1000km must be on the extremely tail that. The only distance I can think of 1000km is going to and back from São Paulo to Rio.
A 1000km range is a complete waste of resources.
ManicMambo@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
When the selfdriving feature gets even better, 1000 km will be useful.
rumba@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Expect CLTC to be advertising the best possible range.
There’s a ceramic battery hitting the market that has a marginally higher density and nothing is stopping them from adding more batteries. There’s also a new hub-motor concept that has a lot less losses, but they’re not car sized yet.
Getting to 644 would be as easy as throwing more batteries at it, but i’d expect those numbers to come down a bit, or the price to be much higher.
lechekaflan@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
American Auto Industry Struggles to Keep Pace
Them being end up second place isn’t new, as these makers can’t help but throw in too many features but cut out the quality or improve efficiency, such as being unable to match the fuel efficiency of compact cars more than 50 years ago.
jaxxed@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
The Chinese models have more features, more technology, and more connectivity.
drmoose@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
It doesn’t matter US is so protectionist that american car brands simply can’t fail. Which tbf is understandable and the case in most countries but the point being that car competition domestically is only worthwhile discussion from protectionism pov not actual technology
Hossenfeffer@feddit.uk 2 weeks ago
644 miles? But what if I need to drive 650 miles once a decade? Electric cars are just a stoopid fad.
Gammelfisch@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
The US auto industry and market abandoned fuel efficient vehicles and continue to fail to improve BEV’s and the infrastructure to support them.
mlg@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
The American Auto Industry has been struggling to keep pace since the 80s lmao
They only exist because they threw their money at congress to make horsecrap legislation that bans competition.
They even assassinated sedans with EPA laws that stimulates everyone to make SUVs lol.
nodiratime@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
The only thing they can do is lobby, build bigger, expliot loopholes and maximize their margins.
Damage@feddit.it 2 weeks ago
They need to hire a design studio, it’s really ugly
clubb@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
Frenchgeek@lemmy.ml 2 weeks ago
There are cars that aren’t?
tinfoilhat@lemmy.ml 2 weeks ago
I dig it.
0x0@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Spyware on wheels.
IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
So the same as every American electric car
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
Burn your phone.
anon_8675309@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Tesla wants a word.
Someonelol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 weeks ago
I wish they would publish the battery capacity and fast charge rate. Assuming 4 miles per kWh I estimate it to be around 160kWh. If it can fast charge using a Megawatt charger then it could likely go from 20% to 80% in roughly 10 minutes gaining about 384 miles of range.
xenomor@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
It’s amusing to me that the same folks to deride Chinese car manufacturers because they are somehow cheating by getting support from the government are the same people demanding that the US government artificially protect the US car industry by blocking Chinese imports. The point being that neither side actually objects to government participation in the market. But, one side uses it to make better products and service consumers, and the other does it to protect worse products from market forces.
reev@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
“A free market is self regulating” until someone makes a better product for less money, I guess.
Quazatron@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
We tasted some of that self regulating ‘free market’ a while ago. Banks were having huge profits from the housing bubble until the subprime crisis hit, banks went into default, and the losses were picked up by public money.
My profit. Our losses.
CosmoNova@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
The point both of you deliberately overlook is that China is not participating in a free market anyway. They never played by those rules so there‘s no point in treating them the same way as anyone who does. There is a lot of hypocrisy to be found in politics and economics around the world and China itself is a prime example of that. But a measure to defend yourself from an obvious case of economic warfare is the most understandable thing in history. Your criticism is misplaced and irrational. I mean do you seriously think a monopoly is desirable?
Legitimate_lake@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
After that it’s “unfair competition” and the state has to intervene
yabbadabaddon@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
We should be critical of our manufacturers but we should also not forget China is basically getting its R&D for free by stealing tech from everybody (all do, but some more than others).
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
People CONSTANTLY harp on Chinese government support of the EV industry.
Name one ICE manufacturer not taking state and federal money. Detroit took $80B in handouts after 2008. That’s far more than the Chinese government has spent, and the largest investor in Chinese industry, by far, has been Apple Computers.
So China ended up with a new industry taking the world stage. What did we get from Detroit? Bloated low tech shit boxes that barely make it past warranty.
Blackmist@feddit.uk 2 weeks ago
The UK was constantly bribing car makers to stay, and most of them still fucked off.
HCSOThrowaway@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Don’t forget the bailouts:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit_bankruptcy
psoul@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Better products? What about geopolitical interests? If China doesn’t need oil then they don’t have to care if the strait of Hormuz is open or closed.
It’s a nice added benefit that they are better for the air, quieter and have more cargo space.