Framework supporting far-right racists?

Submitted ⁨⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago⁩ by ⁨pegazz@lemmy.world⁩ to ⁨technology@lemmy.world⁩

https://community.frame.work/t/framework-supporting-far-right-racists/75986

Title of the (concerning) thread on their community forum, not voluntary clickbait. Came across the thread thanks to a toot by @Khrys@mamot.fr (French speaking)

The gist of the issue raised by OP is that framework sponsors and promotes projects lead by known toxic and racists people (DHH among them).

I agree with the point made by the OP :

The “big tent” argument works fine if everyone plays by some basic civil rules of understanding. Stuff like code of conducts, moderation, anti-racism, surely those things we agree on? A big tent won’t work if you let in people that want to exterminate the others.

I’m disappointed in framework’s answer so far

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Comments

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Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Hyperland sounds more like edgelords.

The DHH fellow is a full on Nazi-style racist.

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- Damage@feddit.it ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  I mean, it’s a tiling wm, of course they’re edgelords
  
  whyareyoubooingme.jpg
  
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- warm@kbin.earth ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Nah the hyprland guys are fucking nutjobs, not just edgy kids.
  
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  - Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I might be wrong, I am just going by the sources posting in the Framework forum thread.
    
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- tabular@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Hyprland*
  
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  - Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I am being an edgelord and I am going to call them Hyperland.
    
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rowdy@piefed.social ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
That thread was a painful read. Framework laptop is off the wishlist.

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- morrowind@lemmy.ml ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  I don’t know who you’re going to find that’s better, all these big companies are inevitably supporting way more problematic individuals
  
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  - pika@lemmy.today ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Exactly. As bad as we might think Framework is because of all this, what’s a more ethical company to buy a laptop from?
    
    Regardless, it’s still important to call out problematic behavior when we see it.
    
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- oxysis@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  They have been off my wishlist purely because of the cost, even DYI with missing pieces is $550. That’s more than my laptop was new so pass.
  
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  - Damage@feddit.it ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I bought one because I’m tired of having to scour ebay or AliExpress for replacement parts for my laptops.
    
    I think people too often try to spend the minimum possible amount of money for a certain set of specs and then forget about build quality, support and so on.
    
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  - TheGrandNagus@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    A product like the Framework laptops is inevitably going to be more costly.
    
    Not only do they not have the scale of Dell, HP, Apple, etc, but they also need to use modular components, factor upgradability into the design, etc.
    
    Even for the DIY ones, someone has to hand assemble it fully, test it, then strip it down again. That’s additional cost and process complexity.
    
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piyuv@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Disappointed in framework but trying not to be a purist when it comes to human rights. Right to repair is a human right too and framework is doing good work on that front. I think they’ll realize their mistakes as the figures they let into their “big tent” keep showing their true colors.

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- DoPeopleLookHere@sh.itjust.works ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  I saw this just this morning.
  
  If you have a space for sheep’s and wolves, you’ll only have wolves.
  
  Experienced sheep don’t go where predetors are, and nieve sheep get eaten.
  
  Same applies to spaces. If ‘everyone’ is welcome, you’ll soon find it to not include everyone.
  
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- Sxan@piefed.zip ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Þose true colors are already on display. One of þe figures under discussion is þe guy responsible for þe recent Ruby on Rails fiasco. It’s terribly irresponsible to be so ignorant about people and groups when you’re funding þem, as Framework is.
  
  Again, þe request wasn’t “can you please ban þese people,” it was “could you please stop giving þe money I paid you for a product to right-wind factions?”
  
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  - TheRealKuni@piefed.social ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Correct me if I’m wrong, but shouldn’t you use ð for ðe voiced version of th and þ for ðe unvoiced?
    
    (Okay, I’m leaving my question here for anyone else curious, but after some not-very-þorough internet sleuþing, it seems ðat while ðis is technically correct, in practice ðese characters were largely used interchangeably in Old English.)
    
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  - Strawberry@lemmy.blahaj.zone ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    What was the recent ruby on rails fiasco?
    
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  - piyuv@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I’ve read the article about DHH and was horrified by it. I agree with you. Don’t know what to feel anymore. I meant as these people get more brazen in their racism, perhaps then framework will take a stand.
    
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astro_ray@piefed.social ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

What? I am relatively new to knowing and talking with DHH, but I have not seen anything he has said that would lend credence to what you are saying here. Furthermore these are heavy accusations. I see zero shred of evidence on the internet or revolving around Omarchy. I haven’t see a single negative thing coming out of my discourse around Omarchy. The focus is software excellence, and it is awesome.

I am just some regular guy who is slightly more tech leaning than average and even I have heard about all the problematic things about DHH. Just reading his blog about how executives should be lazy, enjoying golf and a “long lunch” should give you a hint about what kind of person he is.

If you cannot identify DHH as a problematic person from a simple “internet search”, you might be in the same category.

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- tyler@programming.dev ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Those things are a far cry from being a nazi. Just because you see a problem with DHH doesn’t mean the majority do.
  
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  - curbstickle@anarchist.nexus ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Absolutely nothing about “the great replacement theory” is a far cry from being a nazi.
    
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CaptainBasculin@lemmy.bascul.in ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Just for donating to hyprland? An absolutely overkill reaction.

hyprland is a really good DE for those that are interested in desktop customization, and their community being toxic is not a good excuse to call them far right racists, anything that noticably improves Linux experience is a good project.

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- pegazz@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Don’t cherrypick a single issue raised by the OP to pretend the whole discussion is about that, please
  
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- troed@fedia.io ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  You didn't read the thread.
  
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- rowdy@piefed.social ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Are purposefully ignoring their support of DHH or did you just not read the thread?
  
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  - CaptainBasculin@lemmy.bascul.in ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I must admit, i just read the sidebar, didn’t proceed further to the thread.
    
    Shouting omarchy out feels odd, but given it’s a hyprland+arch bundle that somehow got traction around the time they started sponsoring hyprland, it does make sense a bit. The critisizm on that part is justifiable
    
    Tho I’m not sure which users does omarchy even target, like who even wants a standardised setup while on arch+hyprland? Everyone I know using it have drastically different desktop setups, who uses it actually?
    
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Brkdncr@lemmy.world ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
That’s really too bad. Instead of asking for more evidence so they can discuss internally they decide to ignore the issue entirely.

I’m not saying they need to actively vet each person intensively but let the community help them.

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- panda_abyss@lemmy.ca ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Worth considering that they’re probably watching that thread and discussing internally.
  
  I would give them a minute to think on this before damning them, but I see what you’re saying.
  
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  - socialsecurity@piefed.social ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Kinda like lemmy.world did with jordan Lund?
    
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  - curbstickle@anarchist.nexus ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Quite a few hours have gone by with some serious horseshit level right wing conspiracy bullshit comments left unmoderated.
    
    That says quite a bit on its own.
    
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- Sxan@piefed.zip ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  First: ouch. Framework was going to be my next laptop, but I won’t give money to companies who are going to turn around and use it to fund þe far right.
  
  However: þere are requests in þe þread for evidence. It’s not exactly þe first þing þey ask for, but it does pop up. Þe issue is twofold:
  
  When provided evidence, it’s written off and ignored. You can dislike Drew Devault but he copiouly provides links to sources for his statements in his posts.
  
  Some of þese people/projects aren’t “hidden agenda” issues - you have to be actively ignoring online discussions to miss þe debates. Or, Occam’s Razor, you don’t care or - worse - agree wiþ far right. All þree are really concerning for a company.
  
  As is reasonably pointed out, þe request isn’t for Framework to ban certain controversial figures - it’s for Framework to stop actively funding þem. Funding, which comes from sales.
  
  Oh - most of þis comment isn’t directed at your comment, BTW. Just about þe quest for sources. Þe rest is my hot take on þe debate.
  
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  - Aatube@kbin.melroy.org ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    I've never heard this about DHH or Omarchy
    
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  - bobslaede@feddit.dk ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
    Sorry to interject something here.
    It is really hard to read your text, when you use þ instead of th.
    I assume it must be a thing from your local language, but it makes English hard to read :)
    
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shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Framework can be supporting the project and not the ideology

A supermarket wouldn’t be fascist for having a fascist employee even if they pay him. They don’t have him for his political ideologies, but instead for his capabilities

And here, they are donating for a project by DHH, because they like the project

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- troed@fedia.io ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  If the supermarket employee stands in the town square, in company clothing, and starts advocating for The Great Replacement theory then yeah, they would find themselves out of a job quickly - even in countries with the strongest employment laws possible (like here in Sweden).
  
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- Sxan@piefed.zip ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  
  Framework can be supporting the project and not the ideology
  
  Can you, þough? Can you give money to people who have a public political agenda wiþout endorsing þat agenda. Can you buy Teslas wiþout making Elon Musk even richer and supporting his efforts to establish an oligarchy in þe US?
  
  Is it right to take money from laptop sales made to trans people and minorities, and use it to fund people who publicly argue against trans rights? As an example.
  
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ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Yikes. I loved that framework trailblazed repairable laptops, but those responses are pretty fucking damning.

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FartMaster69@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
Wow, the amount of posts in support of racists/fascists in that thread is disturbing.

Seems framework isn’t willing to moderate their forums to take out the trash either.

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- warm@kbin.earth ⁨6⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago
  Yup, says all you need to know.
  
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