Comment on Did it really used to be common for guys to go to a bar every night like in Cheers or The Simpsons?
litchralee@sh.itjust.works 23 hours agoEven with NA (low/non-alcoholic) beverages, it’d be nice to have third places that don’t come with an obligation to spend money.
To be clear, I’m not asking for places that ban spending money, but there are third places like parks (eg NYC Central Park) that are destinations in their own right, but one can also spend money there, such as buying stuff and having a picnic on the grass, or bringing board games and meeting up with friends. Or strolling the grounds astride rental e-bikes. Or free yoga.
Where there’s an open space, people make use of it. But we don’t really have much of that in the USA, that isn’t tied up as a parking lot, an open-space preserve (where people shouldn’t tred upon to protect wildlife), or are beyond reasonable distances (eg BLM land in the middle of Nevada).
Everywhere I’ve lived in the US has had plenty of public parks. As a teenager I’d hang out with my friends in them. Hell I’ve been to big community picnics at a park.
The thing is it’s easier to hang out online all the time and people aren’t looking to socialize at parks when there aren’t events.
I’d say the qualities of the average American park leaves much to be desired, when compared to NYC Central Park, San Diego’s Balboa Park, or SF’s Presidio.
In suburban areas, the municipal park tends to be a monoculture of grass plus maybe a playground, a parking lot, and if lucky, a usable bathroom. Regional parks are often nicer, with amenities like pickleball courts or a BMX park, though asking for benches (not rocks or concrete verges, but actually bench seats) and shade might be a stretch.
My point is that the USA has fewer parks and public squares than it ought to. I don’t mean just a place to go jogging or to push a stroller along, but a proper third space where people actively spend time and create value at. Where street vendors congregate because that’s also where people congregate. A place that people – voluntarily, not by necessity – would like to be. A destination in its own right, where even tourists will drop by and take in the air, the sights, and the social interactions.
Meanwhile, some parts of the USA actively sabotage their parks, replacing normal park furniture with versions that are actively hostile to homeless people, while alienating anyone that just wants an armrest as they sit down. Other municipalities spend their Parks & Rec funds on the bare minimum of parks, lots that are impractically tiny. Why? Because a public park can be used to exclude registered sex offenders from a neighborhood, leading to the ludicrous situation where whole cities are an exclusion zone. Regardless of one’s position on how to punish sex offenses, the denial of housing and basic existence is, at best, counterproductive.
So I reiterate: the USA might have a good quantity of parks, but not exactly good quality of parks. People will socialize online unless they are given actual options to socialize elsewhere. And IRL options would build value locally, whereas online communities only accrue to the benefit of the platforms (eg Facebook, WhatsApp) they run on.
Church
We need church without religion
Depending on the community near you, Unitarian Universalists sometimes have basically that. I’ve been an atheist since I was four, but I have no problem with other people being religious and it was perfect for me. If you’re the type to be annoyed by people talking about the universe in a way that suggests the supernatural, you might not want to deal with even the UU’s very mild language. When I went as a kid, we learned about volcanoes in Sunday School, as a gauge for how religious they are.
Or if you want evil church without religion, can I interest you in crossfit?
There are several non religious ethical groups to spend time with.
I tried to get you links but I ran out of time before having to do other responsibilities.
I jokingly asked my wife if she’d go to basically church but reading from Marx instead and despite neither of us being marxists it actually sounded like something we’d go to
But also seriously look into if you have a local community center or library and what events they host. Stuff like that often struggles to find attendees
I do think there’s a special thing about church that is this bigger than yourself experience that you share with your community that just isn’t quite replicated in events like art clubs or whatever, volunteering is probably closer
People downvote, but you’re not wrong and it’s probably the most common example in rural areas
It’s just an example- I’m not saying it’s the only alternative. Although the declining church attendance possibly causes people to seek third places (although I believe the declining church attendance is that it’s more socially acceptable to be a non believer these days. Would rather if someone come to Church that they’d be at least open to believing)
Even if you find one where there isn’t an emphasis on tithes or donation, that’s not exactly a space set up for public socializing. It’s a private space, used by a dedicated and defined group, for socializing within that group. Outsiders may be welcome, but they’re only welcome within that structure.
Depends, lots of churches welcome lay members of the community to the ancillary activities they organise. Catholic churches in my experience are much more embedded in their communities in southern europe regardless of the status of the people participating. My father has been lapsed for 40+ years, never shows up for church and doesn’t participate in any of the religious aspects but he still runs arts and crafts workshops in the parish buildings, for the local kids whether they’re part of the congregation or not.
nimpnin@sopuli.xyz 23 hours ago
Parks and libraries are really nice. Most other third places seem to want you to spend money, that’s my experience here in northern Europe anyway.
merc@sh.itjust.works 18 hours ago
Also, in places with significant winters (including Northern Europe) parks aren’t an option in winter.
Northern Europe seems like the kind of place that would realize this is a problem and invent some kind of community building which was open in the winter and had a shared kitchen, a stock of board games, a court for indoor sports, etc. That’s certainly not going to happen in the US.
thefactremains@lemmy.world 18 hours ago
You mean like the YMCA?
merc@sh.itjust.works 15 hours ago
Well, definitely not a Christian association.