Comment on Littering 🚯

Solumbran@lemmy.world ⁨12⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

• FatVegan@leminal.space ⁨1⁩ ⁨hour⁩ ago

  Let’s try the not poisonous bulltes first. Because something tells me that Americans can’t even do that.

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• Cethin@lemmy.zip ⁨4⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

  OK, I think this is an incredibly stupid argument.

  From the ethical perspective of anti-meat, hunting animals is so much better. They get to live natural lives, and they die in a similar manner to they do in nature (maybe a little faster, which is good).

  From an environmental perspective, hunting keeps pray populations in naturally healthy levels, since most of their predators are driven out of populated areas, because people don’t like to be attacked by wild animals. It also doesn’t consume many resources, as they’re just living their lives in nature.

  I don’t think there’s any valid argument against hunting honestly, besides just being grossed out by it. That’s fine, and you can just not do it. I’ve never hunted in my life, and I suspect I never will. It’s not really something I want to do. I can’t construct a good argument against it though, and I suspect you can’t either. If you can, give it a shot, and remember animals dying and being eaten is natural, and frequently necessary to maintain an equilibrium that was evolved to be maintained by external factors. Deer, for example, will die horrible deaths of starvation, and do damage to the environment, if they aren’t hunted by humans.

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  • Senal@programming.dev ⁨3⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

    Crazy ape comment aside (i’d put it closer to apes with delusions of grandeur but that’s just me), not shooting guns and allowing hunting aren’t mutually exclusive.

    Especially given all the hunting that happened pre-gun.

    I don’t know if it’s on purpose but your answer seems to be ignoring a lot of the realities of how the things you are proposing would work (or not work, as the case may be).

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    • Cethin@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

      Sure, you can hunt without guns. I don’t really see an argument for not using them though, as long as there’s no lead. What’s really the ethical or environment argument in favor of only allowing bows, or whatever? I see the emotional appeal, if people have a negative view of guns. Not a logical appeal though, besides maybe making them harder to access to prevent deaths by firearms.

      I didn’t make any proposals in my above comment. I don’t know what you mean by saying you don’t see how they would work or not. I gave explanations of why hunting isn’t negative, and is often positive, but not any proposals of how anything should be done. Would you care to elaborate?

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  • Unquote0270@programming.dev ⁨1⁩ ⁨hour⁩ ago

    You must be exhausted after all those huge jumps in logic and reasoning.

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• Damarus@feddit.org ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

  The American mind cannot comprehend this

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  • arrow74@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

    What are you even talking about? There a plenty of people that hunt even here in Germany

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  • Pirat@lemmy.org ⁨9⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

    Not sure if you’re American or not but here’s a question for you. These bald eagles are allegedly dying from lead poisoning from eating creatures shot by lead bullets/pellets. This must mean they are scavenging. Yes, I know bald eagles do that a lot but they also kill their own prey. So why aren’t vultures dying of this lead poisoning. Vultures only scavenge so it should happen much more often.

    Here’s another thought. 80% of eagles brought into a clinic may be dying of lead poisoning but that 80% is part of a small number overall. Notice they never say how many eagles are brought in.

    Here’s another thought for you: When someone says such and such is the fastest growing demographic for such and such a thing, it could just mean that there were very few such incidences. 2 such incidences occurred when there used to be just one. WOW! Hundred percent increase? Such incidences have DOUBLED!

    Don’t let Rita Skeeter twist your thoughts. Get the whole story.

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    • Mouselemming@sh.itjust.works ⁨7⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

      Ingestion of lead ammunition is the primary reason California Condors almost became extinct, are still endangered, and aren’t having the greatest success with being reintroduced.

      As for bald eagles, they’re lazy smart, if they see takeout just sitting there, they’re not gonna make dinner from scratch.

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      • Pirat@lemmy.org ⁨7⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

        Secondary reply: I don’t know If I’d call bald eagles smart. When I drive by a road kill that has vultures and a bald eagle feasting at it, the vultures fly away from the road while the stupid eagle flies right in front of my car. I’ve nearly had them smash into my windshield several times. It is now my standard reaction to slow down if I see a bald eagle eating road kill. I don’t worry about the vultures because they know what to do.

        BTW, bald eagles were nearly driven extinct by DDT. We quit using that so bald eagles are now numerous enough that I have to brake to keep from hitting while they eat road kill despite the lead poisoning.

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      • Pirat@lemmy.org ⁨7⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

        Not denying the condor thing. Still didn’t answer the vulture thing. Yes, I know condors are a type of vulture but so are black vultures and turkey vultures which are more common than ever.

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    • Damarus@feddit.org ⁨6⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

      I couldn’t tell you and I don’t really care. Just jumping on the opportunity to mock gun culture

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• captainlezbian@lemmy.world ⁨7⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

  We killed the predators on a lot of our continent. Deer hunting is ecologically necessary here. And thats before we get into the boar problem

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• ArgentRaven@lemmy.world ⁨12⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

  The overwhelming majority of bullets are used against paper or steel targets. Most hunters take the entire carcass for butchering, so the eagles aren’t eating lead from animals shot and left in the wilderness. And given the volume needed, I wouldn’t be surprised that they’re eating fragments fired at steel targets that they mistake for rocks to keep in their stomach to grind up food.

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  • zxqwas@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

    Don’t know what they do over there, but we usually get the lungs and guts out as soon as possible in order to keep the meat from spoiling. Long lived predators that likes to scavenge can develop lead poisoning from those remains if it’s their main source of food.

    If confusing with rocks was the main source you’d expect it to be just as common in other birds.

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  • Catoblepas@piefed.blahaj.zone ⁨5⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

    This is untrue, gastroliths are associated only with birds that eat plants. They grind up food, which isn’t necessary for meat. Eagles eat bullets from animals that have either been shot and abandoned, lost, or had parts of them discarded as zqxwas pointed out.

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  • Solumbran@lemmy.world ⁨12⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

    That’s why I also mentioned to stop shooting guns. If you are shooting in such an unsafe way that fragments fly around and get lost, then you shouldn’t be allowed to shoot in the first place.

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    • kn33@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

      You’re not familiar with the concept of an outdoor target range, are you?

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      • Solumbran@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

        Yeah, it is a problem.

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• IchNichtenLichten@lemmy.wtf ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

  Plenty of people hunt for food. Lead ammo should be avoided though.

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• Gullible@sh.itjust.works ⁨12⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

  I think you might have some ontologically incongruous standards. We are crazy apes. You can take the guns away, but the murder will persist for millennia, if not gene edited out. Banning the guns and lead bullets is more likely to work than expecting humanity to spontaneously diverge from its evolutionary roots of the bang bus murder ape

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  • Solumbran@lemmy.world ⁨12⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

    I don’t know, humans are good at diverging from their instincts when it comes to letting sick people die, but when it comes to killing less, they cannot anymore?

    I think that low-ass standards are what prevent humans from getting any better, if you start justifying mindless murders as “just instinct” then of course people will be fine with it. And funnily enough, that’s one of the main arguments that hunters use, saying that they’re just doing something “natural”.

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    • Gullible@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

      We are killing less. And overwhelmingly so. If you don’t count faceless, recontectualized packaged cow, chicken, and pig meat. We’re also still pretty good about keeping our close group alive, but medicine men, insurance, and numbers over 100 are a strictly cultural practice not cemented within our genetic memory in any meaningful way, so society as a whole suffers under the burden of our limited empathy.

      You can also get into the economics of governance to get a good look at what it would mean to move the systems in place enough to reach the sort of universal socioeconomic safety that you’d personally find acceptable. I’m a fan of Europe’s deal… up to a point.

      I really don’t mean to cut things off, but the scope of this conversation would necessarily reach so incredibly wide that I don’t believe I can keep your attention or mine for a dozen pages of philosophy, biology, anthropology, history, psychology, and economics. In short, I, personally, can only expect people to fit neatly into a groove so long as it isn’t too far removed from the one we dug a hundred thousand years ago.

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  • SinningStromgald@lemmy.world ⁨12⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

    … bang bus murder ape

    Adding that into my book of wonderful phrases.

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    • Gullible@sh.itjust.works ⁨11⁩ ⁨hours⁩ ago

      Just don’t credit me, I’m pretty sure I plagiarized it in part from elsewhere

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