Games used to be programmed in low level code, if you don’t care enough to hand code your game and instead rely on machines to “compile” it for you, why even spend money on “your” product that’s all high level machine generated code?
Indie gamedev existed for years before AI. You can just sit down and make a game. And if you don’t care enough to actually work on it, why would people even spend their money on “your” product?
golden@sh.itjust.works 22 hours ago
catfeeder@piefed.blahaj.zone 13 hours ago
There’s a difference between coding your game in high level code + making all the other stuff like assets, levels and music
and
asking thiefgpt togenerateplagiarize assets and music for you.
chicken@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
Games bring together a lot of different mediums and require a diverse set of skills. So for instance someone might be great at drawing, and have a great idea for a game that uses their art, but they have a hard time with coding, and use AI to handle that part of it for them in a way that’s more flexible than some other more restrictive solution like RPG Maker, which might make it closer to their vision for the kind of game they wanted to make. I think such a game could be worth playing, assuming the person making it cares about what they are making and puts their own work into it.
Spawn7586@lemmy.world 1 day ago
That’s kinda fallacious as an argument. AI cannot create good code, it CAN be used to create code, but requires.expert to fix the tons of mistakes and simply bad coding solutions it comes up with. If you don’t have the skills it’s better to use a tool made to help you with that with its limitations (rpg maker in your example) rather than use a tool made to aid already expert users (that even they say it actually creates more work for them lol). I write code myself and LLMs simply suck at coding. They can create “art” but it’s all the same and you can spot it on their steam page when they do. Honestly, I’m not even angry at them for thinking the same way as you do: it’s just that those coding solutions are advertised as such, and people are simply ignoring the expert in the field that tell them they can’t actually do that. If you try that road you will either create something that doesn’t work or something that will put its users at risk (by creating trojan backdoors in theor system or sharing sensitive information) and that’s something I can’t simply condone.
chicken@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
You’re kind of right, in that it’s not a total solution right now and you probably won’t be able to vibe code a whole game (except a really simple one maybe) with no knowledge. But that doesn’t mean it couldn’t lower the skill floor for someone. I’m assuming the person in my scenario would be also using an engine like Unity or Godot, maybe asking the AI to walk them through how to do what they want, write simple scripts and explain/suggest syntax. That shouldn’t have too much risk of generating inadvertent backdoors, and I think LLMs are pretty good at explaining basic code. Game engines already enforce the basic design structure, which will make it easier to avoid big unfixable mistakes and do everything in small pieces a LLM is less likely to fuck up.
The same is true with using it for art; you’re right that a lot of AI art on Steam is obvious and looks the same, but really good AI assisted art isn’t. The amount of skill and effort required for that is not zero, but is less than it might be otherwise. I’m assuming there are a lot of games out there where you just can’t tell, and because there’s so much fear of backlash it just isn’t disclosed.
mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
But that doesn’t mean it couldn’t lower the skill floor for someone.
No, it DOES. In fact, it RAISES the skill floor.
How is a dev supposed to be able to find an error in the code if they don’t know how to code?
As a programmer, most of your time isn’t actually spent writing code. It’s mostly spent debugging. An amateur programmer relying on AI is minimizing a task that takes a minority of their time while maximizing a task that takes the majority of their time.
For amateur programmers, AI isn’t an asset, it’s a liability.
catfeeder@piefed.blahaj.zone 1 day ago
I don’t know a single self-respecting artist who would use AI though. Artists are literally the most harmed people by the LLMs lol.
Other than that, I agree with what @spawn7586@lemmy.world said - if you don’t know how to code, LLMs will generate the most unplayable game in existence.
agent_nycto@lemmy.world 1 day ago
Or, like in the past, people figure out solutions to the limitations and make something new. The fog in silent Hill is an example.
I’d rather pay for a game that looks shittier and handmade than ai garbage.
golden@sh.itjust.works 22 hours ago
Silent Hill was made by a huge studio with large financial backing.
I’d rather pay for a game made by a solo Indie dev who used AI to help them over corpo garbage.
agent_nycto@lemmy.world 4 hours ago
First of all, missing my point in bringing up the fog mechanic. It was a limitation that they found a clever workaround for that ended up enhancing the game greatly. If they didn’t have that limitation, there wouldn’t be the fog, and the game would suffer from it.
Secondly, don’t try to pull the “oh AI is rebellious anti corporation tech” bullshit, AI is made and run by nothing but huge corporations with large financial backing who are making evil corpo garbage. You’re not a rebel for using it, you’re just another bootlicker.
warm@kbin.earth 1 day ago
I'd rather pay for neither.
Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 1 day ago
And some people even outsource their defense of AI slop to AI.
chicken@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
I promise you, none of what I write here is AI, I’m against doing that
Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 1 day ago
I will never believe you, since you’ve spent this entire thread defending AI slop.
Tyrq@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
Because these people do not understand the concept of craft nor care about the process of creating, they are soulless goons looking to gift people. It’s not their fault that society is so fucked that it’s necessary to trick and rob people so they can eat…
catfeeder@piefed.blahaj.zone 1 day ago
Yeah, they don’t understand that the process of learning, of making mistakes and hitting dead-ends as you create your work of art is fucking important! Failures can lead to unexpected changes to your initial idea, and they might improve your work or at least make it iconic (the classic example of the fog in Silent Hill that was added to offset a technical limitation). You can’t have that if the entire process of creating a piece is automated.
dreamkeeper@literature.cafe 1 day ago
Lol. Literally just making stuff up about AI processes. No one other than shovelware developers is using AI to create a final product - and shovelware slop is nothing new. AI is simply another tool in the creation process.
It’s crazy how none of you anti-AI folks actually use AI yet rail against it like you’re experts on the topic.
catfeeder@piefed.blahaj.zone 1 day ago
Yeah it’s crazy how people who don’t like a tool don’t use it
dreamkeeper@literature.cafe 1 day ago
You’re so full of it. AI is just another tool I can use to save time and be more efficient. It doesn’t produce a finished product, but it’s good for creating a foundation that I can then edit and change into something I want. Don’t try to tell me I’m fucking “soulless” just because you’re scared of the big new tech. I’ve been programming for decades.
You aren’t entitled to my time. Luddites like you also shat on cameras when they were first invented too. Your arguments against AI prove that you have no clue how to use it and just want to insult anyone who does.
wizardbeard@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 day ago
Even today, people value photos differently than paintings, at least in part due to the amount of effort that goes into each.
There’s no reasonable argument to preventing people from having the information up front to make the same sort of value decision about a game.
You’re free to use AI, just declare it. The purchasing public is free to decide if that changes how much they’re willing to pay for your game.