Comments

• fizzle@quokk.au ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  The fuck?

  I don’t understand all of the connotations of the phrase, (I doubt queensland parliamentarians do either). I do understand palestinians ancestral land is bordered by the river and the sea.

  That said, this sounds very much like making wrong think a crime. Nobody is allowed to acknowledge that Israel used to be Palestine because that would upset the Israelis.

  In Australia in the last decade there has been a movement towards recognising first australians as the traditional owners of the land on which we live and work. It’s often mentioned in podcasts, emails, public announcements et cetera. More and more signage has both European and Aboriginal place names.

  The term “truth telling” has emerged to describe the practice of acknowledging historical facts rather than pretending they didn’t happen.

  If a group of indigenous Australians chanted “from the desert to the sea”, would that be hate speech ?

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  • AudaciousArmadillo@piefed.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    If your slogan implies genocide, as your example also does, yes it is hate speech. You cannot undo colonization by disposing the occupiers. Any nation is occupying some native land in one form or another.

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    • fizzle@quokk.au ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      You’re going to have to elaborate on how “from the desert to the sea” implies genocide.

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    • Keeponstalin@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      It is an emancipatory slogan that calls for an end to apartheid and for equal rights.

      Yousef Munayyer, head of the Palestine-Israel program at the Arab Center Washington D.C., has written extensively about the meaning of the slogan before and since Hamas’s attacks on Oct. 7, which led to Israel’s current bombardment of the Gaza Strip.

      “It’s an expression of Palestinian nationalism and it’s an expression of a demand for Palestinian freedom or self-determination,” said Waxman. “I think Palestinian self-determination need not come at the expense of Jewish self-determination. Nor do I think Palestinian freedom has to be considered a threat to Jewish rights.”

      • cbc.ca/…/from-the-river-to-the-sea-palestine-1.70…

      Simply put, the majority of Palestinians who use this phrase do so because they believe that, in 10 short words, it sums up their personal ties, their national rights and their vision for the land they call Palestine. And while attempts to police the slogan’s use may come from a place of genuine concern, there is a risk that tarring the slogan as antisemitic – and therefore beyond the pale – taps into a longer history of attempts to silence Palestinian voices.

      • theconversation.com/from-the-river-to-the-sea-a-p…

      The use of the phrase “from the river to the sea” has come under particular scrutiny in the last three months. When Palestinians, or anyone on the left, has used the phrase to demand a free Palestine—as in the popular chant, “From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free”—those on the right have disingenuously argued that it is calling for the death of all Jewish people in Israel.

      • newrepublic.com/…/benjamin-netanyahu-literally-sa…

      In 2021, the Palestinian-American writer Yousef Munayyer argued that those who saw genocidal ambition in the phrase, or indeed an unambiguous desire for the destruction of Israel, did so due to their own Islamophobia.

      It was instead, he argued, merely a way to express a desire for a state in which “Palestinians can live in their homeland as free and equal citizens, neither dominated by others nor dominating them”.

      • theguardian.com/…/from-the-river-to-the-sea-where…

      Preventing any possibility of a Palestinian state has always been Israel’s policy, one that the settlement building in the Occupied Territories is meant to ensure. This policy has been intensified under Benjamin Netanyahu, who in January 2024 publicly vowed to resist any attempt to create a Palestinian state and to maintain Israeli control from the river to the sea.

      It is often maintained that the slogan ‘From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free’ expresses a genocidal and antisemitic intention. But this is generally not the case. On the contrary, the slogan has historically been used to articulate a wide variety of political strategies for Palestinian liberation

      Denying such demands seems as self-evident to most Israeli Jews as the air they breathe. It is this denial that has led to the dehumanization of Palestinians and has culminated in the genocidal mood that is prevailing in Israeli Jewish society today and in the assault taking place now in Gaza. This should be viewed as the real problem and not the legitimate chant of ‘from the river to the sea: Palestine will be free’.

      • …ceu.edu/…/from-the-river-to-the-sea-one-slogan-m…

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    • mrdown@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      This is just a myth

      decolonizepalestine.com/…/from-the-river-to-the-s…

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  • sqgl@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Nobody is allowed to acknowledge that Israel used to be Palestine because that would upset the Israelis.

    It never existed as a state. It was “The British Mandate of Palestine”.

    Am not saying it shouldn’t exist as a state in future, just being pregnant with the history.

    Jordan is effectively a Palestinian state.

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    • Keeponstalin@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Palestine As A Name Commonly Used Throughout Ancient History

      > First documented in the late Bronze Age, about 3200 years ago, the name Palestine (Greek: Παλαιστίνη; Arabic: , Filastin), is the conventional name used between 450 BC and 1948 AD to describe a geographic region between the Mediterranean Sea and the Jordan River and various adjoining lands. This work explores the evolution of the concept, histories, identity, languages and cultures of Palestine from the Late Bronze Age to the modern era. Moreover, Palestine history is often taught in the West as a history of a land, not as Palestinian history or a history of a people. This book challenges colonial approach to Palestine and the pernicious myth of a land without a people (Masalha 1992, 1997) and argues for reading the history of Palestine with the eyes of the indigenous people of Palestine. The Palestinians are the indigenous people of Palestine; their local roots are deeply embedded in the soil of Palestine and their autochthonous identity and historical heritage long preceded the emergence of a local Palestinian nascent national movement in the late Ottoman period and the advent of Zionist settler-colonialism before the First World War.

      • Palestine, A Four Thousand Year History - - Nur Masalha Introduction

      From Philistia To Provincia ‘Syria Palaestina’ (135 AD‒390 AD)

      > The administrative province of Roman Palestine During Roman rule in Palestine, and more specifically between 135 AD and 390 AD, Palestine became one of the Provincias of the empire. This is also a period from which many written records were preserved in a variety of languages – Latin, Greek, Aramaic, Hebrew –and also covered in the annals and texts of the new religion of Christianity. By this time the name ‘Palestine’ was more than a millennium old and had substantial currency. During the Roman period the official/administrative name of ‘Palestine’ was consolidated and popularised in Latin and Greek, which were the two lingua francas of the Roman Empire and Eastern Mediterranean. These two languages affected trade, administration, education, religion, architecture, diplomacy, coinage and key place names throughout the Eastern Mediterranean.

      • Palestine, A Four Thousand Year History - - Nur Masalha Chapter 3

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    • mrdown@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      The whole debate is dumb. There was people living in the land then foreigners came to force a state on those people and ethenically cleansing them.

      This dumb debate try to make the zionist colonialism a matter of opinion when it is not

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  • jimmy90@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    and nobody is allowed to acknowledge that Mutasarrifate of Jerusalem used to be the kingdoms of Israel and Judah because that would upset the lemmings

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    • jaek@aussie.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      No, you’re allowed to say that. I’m also allowed to say that I’m pro babylon, and Nebuchadnezzar did nothing wrong.

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• 18107@aussie.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  How long until “please stop killing innocent people” is also considered hate speech.

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• itsathursday@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Where’s all the people that were saying that these laws only would apply if the people involved were part of a recognised hate group?

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  • sqgl@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    That is a recognized hate slogan. Western activists claim it is ambiguous. Discuss.

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    • GuyIncognito@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Recognized by who, dumbass?

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• kingofras@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  From the river to the see, Palestine will be free

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  • sqgl@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    From the Indian to the Pacific Australia will be Aboriginal. Get packing Whitey.

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    • mathemachristian@lemmy.ml ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Waow

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  • Seagoon_@aussie.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    what river, what sea, free from what, how is that to be done, free to do what?

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    • Kolanaki@pawb.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      what river

      The Jordan

      what sea

      the Atlantic

      free from what

      Oppression by Israel

      how is that to be done

      Not this, that’s for sure.

      free to do what

      Not be killed by the IDF.

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    • mathemachristian@lemmy.ml ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Palestine will be free from the Jordan to the mediterranean by globalizing the intifada for the people to return to their home and have autonomy over their society and culture.

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• Fleur_@aussie.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Stupid ass government

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• supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  dumb as fuck

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  • Luniio@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    The same people who are outraged by this ban think the song “From the river to the Sea, Israel will be free”* is horrible.

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    • Walk_blesseD@piefed.blahaj.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Yeah no shit, one’s a colonised people being subjected to a genocide, the other is a settler-colonial project committing said genocide. Are you for real or are you just pretending to be this stupid????

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• rekabis@lemmy.ca ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  I feel sorry that Queensland has to suffer such stupid, pro-genocide politicians.

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• Tenderizer@aussie.zone ⁨1⁩ ⁨week⁩ ago

  I understand why.

  It’s reasonable to interpret it as a call to abolish the state of Israel, which while based is also unrealistic and threatening to certain members of the community. Frankly the slogan is unnecessary and does more harm than good. It’s not as bad as “globalize the intifada” but it’s still not like they’re banning you from saying “free Palestine”.

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• Cantaloupe877@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Yep because not wanting a bunch of people gunned, blown up, starved, or worse, is hate speech.

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• Luniio@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  “FROM THE RIVER TO THE SEA, ISRAEL WILL BE FREE”

  What… You are outraged by this ? Why?

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  • bearboiblake@pawb.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Israel is a genocidal fascist ethnostate and it should be dissolved and their government arrested, tried for crimes against humanity, and executed. This is the absolute bear minimum any human should accept. We should not tolerate these actions.

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    • wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Do you mind telling the audience what your plan entails for all the Israeli civilians living in Israel, many of whom don’t approve of their government or its actions?

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    • gandhibobandhi@feddit.org ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Sounds weird to claim that the side that has regular free elections and guarantees equal rights to all its citizens, who are made up of multiple ethnic groups, is a “fascist ethnostate”, while the other side is an ethnically homogenous one party state run by a government who’s founding charter invokes nazi-era antisemitic conspiracy theories.

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    • FreedomAdvocate@lemmy.net.au ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      What do you think should happen to Hamas?

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  • mathemachristian@lemmy.ml ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    because there is a difference between “From the wolga to the rhine germany will be free”, and the settlers being forced back to the west of the Oder.

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• prex@aussie.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  Ha. “Between river and sea” is the motto of Mosman Park council in WA.
  Hate crime?

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• mrdown@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  I suggest anti occupation and genocide people to not post content about Palestine in communities that allow zionists propaganda expending like this one

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• NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  When you want to prevent terrorist incidents but all you have is a can of guzzoline.

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