Is saying "Don't need to know hebrew to know the Holocaust was bad" antisemetic?

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• deegeese@sopuli.xyz ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  In what way is it antisemitic?

  If anything, it’s erasure of the non-Jewish victims of the holocaust.

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  • angrymouse@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    If anything, it’s erasure of the non-Jewish victims of the holocaust.

    But this is a common practice these days.

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• xantoxis@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  No, it isn’t.

  Does it erase Jewish culture, history, or trauma? No, it’s clearly doing the opposite of that: affirming the trauma.

  Does it dehumanize Jews? No. It’s neutral to the humanity of Jews, except insofar as it’s clearly meant to affirm the horrors of the Holocaust, which dehumanized and destroyed Jews and Jewish culture.

  Does it perpetuate a harmful stereotype? Nope! It might be considered a stereotype that Jews know Hebrew, but it’s not a harmful one, and it doesn’t make the claim that all Jews know Hebrew in any case. In fact, it strikes back at the idea that specific facts about Jews are even relevant to the conversation about the Holocaust.

  The person you were arguing with just wanted you to go away, and gave you a bad faith rebuttal.

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  • Blamemeta@lemm.ee ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Heres the context: lemm.ee/comment/2233830

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    • Quatity_Control@lemm.ee ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Not anti Semitic and even worse, it was a deft destruction of a gatekeeping argument.

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    • xantoxis@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Agree with Quality_Control, this is an apt comparison and not anti-semitic.

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    • chaircat@lemdro.id ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      I’ll go against the grain here and say I do think it’s antisemitic, for precisely the reason outlined in the parent comment, even though they themselves are also giving you a pass.

      The genocide against the Jews, the Holocaust, was a situation where they were rounding up every single member of the ethnicity they could find in order to exterminate them.

      Even though we use the same word genocide for the Uighurs, no credible authority I’ve ever come across is alleging that is what is happening in Xinjiang. Uighurs still openly populate the province and roam the streets publicly.

      To compare them like this is to directly downplay the Holocaust in order to make a point on the Uighurs. In fact, I’d also say the widespread use of the word genocide for the Uighurs is the same, for reasons we’re seeing from the reactions of everyone else in this thread.

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  • Jaywarbs@artemis.camp ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I appreciate this level of detail. Thanks for explaining it.

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    • xantoxis@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Sure. OP posed an interesting question and I liked having the opportunity to deconstruct it. Language is complex and depends heavily on context, and I’d love it if more people understood that.

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• ImplyingImplications@lemmy.ca ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I’ve always used “You don’t need to know how to fly a plan to know when a pilot is bad”. I don’t think the saying you posted is antisemitic though.

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• balance_sheet@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Why do you choose to engage with crazy people on the internet?

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  • Thorny_Thicket@sopuli.xyz ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    It’s more interesting that engaging with people that already agree with you. Up to a point ofcourse. Once you realize that nothings getting thru either way it’s often better to just move on.

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    • WtfEvenIsExistence@reddthat.com ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Meh, it’s one thing to disagree with how to fix the problems in the world, it’s another thing to glorify past atrocities or just outright deny them. If someone starts denying the holocauss, I’d just ignore them, and report. Same with denying atrocities committed by any other groups of people. There’s no arguing with these people. Argument is for topics like:

      Which is a better pet: Cat vs Dog?

      Representative or Direct Democracy?

      Unitary vs Federal?

      FPTP or Ranked Choice?

      Presidential system vs Parliamentary system?

      And arguing whether some groups of innocent people should be summarily executed or not is not a valid discussion. Arguing about whether history happened or not when there is already more than enough evidence isn’t a good topic to debate about.

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    • AmidFuror@kbin.social ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      There are people on the Internet who disagree about things without either party being crazy. The folks in that thread were not such people.

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  • Blamemeta@lemm.ee ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    I wish I knew.

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• o0joshua0o@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  No. It’s a fact. You also don’t need to know any other specific language in order to know that the Holocaust was bad.

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• JoBo@feddit.uk ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  It would depend entirely on the context.

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• VelociCatTurd@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  No.

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• Crozekiel@kbin.social ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  It's people from Hexbear... From what I've seen, you can't expect anything other than this from them. Just don't engage them.

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  • deegeese@sopuli.xyz ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Tankies gonna genocide Uyghurs.

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  • scytale@lemm.ee ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Do they differentiate themselves between leftists/communists and actual authoritarian tankies? Or do they consider themselves the latter?

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• freamon@endlesstalk.org ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I don’t know why I’m investing any time into what sounds like an unproductive conversation, but maybe the objection was to the assumption that all Jews know Hebrew (and associating Jews with Hebrew and vice-versa)

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  • FlyingSquid@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Fuck, I didn’t even learn enough Hebrew to read from the Torah for my Bar Mitzvah.

    I used a transliterated crib sheet.

    The Rabbi (my cousin), when he found out, took me aside and said, “they won’t know what you did out there today, but GOD KNOWS!”

    I was an atheist then and I’m an atheist now, so I didn’t give a fuck. I had a bar mitzvah to please my grandparents and get some presents and then nope the fuck out of religion for the rest of my life.

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    • freamon@endlesstalk.org ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Oh right. So knowledge of Hebrew isn’t “Univershell” then?

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• Tomassci@kbin.social ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  If they think that the holocaust was in any means okay, they're the antisemite (+ spitting on several more minorities the nazis tried to get rid of).

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• YoBuckStopsHere@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I certainly don’t know Hebrew and I know a lot about the Holocaust.

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• jimmydoreisalefty@lemmus.org ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Antisemitism is hostility to, prejudice towards, or discrimination against Jews. A person who holds such positions is called an antisemite. Antisemitism is a form of racism. Antisemitism has historically been manifested in many ways, ranging from expressions of hatred of or discrimination against individual Jews to organized pogroms by mobs, police forces, or genocide. Although the term did not come into common usage until the 19th century, it is also applied to previous and later anti-Jewish incidents.

  Maybe to the Samaritans?

  I don’t think it is, but I would ask a Jewish person to make sure. Where is Jonah Hill when you need him!?!?

  Oh, he just went to go get some milk, he should be back quick.

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• FireTower@lemmy.world ⁨10⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  “Damn those antisemitisms and their looks at note and raises eyebrow … acknowledged of the evils of Nazi Germany?”

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