Even worse, my former apartment complex had EV chargers that you paid for at 8x the rate of electricity making it more expensive than gas. There were no other options to charge your car. But when I locked in my lease all they advertised was that they had EV chargers. Not the credit card required or price.
Comment on Car dealers say they can’t sell EVs, tell Biden to slow their rollout
circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org 10 months ago
The infrastructure isn’t there. I live in an apartment (and likely will for the foreseeable future), and there are no chargers here.
The option of a (practical) electric car does not exist for a sizeable portion of the country. The fact that they’re really expensive is actually secondary considering they’re just a non-starter without the infrastructure.
Speculater@lemmy.world 10 months ago
MisterD@lemmy.ca 10 months ago
And you think this was an accident? Car companies have been stalling every charging station they can. This is why Tesla went on their own.
circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org 10 months ago
Oh I don’t doubt there is a lot of dirty pool involved. Tesla’s hands are nowhere near clean either. But it doesn’t change the fact that, at the end of the day, shit’s not anywhere near ready.
evatronic@lemm.ee 10 months ago
This is why I have a hybrid and not an EV.
frezik@midwest.social 10 months ago
65.8% of Americans own their house. EV sales rates aren’t anywhere near that. Lack of being able to charge at home is not the primary issue.
brlemworld@lemmy.world 10 months ago
I’d be curious to see how many apartment dwellers are buying brand new vehicles as well. I suspect it’s at a rate lower than home owners.
Nollij@sopuli.xyz 10 months ago
While your larger point is valid, it’s missing some important context. I haven’t seen the data, but I suspect that it says 65% own (vs renting) their primary residence, not that 65% own a single family house suitable for home charging. This figure would include houses with street parking only, off-street parking unsuitable for charging (e.g. carport, or a detached garage without electricity), and critically, condos. Condos often have the exact same restrictions as apartments, even if you own the living space. In the opposite direction, it doesn’t count the rented homes where you could charge.
Now, all of that being said, you are correct that it’s not the only (or perhaps even the biggest) obstacle to moving entirely to EVs. Countless gas vehicles are sold daily to people that could absolutely charge at home. But it does freeze out a large market segment, whom I suspect are more interested in EVs in the first place.
asdfasdfasdf@lemmy.world 10 months ago
You don’t need to have chargers on site. You just need charging locations that are fast enough. Teslas already charge from empty to almost full in about 15 mins.
scops@reddthat.com 10 months ago
It’s 0 to 200 miles in 15 minutes in ideal conditions. Really good, but no reason to set unreasonable expectations.
In my experience, it’s closer to 45 minutes to go from 15-20% to 90% in my Model 3. The supercharger’s fastest charge is when the battery is less than half full. After that, it slows down to protect the life of the battery pack. If all you need is enough charge to get home to your own charger, it’s entirely possible that you can be in and out in 10-15 minutes.
joshhsoj1902@lemmy.ca 10 months ago
This isn’t an unsolvable problem though given demand.
Assuming you’re in an appartment with dedicated parking, it’s not crazy difficult or expensive to install some lvl 2 chargers, the real blocker here is demand, if residents aren’t demanding it the building isn’t going to supply it.
If you’re stuck with street parking, you’re right, your use case isn’t best suited for EVs right now. But this case also isn’t a huge portion of vehicle owners, so it doesn’t seem like justification to stop rollout.
GBU_28@lemm.ee 10 months ago
Ignorant on the levels, but I thought I read it WAS crazy to install all that infrastructure. Gas stations apparently struggle to get it done.
Maybe I read about the next level
vithigar@lemmy.ca 10 months ago
Level 3 fast chargers (the kind you would want at a gas station) are legitimately difficult to arrange infrastructure for in some areas. Multiple 200+ kW loads are not something that many properties are wired for. It’s an enormous investment.
Level 2 chargers are basically trivial to install in comparison and can be supported just about anywhere with two phase service. They’re much slower than level 3 chargers, but are a great option for any place that people stop with the intent to stay for an hour or more. Workplaces, restaurants, shopping malls, etc.
GBU_28@lemm.ee 10 months ago
Ty for education
circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org 10 months ago
I’d be curious to see real stats about how many folks in the US have a car and any practical access to a charger, even if somehow we convinced landlords everywhere to install chargers or the govt footed that bill entirely. I suspect it isn’t the minority you think given the current housing situation in the country.
Even so, we seem agreed that a massive infrastructure improvement would be needed to make this at all practical. It looks a lot like pie in the sky to me.
joshhsoj1902@lemmy.ca 10 months ago
I’m not sure I agree there is a massive infrastructure need. The average American could keep their EV charged today with a standard 120v outlet.
I don’t have numbers for how any car owners park their car overnight somewhere that has access to a 120v plug, but it would surprise me if it was less than 50%.
Batteries are fine today and I lay getting better, fast charging is nice to have, but definitely not needed.
A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 10 months ago
I think this is ignoring the fact that the average americans daily milage is so little (around 30 miles)that an electric car can be topped up off a Level 1 charger. Even more if you can get a level 2 charger.
So for most americans average driving, an electric car would be a boon, even if no independent in the wild infrastructure/charging facilities existed.
cantsurf@lemm.ee 10 months ago
OK, but if you live in an apartment, where do you plug in that level 1 charger?
shadowSprite@lemmy.world 10 months ago
I would love to consider getting an electric car whenever I can afford a new(er) vehicle. But there’s no way my landlord will let me run an extension cord from my 3rd story apartment around the building and around the pond between my building and the parking lot. It’s sad that an EV would be so great, but its really a mark of privilege to own both in initial affordability and just having the place to park and charge one. Not that it matters, I can’t afford anything other than my 24 year old Honda.
rebelsimile@sh.itjust.works 10 months ago
Level 1 charging works off of a regular power outlet
bitwyze@lemmy.world 10 months ago
And if you only have street parking?
Monument@lemmy.sdf.org 10 months ago
Do they make wireless extension cords?
A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 10 months ago
an extension cord.
cantsurf@lemm.ee 10 months ago
This is just not a practical day-to-day solution. Most people don’t have a parking spot right outside their window that they can reliably use for charging. There is often a sidewalk that the cord would have to cross, creating the opportunity for someone to trip and sue you. There is often landscaping between buildings and parking, creating the opportunity for the landscapers to accidentally run over your cord with their lawnmower. Some asshole is going to walk by and unplug your car and then you may be late to work.
Sure, you could it, but it’s not a practical solution.
Alpha71@lemmy.world 10 months ago
TBH if your daily mileage is only 30 or so miles, then you can do all of that on an electric bike.
marx2k@lemmy.world 10 months ago
Electric bikes suck in the Wisconsin winter
m0darn@lemmy.ca 10 months ago
I hear that biking in the snow isn’t actually bad. This is hearsay because it doesn’t snow much where I am.
You wear your winter coat and snow pants, and get studded tires.
You don’t have to worry about getting stuck going up an icy hill (because if its too icy to drive up, you can walk up it), granted not likely to be a problem in Wisconsin.
You don’t have to worry about getting stuck due to low clearance (like the snow between the ruts that hatchbacks and minivans get stuck on) because you can just pick up your bike.
Also if a pedestrian slips while crossing the road, you probably won’t kill them if you can’t stop in time.
I guess the wind could be intense. What’s your experience been?
niucllos@lemm.ee 10 months ago
You should be able to, but US non-car infrastructure is so abysmal that there’s a strong chance you can’t safely unfortunately
Nollij@sopuli.xyz 10 months ago
Ignoring how that would work even under ideal circumstances, do you propose that large portions of the country use a bike when it’s below freezing? Because that’s a non-starter, and no one will take you seriously.
circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org 10 months ago
I currently bike or walk most places, but I also know that’s not a common situation in the US. For me the car is only used for anything far enough away.
Waraugh@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 months ago
I replaced 90% of my driving with an electric golf cart