This is why I tell people that life (not just history) is far more nuanced than we expect. We think we’re better, but I’m sure that future generations will judge us. I mean, we think we are lgbt tolerant now, but I distinctly remember growing up 10-15 years ago when a lot of people casually use “gay” to dismiss something they don’t like.
Yeah, turns out a lot of people belived that slavery was bad 500 years ago too
Submitted 1 week ago by 
Grumpus_Maximus@thelemmy.club to historymemes@piefed.social
https://thelemmy.club/pictrs/image/282d30d6-a4aa-4388-a34e-3038c775a060.gif
Comments
TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world 1 week ago
terranoid@lemmy.cafe 1 week ago
A lot of people judge us now. I do. Fascism is on the rise, people are convinced immigrants and trans people are the source of their problems, and people still think socialist ideas like food stamps are evil.
Lots of people suck.
TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world 6 days ago
When I was in school, a question that comes up is how could anyone let fascism took place before. Our generation is finally seeing it again. A lot of people are sanewashing and still arguing whether we’re under fascism. There’s the answer: we’re frogs in boiling water.
psycotica0@lemmy.ca 1 week ago
Sure, but now we don’t do that, so we’re better. The best, in fact! We solved discrimination! Good job, boys and girls! (But just those two…)
/s
HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 6 days ago Why did i read that in Wilford Brimley’s voice.
Airfried@piefed.social 1 week ago
Most of the west and north European flavor of Christianity originated from Irish monks if I remember correctly. As they spread their understanding of Christianity, slavery pretty much vanished in those parts of the world. It made it pretty much impossible to enslave believers of the one true god because they are your brothers. It also conveniently served as a convincing argument to convert so it definitely wasn’t all rosy either.
The Byzantine Empire on the other hand had a different flavor of Christianity going back from Roman times where slavery was fundamental to society. Eventually Byzantine fell and many Europeans believed it was a punishment from god for their debauchery and mistreatment of fellow Christians as slaves.
Slavery became much more common again after the age of enlightenment and absolutism in early modern times when European monarchies really started colonizing the globe on an industrial scale. Most of Christian Europe were absolutely against it for almost a thousand years. So yeah, it’s totally understandable people in 1500 thought it was wrong.
I believe many people like to think slavery is just a default for civilization and abolishing it was a fairly recent idea but there always were cultures, places, and periods in history where it wasn’t a thing because people aren’t inherently cruel and selfish. Many people in history knew slavery was wrong.
Juice@midwest.social 6 days ago
Eyy someone been reading Rousseau
this_jury_is_hung@lemmy.world 6 days ago
I believe both the Christians and the Muslims had this sort of system actually, hence they would raid each other’s populations for slaves, to avoid upsetting their gods by enslaving the wrong people.
njm1314@lemmy.world 1 week ago
Columbus was jailed solely because the King and Queen of Spain wanted to get out of the financial arangment they had made with him. Anyone who believes otherwise is crushingly naive.
- HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 6 days ago
there’s causative reasons and narrative reasons and often they are not the same. or even about the same reality.
Bluescluestoothpaste@sh.itjust.works 1 week ago
I mean he also beat and tortured his own sailors who then unanimously reported him to the crown upon return. columbus was a massive piece of shit human being in every way, not just committing crimes against Native Americans.
nightwatch_admin@lemmy.world 1 week ago
moakley@lemmy.world 6 days ago
He left out one part, which is that the Knights of Columbus weren’t just looking for a Catholic role model. They wanted an Italian at the center of the American myth to combat anti-Italian racism.
shawn1122@sh.itjust.works 1 week ago
Ths Spanish and Portugese were brutal colonists. While Protestant colonial powers would prefer to kill you via bureaucracy, Catholic ones wouldn’t hesitate to proceed straight to rape, murder, torture etc.
Perhaps by being the incumbent branch of Christianity, and having state support via the Papacy and its Terra Nullius (ie. land occupied by non-Christians doesn’t belong to anyone) doctine, they felt moral accountability was less of a concern. That or they felt like they were going to heaven regardless of their actions via the Pope’s blessing.
Vasco Da Gama, the Columbus of the East, is known for the following after arriving in Kerala India:
1) Setting a civilian boat returning from Mecca on fire and refusing even to take payment to end the suffering. It took several days for the boat to sink and Portugese accounts detail the wails of women and children as several hundred died slowly. It’s said that women held up their babies above the flames begging for mercy. The few children that did survive were kidnapped and forcibly converted to Christianity.
2) When the local ruler (Zamorin) refused to expel every Muslim from Calicut (who de Gama perceived to be his competition for trade), he kidnapped a group of fishermen, had their bodies cut to pieces, and sent it to the Zamorin with a note saying to make a stew out of it.
3) When trade negotiations failed, he pioneered European colonial “gunboat diplomacy” by pointing his naval fleet at the unfortified city of Calicut, opening fire on civilians.
These two are the OGs of European colonialism. Both are venerated to this day.
acockworkorange@mander.xyz 1 week ago
While Protestant colonial powers would prefer to kill you via bureaucracy, Catholic ones wouldn’t hesitate to proceed straight to rape, murder, torture etc.
Which powers? The Brits, French, and Dutch? They were absolutely vile. Europeans were a very hateful boil on earth back then.
qarbone@lemmy.world 1 week ago
Jesus wept, 9 to 10 year old sex slaves…
I wish he could die 10 times.
nightwatch_admin@lemmy.world 1 week ago
Oh, as a nonbeliever I really hope there’s a hell where he is suffering for eternity. Death is too kind.
rumschlumpel@feddit.org 1 week ago
IIRC slavery itself wasn’t even really the issue. AFAIK the bible is generally in favor of slavery, or at least servants-practically-treated-like-slaves depending on the translation. It’s more about how incredibly badly he treated his slaves. You might think that’s just how slaves are treated, based on 19th century chattel slavery in the USA, but in antiquity and earlier in the mediterranean (which includes the levant), slaves weren’t generally treated that badly. Not saying that it was all fun and games, but there were somewhat stricter rules on what treatment was socially acceptable compared to colonies in the Americas.
shawn1122@sh.itjust.works 1 week ago
It’s widely agreed upon that slavery prior to the transatlantic trade typically came with more rights and pathways to freedom and this is generally true globally. Many civilizations have stories of freed slaves becoming rulers or high tanking political officials.
The transatlantic trade sought to create a permanent underclass of slaves based on a global race based caste system based on how European powers perceived the world at the time. Essentially, if you had melanin, you were potentially a part of the slave / nonperson class.
njm1314@lemmy.world 1 week ago
Slaves absolutely were treated “that” badly and maybe even worse. Urban educated slaves were treated relatively well, sometimes. However rural slaves were treated brutally. To say nothing of slaves sent to mines which was a literal death sentence.
- HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 6 days ago
ah but the bible has rules about making sure your slaves don’t wear mixed fabrics so like… i mean that’s it really. i don’t have anywhere to go from that.
PugJesus@piefed.social 1 week ago
tfw you are literally too brutal for the fucking monarchy of Imperial Spain to stomach
TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 1 week ago
fr fr no cap homie was troubled
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 6 days ago
TBF the problem was he kept promising gold and other wealth for the king and queen and instead he kept screwing the locals and not bringing home the cash that was supposed to support this very expensive investment the king and queen had made.
If he’d brought home the $$$ you can pretty much guarantee the royals would probably have overlooked his “eccentricities” for far longer.