It is time to move to darknets like: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veilid
Is there any way to fight chat control in the EU?
The UK’s Online Safety Act is a licence for censorship – and the rest of the world is following suit
Submitted 7 months ago by themachinestops@lemmy.dbzer0.com to technology@lemmy.world
Comments
Baked86@lemmy.world 7 months ago
Squizzy@lemmy.world 7 months ago
Email your MEPs, push back on the narrative that it protects children. IF it even did protect children it would be at the cost of any semblamce of privacy. Politicians are also exempt despite a pedo politician leading a major world power right now.
I got an immediate response explaining their stance is based almost entirely around the disemination of csam.
It is a noble goal but akin to ending traffic deaths by mandating getting and checking the coast is clear every 10 meters.
Romulon@sh.itjust.works 7 months ago
If you go to chatcontrol.eu you will find more info about chat control and how to fight against it.
nialv7@lemmy.world 7 months ago
Guess China was just ahead of the curve.
Teknikal@eviltoast.org 7 months ago
Just read some story about a Digital ID being proposed called the Britcard which everyone has to carry all the time sounds very Black Mirror and concerning.
sunbeam60@lemmy.ml 7 months ago
FWIW, Denmark has had this digital infrastructure in the last 10 years and it’s been the foundation of a huge transformation in terms of how people interact with the government services.
It’s also extremely privacy preserving and while Denmark is actually moving forward with an age proving infrastructure like Britain, it’s designed with zero knowledge proofs so literally no-one knows where you have proved your age.
I don’t have a problem with the infrastructure. I have a problem with how Britain designs and uses the infrastructure.
SpaceCadet@sopuli.xyz 7 months ago
FWIW, Denmark has had this digital infrastructure in the last 10 years and it’s been the foundation of a huge transformation in terms of how people interact with the government services.
I don’t think anyone has a problem with an ID you need to interact with government services. They know your identity anyway, and for obvious security reasons it’s necessary that they properly verify that you are who you claim you are.
What people have a problem with, is needing to provide an ID to simply access whole categories of content across the wide internet that are not related to your identity in any way.
Ronno@feddit.nl 7 months ago
A digital ID, by itself, isn’t much of an issue and can be very convenient for the user as well. Even better, it can be setup in a more privacy conserving way. For instance, when you have to provide your ID today, you often have to give companies a copy of your ID, which isn’t really favorable to the owner of that ID. With digital ID, it’s easier to give/revoke access to your ID or mask certain information the other party doesn’t need to know. Most ID scans are mainly done to verify the person has a legitimate ID anyways and presented it, making this digital can be an improvement.
Where it does get black mirror-ey is when you have to use that digital identity to basically log in to the internet and all your internet activity is logged to your ID. The shit the government can pull with such information is mindbogglingly bad.
ook@discuss.tchncs.de 7 months ago
themurphy@lemmy.ml 7 months ago
Scotland might finally leave the UK because of this. It has been close before, but this must do it by now.
sexy_peach@feddit.org 7 months ago
I doubt enough people care
echodot@feddit.uk 7 months ago
England isn’t the problem, it’s London that’s the problem.
London needs to become its own independent city state and then they can do what the hell they want with it and then we’ll be governed by someone from Leeds or Manchester or someplace like that, by someone who actually has a grip
themurphy@lemmy.ml 7 months ago
Didnt say England was the problem. The UK is, where it’s run from.
mysticmartz@lemmy.world 7 months ago
We need to build a decentralised internet quickly using I2P or something similar and scale and decentralise quickly. VPN’s will be the first to go then TOR after they attempt to control the exit nodes .
We need to show the governments that we are allowed to use encryption and Wikipedia and not be treated as criminals for wanting privacy .
sexy_peach@feddit.org 7 months ago
I’ve been running i2p for years. It works well and if there was demand it would be fairly trivial to make Lemmy compatible.
So what did you change about your behavior after writing this message?
vacuumflower@lemmy.sdf.org 7 months ago
Something similar when using an operating system from Google and Apple, known for their attachment to privacy and noble behavior?
In any case, you can’t have a mesh with ends reachable at all times or even addressed. Delay-tolerant applications are sort of better. With nodes synchronizing when in contact. Except for, say, threaded discussions to make sense, this would almost require some sort of dependency management, to synchronize objects by priority.
But honestly all of today’s computing seems authoritarian and imperial. Which leads to the way it shapes the world. Richard Stallman is known for being worried about this (not many other people), but GNU + Hurd is honestly still in the same paradigm.
I wonder if it’s possible to devise something like BTRON, except with program objects being similar to Java assemblies, but at the same time more like Common Lisp. For the commonly used software to be generally easily hackable\changeable. BTRON in its concept is nicer than Unix, it’s a consistent idea for modernity of computing, one can say. It seems even nicer than Plan 9. Unfortunately I don’t know Japanese to play with it.
Something that could be used on weak and cheap enough hardware to have some separate niche of personal\PDA computing based on it. Like Briar, but.
Things like CJDNS and Yggdrasil surely look nice, but those just change one layer. For a real totalitarian world they won’t help. It’s not even a matter of technology, it’s a matter of links’ capability when you can’t use the Internet because, ahem, you’ll be detected and police will come knocking.
mysticmartz@lemmy.world 7 months ago
Perhaps a meshtastic delivered list of tor bridges or a wireless p2p internet . Digital dead drops
shneancy@lemmy.world 7 months ago
the brits really need to learn from the french how to protest. it’s been nearly a month and i haven’t heard of even a measly car being set on fire, just one petition that got a reply akin to “lol, nah”. the french would’ve set a car on fire for less is all i’m saying
Pamasich@kbin.earth 7 months ago
the brits really need to learn from the french how to protest.
You mean like how the french aren't protesting their country's support of Chat Control? At least I can't find any information on them doing so.
wordmark@mas.to 7 months ago
@Pamasich @themachinestops @shneancy usually #france protests against anything
#french #farmer spray #public buildings with #cow #shithttps://www.cbsnews.com/news/france-farmer-protest-manure-toulouse/ https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1844254/french-farmers-protest-macron-high-tax
SpaceCadet@sopuli.xyz 7 months ago
the brits really need to learn from the french how to protest
Where were all the protests to this: techinformed.com/france-enforces-age-verification… ?
NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone 7 months ago
We used to know, even in the face of state atrocities: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peterloo_Massacre …wikipedia.org/…/Suffragette_bombing_and_arson_ca… …wikipedia.org/…/1984–1985_United_Kingdom_miners%…
Sadly, Thatcher broke the miners and we’ve never been right since.
echodot@feddit.uk 7 months ago
There has been a petition. And it has received the aforementioned “lol no” response. The thing is though after the French set the capital on fire the age of retirement still went up, nothing changed.
Anyway, all we have to do is use a VPN to get around it and wait for the inevitable data leak, then the whole thing will collapse under the weight of its own stupidity.
muusemuuse@sh.itjust.works 7 months ago
It’s cute you think VPNs will survive this.
then_three_more@lemmy.world 7 months ago
With regards to this most people are just ignoring the law. VPN use has gone through the roof.
shneancy@lemmy.world 7 months ago
yeah and their government is planning on restricting VPN use because of that, they’re not going to stop dickheads, brits need to get their voices heard sooner rather than later
themachinestops@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 months ago
They also get arrested for peaceful protests and stay silent: npr.org/…/uk-police-say-more-than-500-people-arre…
The government could do anything to them and they will stay silent.
ladfrombrad@lemdro.id 7 months ago
Southport was a tinderbox, but the current trends if you’re actually from the UK shows that there’s a bonfire incoming.
You only have to watch a couple of YouTube live streams…wait. Tomorrow I wait for age gating to see if Google is that…nefarious in stopping .e watching YTP vids
blinfabian@feddit.nl 7 months ago
and stay out of the EU, england
nialv7@lemmy.world 7 months ago
EU isn’t much better.
blinfabian@feddit.nl 7 months ago
okay, remove your home from the EU specifically then (reference to Peter Griffins microstate)
manualoverride@lemmy.world 7 months ago
We don’t want this dystopian nightmare either, and just like Brexit we weren’t told what it was before it was too late. Hopefully you will welcome us back when all the liars are voted out and ignored.
plyth@feddit.org 7 months ago
we weren’t told what it was before it was too late.
Not that it’s different on the continent but you can’t expect to be told these things. You gave to gather those informations yourself.
sexy_peach@feddit.org 7 months ago
Europe will always welcome you, since for us it’s obvious you belong here.
But it’s not going to happen since Brits think they’re part of the “international” world. And I guess with many thinking this they’re not entirely wrong.
Tryenjer@lemmy.world 7 months ago
It seems that EU plans to follow the UK in these atrocious policies against the Human Right to privacy.
RageAgainstTheRich@lemmy.world 7 months ago
I cant even think of any legit reason to do this. To protect children? The government does not care about children. Its why so many suffer in poverty. Watching tits online is the least of their problems.
The only reasons i can think of is control. Forcing people to give up more information about themselves. Because knowledge is power.
FreedomAdvocate@lemmy.net.au 7 months ago
If a government says they’re doing something “for the children” or “to fight terrorism”, it’s neither of those things - it’s for control. Those are just the got-to reasons they use to push them through because they can push the narrative that anyone against it supports terrorism/child abuse.
FauxLiving@lemmy.world 7 months ago
It’s really simple.
The western democracies want to create a universal digital ID wallet and have that be required to access any site.
There are a lot of reasons they could want this. For example, there are probably tens of millions of fake accounts controlled by adversarial nations which are used to sow extremism and disinformation online. It is impossible for counterintelligence to detect these at scale. We can see the corrosive effects that social media is having on society, there are countries actively working to make the problem worse but we have no tools to stop them.
This is also why there is a big push to limit children from accessing social media. They’re often the targets for these campaigns because they’re easily manipulated and have a lot of free time to spread the misinformation once they’re indoctrinated.
I don’t think a digital ID is the way to solve this problem. But, we’re not being asked or informed about why it is happening. They’re, instead, trying to ram these measures through using moral panic about children so anybody opposing them is easily dismissed as “not caring about The Children” or “supporting sex trafficking/pedophiles/predators”.
I understand the situation, but they’re trying to go around the democratic process by not talking about the problems.
baru@lemmy.world 7 months ago
In the EU similar stuff is promoted by companies wanting to profit from supplying the various required software.
vacuumflower@lemmy.sdf.org 7 months ago
It’s really inconsequential why they want this. Their success means endgame.
The actions have consequences, and whether I’m breaking a window with a hammer to check how fragile it is or to go outside, it will have both those consequences.
We can see the corrosive effects that social media is having on society, there are countries actively working to make the problem worse but we have no tools to stop them.
You can have “disinformation and extremism” campaigns with only presenting truth or things posted by real people. Just like with political representation. Representatives are a subset of citizenry. The visible posts are a subset of all things posted. Except you can pick any subset you want, if you, say, classify posts by emotion and people by political alignment and what not.
One can have so much more believable bots today, that they won’t be distinguishable from people, but those are beneficial as pressure, making the situation clear for normies, - with transparent identities of people, signing and globally addressing posts, you wouldn’t fear bots and you wouldn’t need a digital ID to access a website. And additionally you would have a way to double check the “color” of recommendations you get.
Thus the solutions they are picking are stabilizing the “disinformation and extremism” environment. With today’s bots it will soon be utterly visibly useless to communicate over social media without what I’ve described. Which means, superficially paradoxically but really not, an end to such campaigns’ efficiency.
So the claim of this helping fight such campaigns I have disproved.
I understand the situation, but they’re trying to go around the democratic process by not talking about the problems.
There’s no “situation”. “Situations” develop much faster. Such a “situation” didn’t transpire in the early 00s Internet, despite plenty of people in it and no identities and regulation.
What “situation” would really look like, I have described - herds of LLM bots infesting social media, which would be beneficial for propaganda of a small amount of interested powerful parties, but will just make social media sour when everyone uses such. Which is fine, there is a technical solution, they just don’t like it. They want the “situation” they describe, but in their favor. It’s very convenient, a weapon evil useless jerks didn’t have for a long time.
OK, I’m in Russia and don’t affect anything. You protest, I’ll cheer.
Tryenjer@lemmy.world 7 months ago
Bullshit.
jnod4@lemmy.ca 7 months ago
So they’re trying to censor any influence from adversarial nations to keep people from voting on politicians that would undermine the countries integrity?
WhatAmLemmy@lemmy.world 7 months ago
The reason is that we all live in capitalist dictatorships masquerading as “democracy”, and are rapidly approaching a time when climate change, wealth inequality, and automation will see widespread revolt of the proles, so the ruling class is tightening its grip, and going all in on fascism.
biotin7@sopuli.xyz 7 months ago
Complacency has led us to this dystopia. Start Pirating & torrenting. Support Alternative platforms Fund dark-web tech