It was fun, having a leading character that was a lil unstable.
Janeway arguably went off the deep end a couple times, too.
Sisko was kind of crazy...
Submitted 1 year ago by GaiusGornicusCaesar@startrek.website to risa@startrek.website
https://startrek.website/pictrs/image/8a0ab70a-3f51-4926-8049-113af2ba1eef.jpeg
Comments
MentalEdge@sopuli.xyz 1 year ago
Madrigal@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I’ve never forgiven her for murdering Tuvix.
Nacktmull@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Fuck Tuvix - he was just an accident while Tuvok and Neelix were real people! Janeway made the hard choice and then did the right thing by correcting the accident.
neanderthal@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Sisko is my favorite. I don’t think it was going off the deep end as much as using the same strategy the US used by nuking Japan. Japan had no chance at that point and continuing conventional war would have been more costly in terms of lives lost and property damage. Using nukes crushed any hope they had of continuing the war and have their prideful government an out that preserves their ego.
In DS9, it sent the message that the federation is can and will annihilate the dominion to defend themselves and the god complex of the changelings was pure delusion.
ClericalBlunt@lemm.ee 1 year ago
Blowing up two cities to save a theoretical number of people is evil. There is no excuse for the atomic bombing of Japan.
neanderthal@lemmy.world 1 year ago
I don’t like the phrase “no excuse”. I’m a particularist. E.g. There is no excuse for shooting someone. Shooting a person actively shooting up an elementary school is fine in my book.
Japan@kbin.social 1 year ago
@ClericalBlunt Yes. Japan so polite so clean. Dindu nuffing.
Disgustoid@startrek.website 1 year ago
I’m in the middle of my DS9 rewatch and totally forgot about the stark difference between Sisko hair and Sisko bald. I just watched the Homefront/Paradise Lost episodes and the episode where Eddington defects to the Maquis and watching Sisko go all badass and lose his shit was fantastic.
FancyLad@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Bald Sisko’s appearance is where the fun begins.
FaeDrifter@midwest.social 1 year ago
Sisko shaving his head was the DS9 version of growing the beard.
visak@lemmy.world 1 year ago
Much as a like Avery Brooks, he never got a handle on the Sisko character until he shaved and went back to being Hawk but with a son. They should have let him do that from the beginning.
xusontha@ls.buckodr.ink 1 year ago
You got so many memes coming out right now it’s crazy!
HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club 1 year ago
Why do you think Worf was a little scared of Sisko?
Stamets@startrek.website 1 year ago
Okay. I’ma do it. I’m going to say the most controversial thing I’ve ever said on here so far.
Sisko is my least favorite Captain by a significant margin. Him making a planet completely uninhabitable for humanoid life and forcing refugees to flee again is a seriously big reason as to why I don’t like him. The whole assassination plot is another reason, although that’s open for debate. Sterilizing a planet for centuries just so you can hunt down a single man? One that you have a personal connection with? One you clearly have feelings of vengeance over? I can’t get with it.
“You cannot explain away a wantonly immoral act because you think it is connected to some higher purpose.” ~ Jean-Luc Picard
PurpleCat@lemm.ee 1 year ago
As someone who has had this opinion “Sisko is a war criminal who destroyed a planet’s biosphere” I encourage you to rewatch the episode.
the “refugees” are terrorists who developed the bomb Sisko used, he just returned it from cardassian DNA to human DNA
this is not about a personal vendetta, this is about the treaty with cardassia that will save lives.
These terrorists are jeopardizing peace just because they aren’t willing to relocate, not because they have a spiritual connection with the land (“TNG:Journey’s End”) but because they “Already built a home here” . The settlers Picard was going to remove by force actually joined the cardassians because they didn’t want to leave, but the Maqius are so racist they were willing to use said weapon to make the planet uninhabitable to cardassians
-on racism Eddington says “the Maqius are not killers” after blowing up a cardassian vessel.
-yes they did have a vendetta but Sisko played that aspect of this conflict so Eddington would turn himself in.
It’s not confirmed in the show or anything, but I doubt the Maqius were only going to use that weapon defensively.
buckykat@hexbear.net 1 year ago
maquis did nothing wrong cardassians deserved it
Stamets@startrek.website 1 year ago
I’ve rewatched the episode fairly recently and I stand by my decision. Sisko had no reasonable justification to do what he did, in my opinion. Are there arguments? Sure, but none that I consider valid simply because of the quote that I ended that previous comment on. You cannot explain away a wantonly immoral act because you think it is connected to some higher purpose.
Terrorist is a point of opinion. They were still people fleeing occupation and reclaiming their world. On top of that, are you willing to say that every single Maquis member is a terrorist? Every man, woman and child? That they deserved to all go through that when they might not have any other options to turn to? That doesn’t seem very Starfleet to me.
That being said, who they are makes literally no difference to me. There were other solutions. Sisko didn’t need an immediate answer in that moment. He actively went to the planet and decided to gas it himself. The actions carried out by Sisko are the problem. Not who he takes them out on. But the personal vendetta plays a significant role and you cannot deny that it does. The majority of the episode is Sisko throwing a temper tantrum over Eddington. Eddington even successfully manages to tease Sisko into making rash decisions. Sisko actively endangered his own crew to hunt down Eddington. The Defiant was not remotely fit for service but he still brought her out, nearly smashing the hell out of it by colliding with the station itself.
Every single action taken by Sisko in that episode horrifies me. He allows himself to get played so easily and then says “Oh I’ll play the villain” and attacks the planet. He’s so utterly not Starfleet in that episode that it hurts. The fact he doesn’t show any remorse, but actively enjoys the fact that he’s managed to capture Eddington, really sickens me. If he had shown any iota of a problem with what he was doing then it would be a different conversation. Sisko didn’t. He rarely shows remorse and it’s why I don’t like him. A good Captain should be willing to question the decisions he makes. When he doesn’t the answer of what’s right and what’s wrong, he shouldn’t be able to sleep well at night. The fact I have two episodes to point to and say “Look at Sisko commiting unspeakable acts. Now look at Sisko completely absolving himself of all responsibility and assuring himself that he’s right” really sticks in my craw. I can’t like the man.
pancakes@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
You’re correct objectively, however I think one of the things people (myself included) like about Sisko is that he’s flawed. He’s (imo) the most complex and developed captain and does let his emotions cloud his judgement from time to time. While Picard is my #2 fave, he’s more an ideal that casts such a massive shadow that nobody can live up to him. Picard perfectly encapsulates humanities ideals, whereas Sisko portays how flawed humanity truly is.
Stamets@startrek.website 1 year ago
That’s fair. I can see how it can be appealing. Makes for good storytelling at the very least.
I do want to make clear here that I wasn’t trying to shame other people or say they’re wrong for liking Sisko. It’s totally just my personal preference.
Nacktmull@lemmy.world 1 year ago
As a Captain Picard admirer coming from TNG, I have always held these things against Sisko just as you do. I´d go as far as saying that SIsko is a war criminal. That does not mean I don´t like DS9 though - on the contrary.
Stamets@startrek.website 1 year ago
Oh completely agree. I have no issue with the show. I have an issue with the man in-universe. Still gonna watch DS9 and enjoy every episode. It’s Star Trek! I love Star Trek!
blargerer@kbin.social 1 year ago
Archer and Janeway have done some batshit stuff too.
Stamets@startrek.website 1 year ago
Batshit? Sure. Going on a revenge mission that displaces thousands of people, changes the entire atmosphere of a planet, and forces your officers to commit warcrimes? Not really. Closest I can think of is:
Janeway hunting down the Equinox. This is pretty close in comparison but the difference is that Janeway had a strong reason for pursuing the Equinox. The lifeforms were attacking the ship and the Equinox had taken both EMH and Seven of Nine. More over, she didn’t doom civilians to further strife. She punished the surviving officers and folded them into the crew of Voyager itself. On top of that, she had serious regret about her actions and showed remorse during the conversation with Chakotay.
I know less about Enterprise but I remember Archer stealing the Warp Core of a crew and leaving them stranded in deep space. However that was an extreme ‘needs of the many’ situation so I’m on Archers side there.
RunningSpaces@lemm.ee 1 year ago
I’m a normies with Star Trek but I remember watching with a homie a thing with Sisko saying he was a war criminal and hoped that people could learn from him.