The best thing *you* can do for the fediverse is *just be kind*

Comments

• brucethemoose@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  One thing that’s turning me off, is the, uh… political requirements of much of the space.

  By that I mean stuff like “Elon Musk should commit suicide” or “X group of people are all mentally retarded” comments in top posts, or even popular posts themselves.

  It feels toxic like X. Or what Voat (an older Reddit clone, albeit not a federated one) turned into, albeit at the opposite side of the political spectrum, hence no one contributed to non-political niches and the site died in toxicity.

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  • Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I can definitely understand that. I think in a lot of ways that problem is driven by how much of a political echo chamber lemmy is. Any time there’s a narower range of beliefs I feel like you can see those beliefs getting more extreme, or expressed in more extreme and toxic ways.

    I honestly don’t really know how to improve it given the state of the world. It feels like the range of political beliefs keeps getting compressed into two groups and it makes it harder and harder to tolerate the beliefs of those further from yourself. And for valid reasons.

    And the more justified the contempt for people of other political views gets the harder it gets to figure out how, culturally, we manage the justified anger that comes from how deeply broken everything is.

    Elon musk is doing actual literal Nazi salutes and peoples anger about that is justified. And at the same time I’m not sure what way of acting on that anger (and acting on the problem) yields anything other than radializing people teetering on the edge of extremism.

    I’m glad I don’t really see actual Nazis on lemmy. Its nice that there’s less debate about the legitimacy of people’s humanity.

    And at the same time anger is deeply toxic to healthy interaction and drives behaviors that I genuinely don’t think make the problems prompting people’s anger any better.

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    • brucethemoose@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Yeah don’t get me wrong, I love Lemmy. But I don’t like, well, that sort of thing. Or straight up disinformation being posted along the lines of that vitriol. It makes me worry about the Fediverse, as that culture only goes one place.

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  • ElectroVagrant@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    It may not do much depending on the mods/admins, but it never hurts to report and downvote comments or posts like that.

    Emphasis on reporting there, as I think sometimes that stuff lingers around because people have made a habit of only downvoting and blocking those doing that regularly. I realize in your examples it’s more likely bias or bigotry respectively, but still.

    Report first, then downvote and block. Doing only the latter only makes your experience a little better, the former may help the community.

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    • brucethemoose@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I do report them, but some communities seem to encourage it and leave it up.

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  • gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    people are very emotional rn because of everything that’s happening but i agree with you that violence for it’s own sake is never good. the discussion must stay positive.

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• Alborlin@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Okay I agree, so let’s start from Linux related any post, tell them if somebody asks a problem don’t tell them just install mint , or how one is crazy because they are facing the problems in Linux or if you are not using Linux what idiot are you. I stopped participating because

  1. Linux dude bros are just idiots troubling me
  2. I can’t find content which is though not niche is just is plain not news or Linux
  3. It’s very confusing to use fedverse as I don’t know of i can go all subs via my boost app or do i need something else , if so where to access them.

  So let’s make it ACCESSIBLE, NON DERAGORTY FOR ANON LINUX USERS ALSO

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• Fungah@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  The thing in this post about curiosity isn’t just a lemmy/online thing.

  The vast majority of people are mainly interested in themselves. Like - if you have trouble on dates, making friends, getting along at work, anything to do with people in general - approaching them with a sense of sincere curiosity will completely change things overnight.

  Get people to talk about themselves, be supportive in your discussions with them, and shut the fuck up wherever possible and suddenly you’re interesting, a good person, kind, whatever - traits you’ve done exactly fuck all to demonstrate, but that people will swear are true because you seem interested in them.

  It’s fucking bonkers but it’s true. Curiosity can change your world.

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  • TheLastOfHisName@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    “Be curious, not judgemental.” - Ted Lasso (via Walt Whitman)

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  • Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Active listening is a powerful skill!

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    • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Improvisational Comedy/Theater is the study of how comedy and theater can be produced out of thin air by putting people on stage who are good at active listening to each other. It is shockingly beautiful to behold when you see it click live.

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  • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    The only humane, sensible and practical definition of intelligence that actually gets you anywhere productive is defining intelligence as a practiced and maintained sense of curiosity about the world around you, especially the world you know little of.

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• Vanilla_PuddinFudge@infosec.pub ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  A lot of people dive in as if the entire fediverse has the same level of nerve as 4chan.

  There are a lot of sensitive people here. The best thing I learned through my dealings with Mastodon is to be kind, and lurk before hitting that comment button.

  The level of discord on the fediverse waxes and wanes depending where you are. There are conversations I’d never have here, that I’d gladly have elsewhere with no ill effects. The right words for the right group of people.

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  • GrumpyDuckling@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    “Sensitive” people can be really toxic too. Some people just enjoy being outraged.

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• rayyy@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I don’t miss the thousands of obnoxious, foul mouthed folks on FB that I routinely blocked. Haven’t experienced any of that on the fediverse yet.

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  • CalipherJones@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Best part about Lemmy is it actually seems like I’m talking to a real person.

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    • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Confirmed, it appears Operation Two Legs has launched and is currently still undetected by humans

      Image

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• cyberblob@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I totally agree with your message.

  These days everyone who is not ultra-left easily gets labelled as Nazi, similarly everyone who brings up any rather left argument will be called a woke snowflake.

  Thus, any dialog is immediately shut down. Listen, understand, exchange arguments.

  That is what unites everyone who believes in liberal values.

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  • CalipherJones@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    The last listening and understanding I had with a Trumper was over whether Haitians were eating cats and dogs in Ohio. They’re not serious and I’m not going to pretend they are.

    “Ultra-left” in America has boiled down to not hating minorities.

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  • Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    It’s a rough time, not helped by how profoundly important politics is right now. And the more broken the state of things get, the more divided we become, and the harder it gets to look others in the eyes and be okay with what they’re supporting :(

    I don’t think there’s any easy answer. But I do think it helps to confront people who are doing harm, and open sincere dialogue with people you disagree with (when theyre willing to engage in good faith. No point otherwise.) And try to understand how they got where they are, and share why you don’t agree with them

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  • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    These days everyone who is not ultra-left easily gets labelled as Nazi, similarly everyone who brings up any rather left argument will be called a woke snowflake.

    What the hell are you smoking? Have you turned on the news? Paid attention to politicians? Check in with how exactly companies chose to sustain and expand DEI (A <- where did the accessibility go we wonder?) after Trump and DOGE attacked it?

    You are so wrong, if the universe repeated at the edge of itself like in the old Asteroids arcade game, you would have long ago crossed into Very Right by slamming straight past the most extreme extent of Completely Wrong.

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    • untakenusername@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I’ve seen people here call ai and crypto fascist technologies. There is an element of truth to what cyberblob saying, some people are labeling things as Nazi simply because they don’t like them.

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    • cyberblob@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Wow, keep your emotions at bay, will you?

      Not even sure what to respond, except for what I wrote previously: A lot of discourse is broken by calling people whatever and not listening.

      You are somewhat setting an example of what I am talking about, since I am not even disagreeing with the opinion that I am infering from your writing.

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• Blaze@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Great post, as usual. Thank you for this!

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  • Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Thank you! ❤️

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• PantanoPete@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  So I can’t be myself?

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  • Sir_Simon_Spamalot@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    No. You can go to hell!

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  • pseudo@jlai.lu ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    No. But you can work on yourself to become a nicer, better person and we will support you all the way. Then, you will be allow to be yourself.

    With love,
    Pseudo

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  • Wiz@midwest.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Pete, we know you’re a big softie inside.

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• ProfAel@feddit.org ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I started using Lemmy just recently. I haven’t seen any sexism here so far. On reddit it’s a matter of minutes until something sexist appears on my feed, or other hateful stuff. That’s why I feel way more relaxed using Lemmy.

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  • gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    sexism does exist on lemmy but the algorithm is less aggressive about pushing rage-bait, so it rarely shows on the front-page. also, the people here are a bit more considerate, i’d say. but that is mostly because it’s a lot of nerds here (heheh).

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    • ProfAel@feddit.org ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Yes, that algorithm is definitely way better! I’d argue though that people aren’t more considered here because they are nerds. Communities, such as the gaming and anime communities, are often one of the most misogynistic ones online. I think people are more considered here, because they are politically on the left.

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• HulkSmashBurgers@reddthat.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Also try to post stuff. I need to follow my own advice more.

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  • Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Baby steps! :) I found it helped me build the habbit if I kept an eye out for posts that could be cross posted to smaller more niche communities

    There are a lot of times where a post only gets posted on a bigger community because it has enough traffic, and smaller niche communities would benefit from folks crossposting it around!

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    • HulkSmashBurgers@reddthat.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Yeah all good advice!

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  • Gormadt@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    And not just memes and shitposts you find elsewhere

    Make things and share

    It ain’t gonna be perfect but that’s half the fun

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• surph_ninja@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Well I came here to chew bubblegum and talk shit, and I’m all out of bubblegum.

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  • Thcdenton@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Image

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  • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I am sorry surph_ninja, but I have to be honest, I was the one that stole your bubblegum

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• OpenStars@piefed.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Lemmy has a well-known reputation as being a "Nazi bar". e.g. as mentioned in this example post in r/RedditAlternatives complaining about toxicity on Lemmy, here is one of the comments therein (not from OP but as part of the overall conversation):

  If their experience is anything like mine, it’s populated by mostly far left wing Americans who were banned from Reddit for being too extreme. I disagreed with someone about a topical left wing American position and received death threats. In fact I’ve never received that many death threats on Reddit. Lemmy is extreme.

  Even if the threats came from Hexbear or one of the lemmy.ml mods who are allowed to make death threats against users without any repercussions, "we" still expose "our" users to such content when we federate with those communities. i.e., for exactly the same reason that we defederate from instances that share CSAM, if we really, truly, genuinely don't like it when mods make death threats against users, then we need to put a stop to it - by defederating those instances that are known to do exactly that.

  Otherwise we give our tacit approval, and moreover whenever we encourage people to join Lemmy instances, we willingly expose those people to this kind of content. Would you expose someone to CSAM, knowingly and without warning them first? Then why is it different when we can see the death threats, delivered by mods, who are not censured in any way, yet still encourage people to come here to Lemmy communities? Are we truly that desperate for content that we are so inconsiderate to them as to expose them to that without warning?

  If you somehow have not heard of this yet and really don't know what I'm talking about, a lot of details are offered in Discuss.Online's (successful) Petition to defederate from hexbear.net, although that particular mod in question is from Lemmy.ml.

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  • Draces@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I had pretty much the same experience as that user and it’s why I left lemm.ee when they decided not to defederate with some of the worst instances. Was about to go back to the search if lemmy.world wasn’t any better. Tankies are why I don’t recommend Lemmy to my friends anymore. They are the fediverse’s biggest problem

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    • OpenStars@piefed.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I am currently at 100% of the people that I've told about Lemmy irl actively chiding me for having mentioned it to them. It doesn't help that (1) Lemmy.ml is the #1 Lemmy instance in a Google search, and (2) that instance uses Local rather than All when you don't have an account. If someone told me to consider joining Lemmy.ml, and that first couple of pages of content were all that I saw - especially just before any election in a Western nation - well then now I understand their reaction perfectly, as it is the correct one!?!?

      Conversely, PieFed has a number of features that Lemmy lacks, one being the ability to actually block all users from an instance (rather than merely mute communities but not actual users on it - leaving them free to troll you in other communities, reply to your comments, trigger notifications, downvote your content, etc.). Since blocking lemmy.ml, I have had zero regrets, and enjoy interacting with Lemmy communities much better:-).

      The real biggest problem that Lemmy has is lack of users and overall dearth of niche content - which ofc wraps back around to why would someone willing come here to be bullied just for being a mainstream centrist or even "leftist" by USA standards (Reddit is based in and its largest userbase is from the USA)?

      Bullying is why Lemmy will never grow. That, and how the tools are somehow even more authoritian than Reddit - i.e. there is a modlog but no modmail, nor notification of a moderation event, instead the modlog simply says that a "mod" did something, if you go to the trouble to find out why nobody bothered to respond. And worse, on Lemmy.ml you'll find yourself banned from communities that you've never so much as heard of, citing having broken a rule that seems not written down anywhere. The lack of transparency is very reminiscent of the spez.

      Fortunately, PieFed and Mbin offer non-Lemmy options to the Threadiverse.:-)

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  • Blaze@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    The user you quoted said they would also try Piefed: old.reddit.com/r/RedditAlternatives/…/mlbvone/

    Isn’t being federated with HB nowadays more the exception that the rule?

    IIRC,

    • LW
    • SJW
    • lemmy.ca
    • sopuli.xyz
    • Blahaj
    • programming.dev
    • feddit.org

    Are defederated

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    • OpenStars@piefed.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      That's great!

      I was just talking with an admin of Lemmy.zip who automatically puts up a community muting of HB for new users joining that instance, but not going so far as to defederate from it. So... that surely helps a little bit? Except when Hexbears brigade a community located on a different instance.

      But the example I gave of a mod throwing out death threats to users involves lemmy.ml rather than Hexbear. Both instances are problematic in that regard, ML mostly for the admins and the mods that they choose to protect, while HB the subset of users that go outside of the instance to engage in trolling. In both, it is also entirely possible to have completely sane and normal conversations on the instance itself, which muddies the waters a bit, though the presence of sanity on occasion does not negate the presence of insanity on others.

      And I was thinking of editing my comment but instead I'll put it here, your own posts such as https://www.reddit.com/r/RedditAlternatives/comments/1fmuk7o/post_to_address_the_usual_criticism_about_lemmy/ most definitely covers both the strong benefits as well as strong criticisms of using Lemmy, as well as solid solutions to the latter problems.

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  • JasSmith@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I’ve had exactly the same experience. Lemmy has been far more hostile than I ever experienced on Reddit. Any opinions which aren’t far left are called “Nazi,” and users are very quick to justify violence against “Nazis.”

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• FluorideMind@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I notice tons and tons of hostility in comments. And I think it’s from people jumping to the worst possible conclusion.

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  • Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I knew that would happen, but you’re not wrong 😅

    As I’ve alluded to, there’s a lot of justifiable anger about the state of the world, and you can see that hurt reflected in people’s immediate response. The feelings driving that “conclusion jumping” valid and understandable, even if I don’t think it’s productive

    There is no easy way to cope with fascism on your doorstep, or taking over your home and threatening to throw you out of it :(

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  • Shardikprime@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Yeah but have you thought how that makes you a Nazi

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• FundMECFSResearch@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I love this.

  I think it’s important to say this doesn’t mean pretending you like or agree with something you don’t like or agree with.

  But when you do see something you like or agree with, drop a compliment. Compliments make places better!

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  • Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Absolutely agree. Fake niceness is worthless and does nothing to make a space better.

    We need sincerity.

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• Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Upvote, comment, post! Compliment good OC content (especially if it is posted regularly).

  Bring more regular users if you can.

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• microdickie@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  When I see small, I see potential. More people know each other which fosters genuine relationships and understanding, ingredients missing from the toxic environments of the big social networks.

  My ex used to call me a very small dude with a big city attitude. She didn’t mean it as a compliment, but I took it as one.

  The fediverse is just a beautiful place to be you. It feels calm, relaxed, intellectual and full of supportive people. It’s a refreshiong alternative to the sprawling and sometimes impersonal nature of vast social networks.

  One thing we should all agree on, we all have a role to play in shaping the culture of this space.

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  • Shardikprime@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    What the hell does that even mean

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• pelespirit@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I have also noticed people agreeing with someone in a reply to another comment, but the original commenter has no upvotes. If you agree, upvote. If you kind of agree, upvote. If you don’t agree, but they make a good case, upvote and then say that. Upvotes make people feel good.

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  • Shardikprime@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Agree

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• mesamunefire@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I hope you have a good weekend!

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  • Cris_Color@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Thank you my friend, you too!

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• Cowbee@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Speaking past each other is IMO the biggest source of friction and division on the fediverse.

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• AtHeartEngineer@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Love this

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• AntiBullyRanger@ani.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  It’s extremely hard to be charitable online, when you have instances like these:

  • map-wiki.com/…/List_of_active_instances_of_map_fe…
  • wiki.yesmap.net/wiki/Pediverse
  • fediverse.wiki/wiki/Poast
  • truthsocial.com

  I’m sorry that I cannot “be kind” to the intolerant.

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  • Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Okay for anyone who is fried at the moment like I am, map-wiki IS NOT ABOUT GEOGRAPHY.

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    • papertowels@mander.xyz ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I also learned that one today…

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    • catloaf@lemm.ee ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Damn I was mildly interested for a minute, I do love a little cartography

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  • ArtificialHoldings@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Technically anyone can spin up an instance centered on whatever dark and inhumane topic. That’s the reality of an open network. That’s why defederation and whitelisting are such important tools as Fediverse grows. You don’t actually want access to every last bit of information on the network.

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    • AntiBullyRanger@ani.social ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Glad we agree then.

      Defed all intolerance.

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    • _____@lemm.ee ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      That’s a actually a good perspective I didn’t consider, them being in their own dark corner means your area is not polluted

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    • WorldsDumbestMan@lemmy.today ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      That’s what you think. My head is a blackhole, and it’s hungry for more!

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• GooberEar@lemmy.wtf ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  On the one hand, yes, yes, yes, absolutely.

  On the other hand, way too often people are absolutely vile here and nobody sticks up for themselves or for others. Really a shame that r-word-it bullshit behavior is often times totally accepted and approved and even rewarded here.

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• Eknz@lemmy.eknz.org ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Sometimes being kind doesn’t necessarily mean being nice.

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• Condiment2085@lemm.ee ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Agreed, love it!

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• Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I can co-sign this if we can agree that some types of ‘disagreements’ don’t belong on the fediverse, a la the Nazi bar problem.

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• Cornpop@lemmy.world ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Love you guys

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• gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  i hope the quality stays up and i guess that we’re non-commercial might help with this; as we’re not pushing people to use this platform; the people here are people who actually want to use this platform and i guess that in itself could do a good thing.

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• gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  i hope the quality stays up in here and we don’t enshittify like reddit facebook and every other bigger internet network.

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• pebbles@sh.itjust.works ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Thanks for sharing! I’m not perfect at this, but I try to keep the vibes welcoming.

  Lemmy’s more intimate and understanding vibes are its best features IMO.

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• jsomae@lemmy.ml ⁨2⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  ngl this is such a toxic community. The Nazi thing is definitely part of the problem – we live in an age of “soft fascism” so of course we have our fists up and we see nazis everywhere. Honestly I think most of the nazis are on twitter or truth social though, they don’t come to lemmy so much. Hmm, don’t assume that someone espousing an (1) conservative-looking belief is a nazi maybe?

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