De-Google
The complaint is side loading is being restricted and the only long term alternative Apple. Google already began the process of shutting down Graphene by cutting drivers out of AOSP.
Comment on The Browser Wasn’t Enough, Google Wants To Control All Your Software
blitzen@lemmy.ca 18 hours agoYou can stop using all Google products. Now I understand their market share on the web means they’re going to continue to shape the web.
But make no mistake. There is something however, small that you can do. De-Google.
Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world 16 hours ago
Solventbubbles@lemmy.world 16 hours ago
Hang on, as somebody who knows enough to be looking into switching to graphene, but not entirely enough to know what AOSP is, what exactly is happening?
Am I going to fuck myself over? If I do end up switching to a custom rom? Should I just wait on the Linux community to build something better?
All I want is a working device that isn’t selling all my shit to Mark Zuckerberg
Jason2357@lemmy.ca 2 hours ago
If you get a device and install Graphine now, it should be fine. It’s your future device options that will probably not include an AOSP alternative os. Hopefully Linux will be an option then, but there might be a bit of a dark age in between.
wreckedcarzz@lemmy.world 15 hours ago
G is restricting the factory images/source (I believe) that graphene uses to build their system, so they are having to work backwards, take more time, etc. It’s a shitty thing to do but afaik it’s not a blocker. I’m typing this on a gos pixel 8 pro right now.
Linux phones are still in their infancy, and are pretty shit if you need anything more than the ability to call and text (sms) on specific carriers (limitations applies to the USA, AUS, and a couple more I believe). I have a pinephone 1st gen and it’s… Cool for messing with, absolutely, but jesus christ it’s painful to actually attempt to use. I bought that 3y ago and not much has changed, from videos I’ve seen (my pinephone screen is lifting and failing so…). From a developer - like, bringing Linux to the phone platform - sure, grab one. As a user, unless you understand that you very likely will not daily this device (or any similar device) because shit just doesn’t work/isn’t ready and are OK with that… No, don’t. A few more years, maybe.
eodur@piefed.social 14 hours ago
GrapheneOS is still moving ahead albeit slower, as you said. They are also working on a deal with a phone manufacturer to bring a more secure phone to market. I dunno whether it will just meet the same security levels of the Pixels and ship with stock Android, or if it will be a full GrapheneOS Phone. I'm hoping for the latter, but it will more likely be the former. Fingers crossed.
Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
You will have years of Graphene so don’t worry about what might happen in the future.
gdog05@lemmy.world 18 hours ago
I will help hand hold anyone who wants to build servers or services (to the best of my ability) to replace Google services with their own.
AbidanYre@lemmy.world 16 hours ago
blitzen@lemmy.ca 18 hours ago
There are a lot of alternatives out there. What service or services are you stuck on?
frank@sopuli.xyz 17 hours ago
For me, MitID in Denmark. 100% required for society and life here, requires Google Play Services now :(
I tried e/os on my Fairphone for a bit. I think I could make it all work okay enough besides that. I should write people at the government or something I guess?
Wowbagger@lemmy.zip 9 hours ago
Don’t use the app then? I have a key thing which works quite well. www.mitid.dk/en-gb/…/mitid-code-display/
Zombie@feddit.uk 17 hours ago
Yes! Being active politically is always important.
Be civil and polite at first, you want these people on your side after all. But don’t be afraid to hold back if they respond with bullshit either. They are your representative, make them represent you and hold them to account if required.
Encouraging friends and family to write is usually a good idea too.
Not being politically engaged, I feel, is one of the main reasons for the downfall of democracy throughout the globe. Too many people think ticking a box every 4-5 years is all they need to do.
gdog05@lemmy.world 17 hours ago
I don’t know myself, but Graphene OS (on Google Pixel phones) has a pretty impressive sandbox layer for the play store and the apps it installs. It might be worth looking into if you’re not aware of it currently. (But if you’re aware of the Fairphone, I’m guessing you probably know about Graphene).
blitzen@lemmy.ca 17 hours ago
I’ve never heard of that, so I looked it up. There definitely appear to be non-Google alternatives.
fartographer@lemmy.world 18 hours ago
Got any advice on alternatives to Drive? I keep considering nextcloud, but people I know have said it’s a resource hog and finicky at best.
Jason2357@lemmy.ca 2 hours ago
I run Nextcloud inside a VM, running on a decade+ old Intel gen 3 computer and the interface is snappier than navigating around google drive.
It is finickier to self-host than syncthing though, if all you need is sync. There are also tones of providers out there that will sell you Nextcloud or similar services.
KneeTitts@lemmy.world 18 hours ago
people I know have said it’s a resource hog and finicky at best
Those people may be the kind who tell you formatting your hard drive and reinstalling windows every other week is the best way to keep it ‘clean’.
Ive been using Nextcloud at multiple businesses for years, its a rock.
paequ2@lemmy.today 17 hours ago
Nextcloud definitely seems solid… but let’s be honest, it is definitely a resource hog. I tried deploying NextCloud on a VPS with 2GB of RAM, with most features turned off. The instance was empty. After a few minutes, I started getting alerts that I was using 100% of my memory.
Nextcloud isn’t gonna work the way you expect it to with 2GB of RAM. It doesn’t seem like you’d be able to run this on some cheap, low powered device.
Someone rewrite it in Rust! 😅
TeddE@lemmy.world 18 hours ago
Syncthing
supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz 16 hours ago
This is the answer unless you consider setting up a DIY home server fun, which often the kinds of people who recommend options for this kind of thing do… so just keep that context in mind here with recommendations.
Syncthing is a great solution and it is wayyyyy less a headache than any other DIY method I have done for replacing cloud/filesharing purposes.
graphed_pingu@lemmy.world 18 hours ago
If you’re looking to self-host, nextcloud is the way go. But if you’re just looking for a drive alternative, there’s plenty of simpler alternatives, like proton or kdrive.
NedRyerson@lemmy.ml 17 hours ago
The UI is a little crazy but I am a big fan of copyparty. I have moved my entire family off of Google Drive and we use copyparty, and it works great. Uploads are fast, lots of features, easy to stand up and doesn’t consume lots of resources. But like I said, the UI could be better.
gdog05@lemmy.world 17 hours ago
You’ve got some good suggestions, I think most of the suggestions I can think of. Nextcloud is of course the big one but after using it for quite a while, I think it’s important to break down your needs. If you need file sharing/syncing only, there are better options that are easier and faster. If you only need chat/voice, rocket chat is really lightweight and easy. If you need file sharing, online office suite, chat, etc. Then Nextcloud is the right option. Just keep in mind, even if you think you need some of those things, will anyone but you ever actually use them? No, they won’t, because they don’t appreciate how cool it is to self host and how much effort you put into it.
paequ2@lemmy.today 17 hours ago
Seafile is an alternative: www.seafile.com/en/product/seafile_on_premise/
I haven’t tried it. Seems to be more efficient than Nextcloud. It also has way less features. So. 🤷
masterofn001@lemmy.ca 12 hours ago
Sign up for 10 different free accounts of Proton Drive? It has 5gb free cloud storage.
Though I always prefer the simple physical backup to SD card and backup to PC.
I also have a simple sshd server and use sftp when I’m feeling frisky.
Sending from any device to any device using KDE connect is good too.
floofloof@lemmy.ca 18 hours ago
I moved to pCloud + Cryptomator for general cloud file storage and Cryptpad for online document editing. These cover some of the main functions of Google Drive.
kurikai@lemmy.world 18 hours ago
Bewcloud?
mesamunefire@piefed.social 17 hours ago
Email? Its about the only thing leaving me on googles platform ATM. I can self host (with mailinabox) but....I kinda dont want to? Its so much work and I would rather do other things with my time.
Jason2357@lemmy.ca 2 hours ago
I really like Runbox. Nothing particularity fancy, just pure standards compliant email, with excellent reputation, for a very low cost. They have a “drive” too.
There’s also mailbox.org, tuta, the upcoming “thunder mail”, proton, fast mail, probably your domain provider or VPS provider offers email as an add on. Consider paying for a email and a domain. It can be as low as $30 a year, and you become the customer instead of the product. Owning your identity.
gdog05@lemmy.world 17 hours ago
I wouldn’t self host email. But I would pay for a host and get away from Gmail. Wait until Black Friday and get free/cheap services from a bunch of places. Maybe even proton if you’re okay with them. Also, using your own domain for email is pretty cool (to me).
Pxtl@lemmy.ca 16 hours ago
Mozilla foundation is putting together a paid product under the Thunderbird brand. Folks are excited for that, the Firefox people are good people.
wreckedcarzz@lemmy.world 15 hours ago
I use my web host for email. I looked into hosting it myself but it looked way too fragile. The service is included with the website so it’s not like I’m spending any extra money that I wasn’t going to already…
Maybe porkbun if you just need email?
jim3692@discuss.online 7 hours ago
But Porkbun charges per mailbox.
I pay for Tuta, and I have added my personal domain. It works as catch-all, allowing me to have an infinite amount of addresses, so I can use a different email on each website.
spaghettiwestern@sh.itjust.works 16 hours ago
You can stop using all Google products.
That may be true for you, but other people face different realities. When Google implements the sideloading block it will eventually be pushed to everyone who doesn’t use a custom ROM.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 11 hours ago
also not everyone is saavy enough to use obscure services too.
spaghettiwestern@sh.itjust.works 11 hours ago
Not everyone cares enough to avoid Google. Some of us that do are related to them.
vacuumflower@lemmy.sdf.org 6 hours ago
I wonder if it’s economically plausible to make a FPGA-based all-in-one system. In a “smartphone” box, maybe far weaker than most Android phones, but far less tall in expertise needed to do anything, for a low start to be possible without humongous investment and expected minimal parties. Something graphical Lisp-based as an OS. Perhaps with an interface to use it as a tablet when attached to a bigger box, or a laptop when attached to that box.
Focusing on having the necessary modules and input-output devices, with the FPGA itself being configured with something simple-enough RISC-V based with tagged memory, for example.
Like when you need a portable computer with cell connectivity and a battery, and want to have some choice, but are not too attached to specific platforms and popular places.
It seems that for militaries using FPGA is already an established practice, turns out to be more convenient and even cheaper. And with anything trying to fight big companies, it seems using FPGA will make more sense.
I mean, Sun Tzu wrote about “when you know your enemy and know yourself”, all that. Knowing myself I’m certain that trying to take on anyone bigger and smarter than me using things on their level of complexity is a failure from the start. Knowing them is beyond my ability in general, but we definitely know that those companies are led by very intelligent people who just won’t make the simpler kind of mistakes. And he also wrote a bit on the “death grounds”, where if you leave a path for retreat, that’s not a death ground. I think paths for retreat like alternative Android versions and such are all intentionally let be, so that you’d not resist too much.
Or, this is sort of a fewer dream, or bipolar psychosis to be more specific.
MrSmith@lemmy.world 6 hours ago
De-googling will break banking apps, since most baking apps rely on Play Integrity checks and bootloader status.
cheese_greater@lemmy.world 41 minutes ago
I feel like this isnt always true. I had a GrapheneOS pixel for a while and it never had problems with banking apps
VampirePenguin@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
Then don’t use the apps? Do your banking through the browser.
MrSmith@lemmy.world 3 hours ago
What a pompous and clueless suggestion. Some modern internet banks are app-olny.
Good luck with your revolution where 10 people are able to participate.
Squiddork@lemmy.world 14 hours ago
Honestly Googles products are terrible these days. I have been pretty lax about my privacy but after so much enshittification I switched my services to something that works and doesn’t harvest my data for the privilege.
When they kill off Graphene/Custom ROMs I’ll switch to a linux phone or brickphone.
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 7 hours ago
That’s barely a viable option without using apples own walled garden.
salacious_coaster@infosec.pub 18 hours ago
Now that AOSP is closing, what are we supposed to do?
knightly@pawb.social 17 hours ago
Obviously, Linux.
paequ2@lemmy.today 17 hours ago
Uhh… how do we stop using Android? I mean, these recent attacks by Google seem like they’re going to break GrapheneOS and friends, no?
mesamunefire@piefed.social 17 hours ago
What I wouldn't give for a very simple linux phone. Not android based. That I can call/message from.
toddestan@lemmy.world 11 hours ago
While pretty neat, I’d have a hard time even calling the WiPhone a phone if it doesn’t have a cellular modem. You’re entirely dependent on having a wifi connection. I suppose it could serve as a replacement for a landline, but that’s about it.
mesamunefire@piefed.social 10 hours ago
Yep! Its so close.
Looks like they had plans for LTE. Dunno how hard it is to ser up. Probably very hard.
blitzen@lemmy.ca 17 hours ago
No idea.
Sent from my iPhone.
paequ2@lemmy.today 17 hours ago
Oh, thank god Apple lets users install whatever software they want—hey, wait a minute…
blitzen@lemmy.ca 17 hours ago
The question wasn’t how to switch OSs without losing current capabilities, it was how to stop using Android. Switching OS is how.
Losing side loading is something being lost either way.
FenderStratocaster@lemmy.world 16 hours ago
I was thinking of switching to Proton. I pay $2 a month for 100gb and unlimited photos on Google. It’s a good deal. The fact that I would have to find out out to make a server, buy storage, piece meal a bunch of open source software that will inevitably not work without tinkering all makes it so easy just to pay the $2 a month.
Lfrith@lemmy.ca 5 hours ago
Once I moved away from Gmail cutting off Google services became easy along with finding alternatives. Even if I use Google products like YouTube I can do it without an account with stuff like freetube to have a subscription feed locally and be able to save playlists and keep track of watch history.
So yeah even if Google products are used it becomes less account dependent, so you need a Google account less and less. And changing to a non Gmail email provider was the gateway.
sibachian@lemmy.ml 16 hours ago
i pay $20 a year for basically all of that and even more stuff but open source provided and maintained by a local server company in my country. of course i don’t use half of their offerings because some stuff has alternatives more suited for the platform or its simply not needed. but e.g. their service offers nextcloud which has most of the stuff you listed bundled into the platform by default. and then they have another 50 services added on top available for use.
grue@lemmy.world 14 hours ago
My public school – that my children are basically required by law to attend, remember – is badgering me to sign a consent form so they can have Chromebooks.
This fight is a lot fucking larger than mere individual boycotts!
NewNewAugustEast@lemmy.zip 11 hours ago
And my kids school requires every parent to have a Google account to track progress and share information.
wuphysics87@lemmy.ml 11 hours ago
What happens if you refuse?
blitzen@lemmy.ca 1 hour ago
They probably would have to find accommodation for you, although I’m sure it’d be very inconvenient. But still technically there.
As to if you refuse to have your child be issued a Chromebook and Google account, probably not much you can do, as they are providing everything.
My personal answer to this question is the same as if it were an employer issued mandatory Chromebook; me the employee (or my child the student) is a different entity than me the individual. Me the individual refuses to have anything to do with Google, and that’s enough of a fight for me.
Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 10 hours ago
They kill you!
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 11 hours ago
cant you give your child a cheap laptop, or they require thier inhouse shitty ones, use only?
grue@lemmy.world 9 hours ago
I don’t know yet; I’m about to email the media coordinator to find out what happens when I refuse to sign the form.
My kids already have Raspberry Pi 400s (might upgrade them to 500s soon), and I have about half a dozen other computers (not including old retired stuff or my pile of other Raspberry Pis), all running Linux. This house is not at all lacking in technology, and I no longer tolerate proprietary shit in it.
What’s really fucked up is that the school district makes all these decisions basically unilaterally – not just for Chromebooks, but for other proprietary nonsense like ClassDojo and Remind and MySchoolBucks – and just assumes every parent will be cool with unquestioningly entering contracts with all these third-party entities. And even worse, most parents are cool with it!
vacuumflower@lemmy.sdf.org 7 hours ago
As someone from Russia, I grew up seeing movies where you all over there sue each other over unfortunate rude word.
Perhaps that last paragraph is where you really should try suing someone, no jokes.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 8 hours ago
its probably datamining material for google and all these propietary companies.
zod000@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 hours ago
They require that the kids use the Chromebooks and use Google accounts.
Euphoma@lemmy.ml 10 hours ago
At the highschool I went to, there was some standardized testing (act, ap tests) done in locked down software installed on the chromebooks. Like instead of logging into your user, it was before login with no browser or anything. It sometimes let you have desmos and a small place to take notes.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 7 hours ago
they mustve started using chromebooks in the 2010s, we dint have any of that nonsense in the 2000s, although it was not much better otherwise.
blitzen@lemmy.ca 13 hours ago
Mine too, so I do agree with you the issue is larger.
But I believe it can start with individual boycotts.