le enlightened “euphoric” redditor has arrived
Sometimes I wonder if the subtext of religion is; if you join one youre telling on yourself that you can easily be manipulated.
Submitted 1 day ago by Daft_ish@lemmy.dbzer0.com to showerthoughts@lemmy.world
Comments
anas@lemmy.world 1 day ago
oreoreore@lemy.lol 1 day ago
Daft_ish@lemmy.dbzer0.com 23 hours ago
Hahaha gotten.
Daft_ish@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
Lord, if this is an attack on me I pray im worthy.
bsit@sopuli.xyz 1 day ago
What’s mainly depressing is that so many people think that every religion is exactly like Christianity, but with a different object of worship and a slightly different flavor of supernatural belief. They don’t know anything about philosophy, they haven’t examined their own beliefs, they just parrot whatever pop science they’ve heard last and think that somehow gives answers to metaphysical questions.
Read some philosophy people. Examine your own beliefs a bit. I’ve just recently seen a bunch of Lemmings who I’m sure consider themselves very rational and scientific freak out at the idea of not having free will, and by extension, there not being absolute good and evil. They can’t even argue about it, they just immediately fall into ad hominem attacks and strawmanning. Bring in the fact that whatever virtue one thinks they have is just the result of genetic lottery, and suddenly the idea of some kind of an untarnished soul becomes awfully tempting. Dare to suggest that nobody is inherently evil and boy do people get mad because their favorite past time of judging others has been called to question. Yet these same people often consider themselves above religious folk because they actually think that their worldview is purely science based and not at all colored by what they just want to be true.
Oh, not to even mention questioning if matter is the fundamental aspect of reality (as opposed to consciousness). People with 0 understanding of philosophy will start arguing about this and then get mad because they can’t prove that there’s matter outside consciousness. They’ll do the science equivalent of saying “God is real because the Bible says so, and the Bible is the word of God so it must be true”. Matter is fundamental because my scientific framework that is built on the idea that matter is fundamental says so (it actually doesn’t, because again, so embarrassingly many people don’t even realize that science has never answered a single metaphysical question).
Unless you have spend several years with philosophy and actually scrutinized your own beliefs honestly, you are living in just as much fantasy as most religious people. In some cases, more so.
And because I’ve been around this block a few times: unless you can provide at least a logical argument (ideally scientific proof) for the existence of free will, absolute good and evil or matter being fundamental, I may not reply.
Daft_ish@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
Id encourage you to continue to argue. Maybe its frustrating and fruitless but the constant rattling of chains is music to my ears.
zaphod@sopuli.xyz 1 day ago
Aren’t most people born into religion?
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Everyone is born into the world entirely ignorant. Cultures, customs, languages, and superstitions espoused by their parents, teachers, and peers are adopted as a matter of survival. And as the individual develops more autonomy, they use the information they gathered in their youth to navigate into new cultures and belief systems, in pursuit of improved material conditions.
You can be born into a Catholic family and become Atheist just as easily as you can be born into an Atheist family and become Catholic. What has driven the modern collapse in religiosity is - at least in my view - the mass migration driven by economic expansion and ecological collapse. People aren’t just waking up one day and deciding they aren’t gullible anymore. They’re being shuffled around by tidal forces and torn away from the historical cultures and infrastructure that had reproduced their families’ beliefs.
As a kid, my mom was deeply Catholic and tried to get us to attend church. But we moved several times, and after each move we found ourselves at a new church (often not even a Catholic church) with an alien congregation and divergent dogma. So what had rooted her and her sisters and parents and grandparents in Catholicism never took root with me or my sister.
By contrast, my wife’s family lived in Galveston for four generations. Virtually her entire family is devote practicing Catholics. She only slipped through the cracks because… her dad moved around a lot, particularly after her parents got divorced. Everyone else - even two of her transgender cousins - are still practicing. Churches are, at their heart, social institutions. And I think modern New Atheists often miss that fact in their quest to Own The Dumb Pious Folks.
zaphod@sopuli.xyz 1 day ago
Oh sure you can become anything you want, but I’d argue if you’re born into a religious family initially you just adopt it. Not as a matter of survival, but as a world view that is provided to you, you just accept it as facts initially, because you don’t know anything. Compare it to how most kids initially believe Santa Claus exists because they were told so. Eventually you come to a point where you either challenge it or continue. You can also participate in some church community stuff without being a member or even going to church.
Hadriscus@jlai.lu 1 day ago
Yea I personally don’t know anybody who became religious. I’m sure it happens, but it’s gotta be super rare
Madzielle@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
One my sisters did. she was re-born around 18.
I mad her angry when I said she was impressionable.
sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz 1 day ago
THAT’S the most interesting part! I lived examining this, yeah it’s using cultural stories and kind of grey psychology to cause specific behaviors.
Ironically this is also where I think faith can be somewhat redeemed. If you start looking past the dogma to the specific intentions, yes a lot if it is shitty and it’s all manipulative but also on some level it’s trying to get people to act in pro-social ways. Specifically ones who normally could not be fucked to act pro-socially without some kind of supernatural threat aimed at them.
I got into Hebrew discourse because they’re kind of cognizant of that and so their religion is a constant conversation with their history. They’re constantly reinterpreting what it means to be Jewish in this moment of time and have a perspective that has to stand on the idea that there’s a highly likely chance that it’s all made up.
skulblaka@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
Religion was most useful to us when it was used to reign in kings who feared nothing except the wrath of God. It was, in fact, quite effective at that and I think we’re largely better off for it. That use case has outlived its usefulness by now though.
SenK@lemmy.ca 1 day ago
I’m actually starting to question that. Rich people would fund school and hospitals because they figured being nice would get them into heaven. As much as I dislike Christianity, I’d say they current 1% could do with a little fear of divine punishment.
sad_detective_man@sopuli.xyz 1 day ago
Ooh excellent point! 👆👆👆👆
Rhynoplaz@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Only if you pick one that isn’t true.
We’ll see who gets the last laugh when I’m looking down on the rest of you from the righteous kingdom of Jibbers Crabst, the magic space lobster!
archonet@lemy.lol 1 day ago
“GOD made that butthole.”
Ryanmiller70@lemmy.zip 16 hours ago
This is a reddit atheist ass post I swear
BlackLaZoR@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Same with Marxism. Or owning a Tesla car decade ago. All these were cults for gullible people
cmbabul@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Ultimately I think the subtext of it is, “I’m really scared of the uncertainty of existence and want a circular explanation to ease my anxiety about death”. The rest springs from that fundamental fear because someone claiming to have that answer can sell it for any price including blind loyalty.
TheDoctorDonna@piefed.ca 1 day ago
I have always been a little bit jealous of people who can be sold on religion. It must be nice to have the comfort that comes with it, especially if you’re the type to ignore all the rules and think that you’re going to the good place just because you had faith.
I am not scared of dying exactly, I’m afraid that something might come after when I just want to sleep. What if a religion got it right? Good place or bad, I’m not down with that. I want finality in my end.
L7HM77@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
That’s my fear too. I was under high stress from work, woke up from deep sleep one night with chest pain. Really felt like a heart attack, and the only thing I could think was “Thank fuck it’s finally over,” then the most peaceful calm I’ve ever experienced washed over me, and I fell back to sleep.
Now I have recurring anxiety when I think of death, because what if the Buddhists got it right? What if I find peace again when my time comes, just to be thrown back through this shit??
affenlehrer@feddit.org 1 day ago
That’s a legitimate fear IMO.
cmbabul@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Never insinuated it wasnt a real fear. Just that it was being used against those who haven’t faced it
Daft_ish@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
Yes, but not so much the anxiety about death. Moreso the anxiety of life. Death to me is pretty inconsequential. Its the motivation to keep living that keeps me up at night.