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60 hour work week?
Everything to me already feels unrelenting in a 40 hour work week.
What kind of country forces you into a 60 hour work week. Is that even legal?
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Submitted 4 months ago by Toasted_Breakfast@lemmy.today to nostupidquestions@lemmy.world
Comments
SunshineJogger@feddit.org 4 months ago
PissingIntoTheWind@lemmy.world 4 months ago
I didn’t really realize I was middle aged until I hit 39. It’s been a blur for years. I’m finally making enough to possibly own a home soon. We’ll see how my work holds up in this economy. But honestly. I don’t even think about it. Just be you and take it one day at a time. Stop looking for tomorrow when it’s today.
Calabast@lemmy.ml 4 months ago
I’m a 41 year old dad with a 1 y/o and a 3 y/o, with a partner who has a busy schedule. My advice is (surprise!) the same as everyone else’s, trying to work a 60 hours work week and do that other stuff isn’t sustainable. Maybe if you had a stay-at-home partner who took care of childcare and household chores, I could see you making it work (but then you wouldn’t really be involved in your family’s life at all which I would consider a deal breaker).
I’m tired all the time, but it’s at least possible. If I was working 60 hours a week? No way.
And while I have no interest in an affair or divorce, I probably should drink less wine in the evenings while making dinner and doing chores :-/
Toasted_Breakfast@lemmy.today 4 months ago
Not really. Me and wife’s family situation is rough given the state of our parents. Heck our marriage itself has been pushed really hard by all this. Kind of revealed allot of selfishness on her part which almost broke our marriage but we are doing better… For now.
Just one more month 🤢
tomkatt@lemmy.world 4 months ago
I’m in my 40s. I don’t have any kids, but am married nearly 20 years, home and property owner, bills, the household handyman “fixer,” managing health conditions, etc.
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Find work you enjoy. I know that’s easier said than done, but you spend much of your waking hours at work, and it bleeds into everything. Find a way to make it suck less. A bad job will suck the life out of you.
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Find hobbies you enjoy. Preferably more than one, you can burn out on things you enjoy as much as you can with work.
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Cut off negative people. Social connections are important, but be wary of social vampires, people who leave you exhausted and stressed. Cut them off, even if they’re your own family. If that’s not possible, keep as low contact as possible, put them on an information diet, and gray rock them.
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Make time to connect with your spouse. Cuddle in bed, talk about your day. Hug. Engage.
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Make time for exercise. Don’t say there’s no time. Don’t make excuses. Get it done. It’s one of the most important things you’ll do for your physical and mental well being, and should improve your energy levels over time.
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If at all possible, contribute to causes that matter to you. If you have the funds, maybe donate to your local food bank, homeless shelter, animal shelter, or maybe volunteer if you don’t have funds. It can help a lot to feel like your contributing meaningfully to society and your community, and jobs may pay the bills, but don’t always provide that sense of meaning and contribution.
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Practice gratitude. Spend some time thinking of the things you appreciate and are grateful for, the good things, even just small stuff.
None of this advice is particularly specific, but it’s mostly worked for me. Dunno what else I can suggest. You sound stressed and possibly burned out, so take some time to find your stressors that are triggering this feeling of being overwhelmed and “over it” and try to focus on the good and meaningful things.
mad_djinn@lemmy.world 4 months ago
so, Christianity, except your god is rational economic theory? Do what it takes, anything at all, to reproduce, to invest, to live that life we were promised.
I always find the most important part of this kind of reddit-tier advice is the part where you cut off people who aren’t useful to your vision. The opposite of society, that is.
Just like Thatcher said about society, “There is no such thing! There are individual men and women and there are families.”
You are living that dream.
tomkatt@lemmy.world 4 months ago
I honestly don’t understand what you’re talking about, but it sounds pretty cynical the way you describe it.
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swordgeek@lemmy.ca 4 months ago
I’m 56, and I don’t have any answers.
Any upward momentum at work stopped for me. I’m slowly descending into alcoholism and sloth. The more I do to maintain the household, the less that everyone else does.
There’s a reason that financially comfortable, socially stable, middle-aged men have a ridiculously high suicide rate.
The worst part - the VERY worst part - is that even after I retire, I don’t see any improvement. I’m going to be slaving away at an attempt to maintain a modest life until the day I die.
QuarterSwede@lemmy.world 4 months ago
The secret is actually enjoying who you’re with during the day. If you don’t like that then, well there’s your problem.
I have 3 kids and my parents are ageing enough and I’m the only male heir that I’m now taking on the role of head of the family more and more. I also manage a branch at work so I have a lot of responsibility there too. It’s fun once you give in and start enjoying what you’re doing. As with most things mindset is everything.
Sunsofold@lemmings.world 4 months ago
You should not be working 60 hours. No one should be. Being over-employed is just as harmful to your life as being unemployed, sometimes more so. You need time to do the things you originally went to work to be able to afford doing, otherwise what’s the point?
AA5B@lemmy.world 4 months ago
Just keep On, keeping on. One day at a time. Anything for the kids. Then catch up on sleep 20 years later.
My youngest is now at college so I can finally just chill. But I’m “lucky”, he’s been calling me a lot since no one else answers after midnight. Struggling to get up for work reminds me of the good old days of getting up for diaper changes
rumba@lemmy.zip 4 months ago
thought: Find something strenuous or stimulating for the youngest to do an hour before bedtime, could even be learning. Sometimes the right amount of exercise before bed wears them out enough to stay sleeping.
thought 2: noise maker, ocean sounds or rain playing in the room can keep them from popping out of light sleep when they hear sounds from the rest of the home.
Wife and I split AM/PM duties. I do 6am and drive the eldest to school, then come back and prep the youngest before I go to work. but my youngest is order than yours, that mercifully tends to improve with age.
It’s better if the house duties are shared as well, but some people have different situations. If your partner is able but won’t meet you in the middle, there’s counseling. What often bites you in the butt is if your partner is depressed. Depressed people fail to engage; it becomes almost contagious as you try to pick up the slack and fall to it yourself.
Finding a better job with less hours can be part of it. Sometimes you need to look outside your familiar area for work that pays better, that’s assuming you can afford to move or find a job willing to pay you to relocate. There’s also more WFH jobs out there than ever before.
Evotech@lemmy.world 4 months ago
60 hour weeks yikes
I work 37.5
Try that
some_kind_of_guy@lemmy.world 4 months ago
Even that’s a struggle, and that’s the “normal” amount of work. 60 is like, wtf? You will burn out eventually, OP!
kandoh@reddthat.com 4 months ago
The 60 hour week alone would wipe me out. You need a day to yourself and you’re going to have to bargain with your family to get it.
ivanafterall@lemmy.world 4 months ago
Marijuana. Psychedelics. Alcohol. Massage. The usual.
blockheadjt@sh.itjust.works 4 months ago
Results may vary.
I find I’m generally happier without alcohol lately.
InvalidName2@lemmy.zip 4 months ago
Hard to make any real conclusions or make any specific helpful recommendations/observations without making a lot of assumptions. If I were going to, though, I would say that it sounds like you’ve taken on too much and you’re burned/burning out. And it might be worth a little introspection to try and prioritize what’s important to you, then trim expenses and activities if there are any that can be cut.
When I see myself headed towards burn out, that’s what’s worked for me. Granted, this is still a lot of work and can take a bit of time and effort to get to a better place in life.
Sometimes there are low hanging fruit you can tackle. For example, some nights we just have cereal for dinner. Not the most nutritious thing, but easy to fix, easy to clean up (relatively speaking). Maybe it only amounts to 15 less minutes of work that night, but 15 less minutes of work goes a long way when you’re exhausted. Also, the kids are taught to help out with basic stuff like putting away toys, making beds, and even feeding the pets.
Another low hanging fruit is simply learning to say no (to yourself and others). If you’re the type that’s overwhelmed because you can’t help but take on more or you just can’t find yourself being content and enjoying the moment, then you’ve gotta put the work in there, realize you can’t keep it going or that it’s simply not worth it. Easy to say, I know.
A bit of an anecdote: A buddy of mine ended up having a health scare and basically cut back at work to the point where he qualified for various forms of government assistance. I know he wasn’t exactly proud of it, but it kept food on the table and a roof over his and the kids’ heads, and gave him the time and space to focus on his health and be more present for the kids.
33550336@lemmy.world 4 months ago
You are just overworked and therefore tired. 60h plus kids? It’s a matter of time when your physical and metal health collapse. First thing to do, consider how to move to a 40h per week job. My 4 year old and 1,5 year old sons sleep at 8 or 9 p.m. Could you change the kids habits so you all could go to sleep earlier and thus get more sleep?
exasperation@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 months ago
I handle it just fine now, but I did lay some groundwork before kids to make sure my life was going to continue to be easy even with the added responsibility of parenting:
- Insignificant commute. I can leave my house and be at my desk at the office in about 10 minutes, even during rush hour, because the bike lanes still flow efficiently.
- Small home. I don’t want to fuck around with house maintenance or even cleaning up around the house any more than is absolutely necessary, so I don’t have excess rooms in the house and don’t have big spaces. I also don’t fuck with yard work so I have only a small patio with a few planters for a modest garden.
- Flexible career that I actually like. I have a decent chunk of work to do in any given week, but most of it can be done on my own schedule, so that I can start my day late or end my day early as needed, so long as I can find the time elsewhere to fill in as needed. This did take some work to find a career that I like and that actually complements my strengths (several complete resets in my 20’s and 30’s, including going to law school as an older student), and then advancing in that field long enough to where I just have credibility to get things done without other people supervising me. I do work more than 50 hours per week fairly regularly, but I largely do it on my terms.
- Money. My wife and I both earn more than average, and we were already rich before we had kids. That gave the flexibility to do things like take unpaid leave for each kid being born, paying for childcare when they were young, grabbing takeout on days when time is tight, etc.
- Social support network. We have some family nearby, and they can help in a pinch (and we in turn help them as necessary). Our neighborhood social group is amazing, with a lot of other parents and similarly aged kids who can provide the social and emotional support for navigating the very real challenges of parenting. We don’t feel like we’re doing things alone, and we have a village. Many of these relationships predate parenting, too, so in a sense we knew that we had that ecosystem of friends and family to continue to grow with (even if we wouldn’t have been able to predict in advance exactly which friendships would thrive and which would wither after kids, we had the baseline to be able to be flexible with that).
There were tradeoffs, to be sure. We were older than average when we had kids, and that might translate into lower energy levels for each stage of childhood, and may eventually mean that we get to enjoy less overlapping time as adults. We live in a small place so we do need to basically leave the house regularly so that our kids don’t get bored, and that’s more of a challenge in the winter when outdoor spaces aren’t all that pleasant. During COVID, while working 100% remotely, being close to the office wasn’t all that much of a perk.
And we got lucky on other things. Our children are healthy and (mostly) well behaved, so we don’t have to worry as much about a lot of things other parents have to deal with. We also really get along with our own parents, so there aren’t challenging dynamics with the grandparents/in laws.
Echolynx@lemmy.zip 4 months ago
Hey, can I message you with some questions re going to law school as an older student?
MBech@feddit.dk 4 months ago
Christ, I have a 37 hour work week, and I still don’t feel like I have enough time to myself. I don’t even have kids. I don’t understand how americans handle that shit.
fancy-straw-simple@piefed.ca 4 months ago
I don't understand how other middle age men have time for an affair.
answersplease77@lemmy.world 4 months ago
is paying prostitues for sex considerd affairs? asking for a friend
exasperation@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 months ago
I couldn’t imagine putting in the effort to even try to be attractive and build a connection with someone else, much less in a way that I’d have to hide from my wife and kids.
1985MustangCobra@lemmy.ca 4 months ago
just be like me and get kicked out from your ex, and rot for the rest of your life in a chair.
yermaw@sh.itjust.works 4 months ago
It doesn’t last forever, the super schedule. At some point in the future therr will be a set bed time, and you can finally have a glass of wine and watch TV with the subtitles on.
BranBucket@lemmy.world 4 months ago
That’s an absolutely crushing schedule.
When I think of “middle aged family man”, I think of a salaried employee or tradesman working a 40 hour work week, and supporting kids with the help of a spouse who’s either a homemaker or earns additional income. Which mostly describes me.
You’re comparing apples to oranges. I work occasional overtime and it always knocks my dick in the dirt for a week or so. All things considered, just surviving what you’re describing is an achievement.
You’re doing an amazing job and I hope you can find a situation that gives you more time off soon. You deserve it.
zod000@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 months ago
Even with a 40 hour work week, this can be how it ends up. With a 60 hour work week, I’m surprised you can even fit in the cleaning. It’s rough. I don’t many recommendations anyone else hasn’t already mentioned (try to work less hours, which may not be possible). I think you need to, somehow, try to fit in a small window of time that is just for you. Even if it means giving up a small amount of sleep. I had to do this to retain some sanity. I found that trying to prep my meals in batches saved me some time as well. I used to work 40 hours a week on paper, but there was also an hour unpaid lunch and 2-3 hours of daily commute, so I was gone from home 12 hours a day. I’ve been doing this for 20 years, and the only thing I can say that as the kids get older it gets easier. When they can feed, dress, and entertain themselves, it makes it much easier. Also once they eat adult meals so you aren’t making several different things at once. Hang in there man.
obsoleteacct@lemmy.zip 4 months ago
Middle aged family man here. The way I think most “handle it” is by having less on their plate and balancing work and life in a different way than you’re describing.
- For me the most important factor is partnership. My wife and I split up our responsibilities equitably and we each play our roles well. We’re also flexible enough to cover and support each other when needed. If you can’t do that for each other you don’t have a partnership.
- The second most important thing is a strong support system. We intentionally moved to a place where we have a lot of family close by before starting our own family. My inlaws make it possible for my wife and I to each work a 40 to 50 hour week while ensuring our kids have a rich home life and don’t miss out on anything. That doesn’t have to be family though. It could be a mix of school and after care, or a church, or friends, but if you don’t have some support system you will eventually collapse under the weight.
- Pick your battles. It’s OK to have takeout or heat up a frozen dinner if you don’t have the bandwidth to cook sometimes. My house is always clean and sanitary, but it’s also constantly messy.
- Like many things in life there is an element of attitude to it. If you give in to defeatism it’s easy to spiral. If you view your family or home life a weight on your shoulders you’re doomed. That should be the wind at your back. That should be the stuff that lifts you up. That’s entirely on you to sort out. IMO you should probably talk to someone about it.
Overall What your describing is that you’ve built your life in a way that doesn’t work for you. And to your point a lot of men who do that opt for solutions that make it worse (affairs, substance abuse, etc…). You’re not going to wake up tomorrow and things are suddenly better. At the very least , you need to take active steps to find a better job or work out a different balance of responsibilites with your partner.
Good luck, stay strong, I’m rooting for you.
tomkatt@lemmy.world 4 months ago
For me the most important factor is partnership. My wife and I split up our responsibilities equitably and we each play our roles well. We’re also flexible enough to cover and support each other when needed. If you can’t do that for each other you don’t have a partnership.
This is a big one. Like… I can cook, but I hate doing it. My wife went to culinary school in her youth and enjoys it. So she does nearly all the cooking, and I generally take care of dishes and laundry. She does the periodic sweeping, and I’m more inclined to mop and/or vacuum, take out trash, and general maintenance stuff. I handle our finances for the most part, but I don’t keep up on news and info well. She has time to keep up on financial, political, and tech sector news and keeps me informed on anything important so I’m aware of things going on that could potentially affect us financially. We’ve got a balance of chores that works for us, and doesn’t leave either of us annoyed or exhausted.
rrrurboatlibad@lemdro.id 4 months ago
Concur with this post. It is hard though. Good news, the pain doesn’t last forever, but the reward/pride of having made it through intact does last. You can do it brother. Don’t give up
AgentOrangesicle@lemmy.world 4 months ago
No society should expect it’s people to maintain such a life. You are a victim of a social disease in which resources are shunted upward - to those that already maintain wealth.
davidagain@lemmy.world 4 months ago
This is true, but not in any way helpful.
AgentOrangesicle@lemmy.world 4 months ago
Yeah, I just want to get people on the same page before we go French on the oligarchy.
quick_snail@feddit.nl 4 months ago
Condoms.
crimsonpoodle@pawb.social 4 months ago
It is implicitly classist and unhelpful to chastise someone for kids they ready have.
quick_snail@feddit.nl 4 months ago
How is it classist?
And it can be very helpful. I regent not otesding this harder on my cousing before he had is second kid. Then his third…
SolidShake@lemmy.world 4 months ago
Pro tip. Work 40 hours a week.
ilinamorato@lemmy.world 4 months ago
This. It might be financially difficult, but you know what’s harder financially? Mental breakdowns, hospital stays, divorce cases, jail time. All of those are on the table when you work that much. Quit your job if you can, take as long a vacation as you can afford, remember why you enjoy your family’s company, and then ease your way back into working—at a reasonable schedule.
It’s not a cure-all. You probably still need therapy (there are places that offer grants and assistance with counseling). But a good work-life balance makes everything else feel like something you can handle.
rrrurboatlibad@lemdro.id 4 months ago
I resisted marriage counseling, but my amazing wife patiently persisted in a non-threatening way. It’s been great. I feel like I got my teammate back. If you read, check the research work on love by the Gottmans. Very useful for me and easy read/listen.
ameancow@lemmy.world 4 months ago
Open communication back up in your relationship and get over that first hump of stress and emotions that you’re avoiding from this communication.
You may want to get a therapist first to help you formulate what your needs and problems are. No time for therapy? MAKE FUCKING TIME. Jesus christ, who is going to help take care of anyone if you collapse mentally or physically. If you get diagnosed with cancer tomorrow, I fucking guarantee you will make time to go get your chemotherapy or leeches or whatever the country’s new health plans are like.
A mental health crash can be AS BAD as cancer, it has high levels of lethality and can leave lasting harm on you that never goes away, and ruins your plans for a better future.
So what cultural norm or image of yourself are you preserving by pretending to be stoic and invincible? Who are you protecting? What is your end game? You have to ask yourself some harder questions than you’ve been so you can prioritize getting healthier and reorganizing your life.
Likely you have a lot more options and solutions available to you to make the grind less soul-crushing but you can’t see those options because your soul is crushed. You have to repair one little thing at a time so you can get to a high enough place to see more options, and this is hard as fuck to do alone. Get your partner onboard with you or get a therapist or both or you will risk losing everything.
NastyNative@mander.xyz 4 months ago
Why are you cooking and cleaning after a 60 hr work week? I work 40 hrs and dont do any of that. I have offered to get a house cleaner to help her and she refused. Where is your partner? Do they work 60hrs as well that they cant help? You are headed to an early grave on this schedule!
Apytele@sh.itjust.works 4 months ago
I wanna know where the other social supports are. If neither of you have family that give a fuck where are her mom friends and where are your dad friends so you guys can pool childcare? (There are also other configurations, the gendered model is just the most common).
Quexotic@infosec.pub 4 months ago
I handle it by aggressively treating my depression and suicidal ideation so that I can be there for my kids next year.
pinball_wizard@lemmy.zip 4 months ago
As someone whose father probably had to do the same - it has meant so much to me, that he did. You have a lot to be proud of.
__ghost__@lemmy.ml 4 months ago
Good on you for taking care of yourself. Hope you’re doing well
Blackmist@feddit.uk 4 months ago
lechekaflan@lemmy.world 4 months ago
Simple living. That work should be treated only as a means to live, rather than allowing work to consume the individual.