Nope, no you wouldn’t. If you want to see the example of unmoderated community, go to whatever new 4chan incarnation is. You will see child pornography, nazis recruiting children with badly fried memes, dead people, parts of dead people, characters from popular japaneese cartons involved in the depraved shit, and spam, so much spam, so much spam you couldn’t even believe this much spam is possible.
Comment on coping
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Moderators have destroyed the Internet
Nalivai@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
JackbyDev@programming.dev 9 months ago
There was a decentralized Reddit clone someone posted recently and I was excited to check it out. Sure enough, racist shit.
Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
there is a decentralized reddit clone, it’s called lemmy lmao
being decentralized doesn’t mean you have no moderation
JackbyDev@programming.dev 9 months ago
No fucking shit being decentralized doesn’t mean it doesn’t have to have no moderation, how the fuck did you get that from what I said? This clone I’m talking about specifically advertised itself as being unmoderated and free from censorship. I’ve forgotten the name and don’t really care to try and remember it. If you’re interested, look through my comments for me mentioning people using the N word. That’s what stuck out about this clone. Just full on pages of people using the N word with a hard R.
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Aside from the CP, that is how it was back in the day and how it should be. And no it wasn’t all spam. It’s just that the spam was obvious. Today though the spam is the Internet. Go look at marvel or any sub Reddit, the product are the people, the spam is the site itself being sold to companies. We need freedom to post unsavory things so that these companies no longer want to risk selling their product between videos of jelly arms and someone training their dog to do Nazi salutes. We need to post that stuff in protest to get back to what we were
Nalivai@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
Also, “Aside from the CP” doesn’t exist. In your unmoderated utopia you can’t just put this aside as if it doesn’t exist, you have to deal with it. Or be OK with it, like you’re OK with everything else.
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
We have laws and there’s a big difference between removing CP and giving moderators the ability to remove content they think jives with a community based on their own teenage inexperienced Virgin judgment.
JackbyDev@programming.dev 9 months ago
You will see child pornography, nazis recruiting children with badly fried memes, dead people, parts of dead people, characters from popular japaneese cartons involved in the depraved shit, and spam
Aside from the CP, that is how it was back in the day and how it should be.
So you’re okay with nazis recruiting children with badly fried memes, dead people, parts of dead people, characters from popular japaneese cartons involved in the depraved shit, and spam?
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Yea I don’t care. I lived it. Something about that environment also creates great moments. Unlike today. Plus things have never been worse and all we have is constant moderation. For every “good moderator” the bad ones have caused echo chambers and rifts that have created extremism
S_H_K@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 months ago
I disagree you’re looking at it with Rose tinted glasses. The problem with mods is that it is almost paradoxical a good mod is barely seen keeping the community well oiled and functional. Almost always a mod gets known is because of a fuckup.
There must be a balance between the freedom to post anything and keeping the line of the community. Is so frigging hard I don’t blame ppl for hating modwork.Pelicanen@sopuli.xyz 9 months ago
The spam isn’t just for things that are savory. The spam can be for unsavory things, propagandizing, griefing, or advertising outright illegal things.
I don’t want to have to wade through a shit ton of nazi bullshit or ads for whatever is the silk road replacement nowadays in order to take a beat after work to read shitposts. Dealing with inane stupidity shouldn’t be the bar for what people have to put up with to interact with each other.
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
You act like everywhere was like that. We had no rules and it was never like that. You had to go out and specifically look for it like liveleaks
notarobot@lemmy.zip 9 months ago
Join nostr. Is a decentralized social network where no one can stop you from saying what ever you want.
I’ve not seen any kind of porn (adult or child). No gore.
What you do get is all the anarchist liberals, trump supporters, homophobes, racists, and AY TO MANY conversations about bitcoin (I recommend adding a filter to remove any posts that mention bitcoin just to actually find something different)
ICastFist@programming.dev 9 months ago
Well, nostr is based on some blockchain tech, of course it’s full of cryptobros
notarobot@lemmy.zip 9 months ago
It is not. Nostr is based on public key cryptography. A lot of features are linked with a layber on top of bitcoin (lightning, which by my understanding makes absolutely no sense), but its nowhere near required
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Oh shit I’ll check that out. Might be what I’m looking for. I’m so tired of modern digital spaces. Reddit really opened my eyes to what it all eventually becomes. It’s all about clearing the space for political ads, marketing and manipulations instead of by regular people for regular people. And it’s all clear cut by moderators who think they’re doing a good job.
notarobot@lemmy.zip 9 months ago
I’ve been an ass to assholes on nostr and would t want that linked up to my Lemmy account. So if you want someone to interact with or test things, I can generate a new account
mfed1122@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
The problem is that if you actually have no or insufficient moderation then people just start using the site to post child pornography. And then you visiting what used to be a site you like becomes basically illegal and dangerous, not to mention potentially traumatizing. I’m not exaggerating, there was a small game fan forum site I used to love along with many others, but someone caught on to the fact it was run by just one guy and kept signing up with fake accounts and posting child porn or links to it. Luckily I had already fallen off using the site by then, but one of my Internet friends who still visited it kept me updated on the drama. First everyone normal stopped visiting. Then it eventually got so bad the owner had to shut down the site.
People lack imagination when it comes to what will happen with no moderation. It quickly becomes horrible.
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
So yea that’s true. But I think there a big gap between allowing CP vs banning users because the comments are not inline with marvel family entertainment corporation ethos
mfed1122@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
Absolutely there is, but unfortunately the solution to CP is having moderators who can delete content, and that alone is enough to cause all the problems with moderators. It seems largely intractable to me. The only thing I could see maybe working is some system where moderators can be removed by community vote, but then you rely on systems preventing fake accounts from being created or account age to stop those votes from being botted, etc… I just don’t see how to technically solve the problem of moderators having power to delete things. It’s the classic issue of who watches the watchmen. Humanity has never had a great solution to this.
Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
we do have a solution, it’s called treating people like people and telling them to fuck off when they misbehave, and if moderators don’t stop misbehaving then you move.
i feel like every time people complain about things being bad and oh so difficult to solve there’s a blitheringly obvious social solution that has been used for millions of years that is for some reason being ignored
tane69@lemmy.world 9 months ago
The type of person who would willingly become a moderator is the exact type of dumbass you do not want doing the job
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
They’re the TSA of the internet
ipitco@lemmybefree.net 9 months ago
Moderation would be better if there was a “see anyways” button on deleted content
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Holy shit, I actually totally agree on this. Like I’ve thought about this often and come to the same conclusion. It should be something where people can view what is being removed if they wish.
One of my biggest concerns with moderation is that moderator teams eventually attract people trying to conceal things and reducing what the spirit of the internet originally stood for.
Like having a company try to erase any bad stories about it’s products by controlling all the spaces we could talk about that product.
But if we can all still choose to see what is removed it gives us a big window into what moderation teams are manipulating things and which are honest teams.
wolframhydroxide@sh.itjust.works 9 months ago
Except that there’s no incentive for a moderation team to implement that policy, and anyone with enough access can make a workaround to censor whatever they want without allowing people to view anyway, right?
Netrunner@programming.dev 9 months ago
Or in some state cases, changing the narrative politically.
emmy67@lemmy.world 9 months ago
I too think we need more Nazis on the internet /s
But seriously that’s what you get with less moderators.
ipitco@lemmybefree.net 9 months ago
yes, but not only, and that’s the important thing to understand
emmy67@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Feels like that might be the largest problem right now.
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Yea we’ve increased moderation massively and totally have less Nazis today then ever before
Nalivai@discuss.tchncs.de 9 months ago
Yes, we do actually. Not zero, unfortunately, those fuckers are like mold, always returning for some reason. Like, the second they decreased moderation on X The Everything App Formerly Known As Twitter, it got overrun with Nazis.
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Cause they’re Edge Lords who saw moderation and went in the opposite direction because their personality forces them to act as antisocial antagonists
Doomsider@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Spoken like someone who has never moderated.
RaivoKulli@sopuli.xyz 9 months ago
Thank you for your service
burgerpocalyse@lemmy.world 9 months ago
so-called free internet advocates after being subjected to one second of unmoderated content (it’s all gore and animal abuse) Image
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
It was all. All of it. Nothing else.
capuccino@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Yeah, I love how they do 4 hours discord calls discussing if they should or not delete a single post
ipitco@lemmybefree.net 9 months ago
moderation debates are the best
feeling like a judge serving a higher cause when no one actually cares
TriflingToad@sh.itjust.works 9 months ago
or just delete it for no reason whatsoever
Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 9 months ago
I love when it’s clearly something like a Marvel or Disney PR team running a place and it turns into the most nail on chalk board grating questions like “if you had to wear a super Heroes costume to prom which one would it be” and all the top comments are bots talking about the costumes from the latest movie coming out.
shiftymccool@programming.dev 9 months ago
It seems to me that you don’t hate moderators, you hate that they are necessary nowadays. If so, i’m right there with ya. The web used to be a much more magical place
dickalan@lemmy.world 9 months ago
What the fuck my guy you’re not serious, you have to be intolerant of intolerance and a lot of intolerant people visit unmoderated boards
RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 9 months ago
Right? Not everything has to be the worst of 4chan, Ogrish, or Xitter.