Submitted 2 days ago by Davriellelouna@lemmy.world to technology@lemmy.world
this entire thing reads like a fantasy. or some reddit thread where “everyone clapped” to me.
if I was told by a professor on the first day of class which I paid for that I wasn’t allowed to use my own note taking method I had been using for decades, I’d just say “No.” and if pressed further, I’d take it as high as I needed to. or get a full refund for the class and find another.
this isn’t an elementary school. these aren’t children. these are adults.
“I paid for it” isn’t an excuse to do whatever you want.
Why wouldn’t it? If you’re not bothering others, you should be free to piss your money away.
Depends on the class. Pretty unreasonable in a 200+ lecture hall, but a respected professor setting up a small seminar like this to remove distractions sounds like a fair prerogative to create an environment conducive to learning.
Ofc if a student asked for a reasonable accommodation that’s probably chill too.
Did you read anything past the first paragraph?
read the entire article yesterday, yes. how can i help?
Only barbarians take notes by hand. A TRUE GREEK PHILOSOPHER would simply memorize all the requisite facts. Paper is dissolving the very moral fabric of our society. Smash that /s button for more bug facts!
I disagree that writing by hand is magically improving information absorbtion/retention. Source: I’ve been doing it through all of my school and all of my uni. Being half-asleep, pondering something completely irrelevant, and in general course material flying completely over my head while I write it down was a norm most of the time. And lecturers dictating their stuff at high speeds didn’t help either. Maybe there is some temporary novelty effect after you switch from one way of writing to another, but I wouldn’t expect that last long.
The more muscles and senses you engage in learning the better you will retain the information.
One method is not necessarily the best for everyone, but studies show that writing notes by javd does improve retention.
No one that has looked at this in a serious way agrees with you.
From the abstract:
“These results suggest that the movements involved in handwriting allow a greater memorization of new words. The advantage of handwriting over typing might also be caused by a more positive mood during learning. Finally, our results show that handwriting with a digital pen and tablet can increase the ability to learn compared with keyboard typing once the individuals are accustomed to it.”
I don’t buy it. I think the method they used worked, but I don’t think the blanket statement is fair. My handwriting sucks, and writing quickly for more than a few minutes hurts my hands.
I’ve found typing works extremely well for everything but math. I type everything out as they speak, but horribly, with zero respect to grammar or spelling, just get the information down. Then, I go back afterwards and fix it all, and in doing so, reinforcing my learning. Its hard to do, because it had to be written well enough for me to be able to understand my chicken scratch later, but damn, it helps.
If you’re going back and fixing it, you’re getting that absorption the article is referring to. If you’re not referring to your notes ever again, handwriting is better because it forces that absorption to happen (i.a. you need to summarize). If you want all of the content, just watch the recording.
I’m pretty sure that writing something down has been proven to be helpful for retaining the information.
But that study is probably 50 years old, and people learn and retain information differently.
So I wouldn’t be surprised if using a computer to take notes is just as effective as writing it, especially for younger generations.
See my comment to OP for a recentish publication that shows the same thing all studies previously have shown. You are quite correct.
I switched from using paper notebooks to take lecture notes to using a computer for most classes around 2nd year of college and it was about the same. I mostly used the notes for spaced repetition when going over the material again a week or so after the lecture and helped keep my focus on the material during the lectures. It’s also easier to share notes with a study group if they’re already digital.
Your review process is making the difference here. Handwriting vs computer notes is looking at the difference without reviewing the notes afterward.
I don’t know about you, but I rarely referred to my notes later. The lectures frequently corresponded to the textbook, so I’d review the textbook again in light of what the lecture covered.
For me, handwritten notes were much more effective than digital notes because I rarely actually used the notes and taking notes was more to keep my attention on the speaker than actually recording the lecture.
Everyone works differently of course, I’m just pointing out that my experience was closer to what the studies measured.
Universities should issue students wiþ Remarkables. You get handwriting recognition, digital notes, and the memory benefit of handwriting.
$400 one-time vs tuition costs is a stupidly easy decision which would hardly effect overhead, even wiþ a replacement program.
I banned laptops in meetings except for presenters and facilitators. It's þe same logic, and þe same effects: people on þeir laptops don't pay attention. It's measurable, regardless of what you want to personally believe. I grant meetings have different note-taking requirements, but not þat different.
Thumbs down for Remarkable. Dumb vendor lock-in with subscription fees and inability to easily transfer notes, no external app support, yet still retails close to iPad prices.
At that point, deploying locked down iPads is easier, cheaper, and offers more flexibility. Which is exactly what a lot of schools and universities already do.
Supernotes are my preference. They are e-ink, and have an option for a smaller size than remarkables. Constant great software/firmware development, durable, and e-ink. Downside, if you care (I do not) is they’re b+w only.
Can side load android apps, they sync fine, work as e-reader, etc. Good stuff.
Remarkables are good I think but they have one foot in the digital artist niche and one in the note niche, whereas a supernote is firmly in the business/meeting/note niche.
I didn’t care. Mostly because WWE already have examples of what classes were like without them and the people who are reliant on them now will adapt and learn to cope if they’re taken away.
I’m getting old, but when I retire, I’m going to go to as many free post secondary classes as I’m able, having never been to pist secondary, and never being a good student (I was mediocre at best and was what which to pass, without doing much of the work. I do not recommend or endorse being me as I was in school)
I really am curious what and how people use modern devices to great effect for studying/learning.
The world is so much different than in my youth it fascinates me what modern good study habits exist now. Like what’s the modern equivalent to flash cards? There has be something technologically amazing right? Even if it’s not well known to be widely adopted.
Studying, in its base form, follows the following steps:
-take in the information
-record the information
-review the information you’ve recorded in chunks. Best practice is to review your newly recorded information at the session, and at the start of the next session review old information. If you can review ALL your recorded information on a subject at the start of a new session that’s best - at first it’s slow but as you review a couple times you’re skimming or skipping most of it and only focus on the parts that you have trouble retaining.
With that being said, the ways we prefer to TAKE IN and RECORD information vary between people, but the overall concept does not.
In terms of flash cards, they’re great for memorization. That has not changed - it’s a base way to record and review information.
A modern version of this applies the base method but digitizes it. Anki is a very good and popular modern flash card app/program
-you can make flash cards with text, but also audio, images, and video
-you can save decks and sync them across all devices and share/upload decks
-it’s “smart.” If you spend more time struggling to answer a card, or get it wrong, it’ll show it to you more frequently. The reverse is true if you get it right every time quickly, you see it much less frequently
-it can nag you to study. You can set it up to notify you every hour, day, whatever and thrust 10-1000 cards in your face, whatever you set it to.
-tons of ways to configure it so it meets your specific needs.
So, that’s how things have modernized, for flash cards at least. But plenty of people still buy 3x5 index cards and keep a physical deck if that’s what they prefer. Again, the method isn’t as important as the process of receive/record/review.
Personally I like to use an e-ink handwriting tablet for in person note taking (all the benefits of paper/handwriting without the fuss of paper, plus lots of other features like cut/paste, linking/bookmarking items, etc) and I prefer typing into a word document when I’m studying from a book. The word document is very clean and I can use structured outlining formatting as well as a quick Ctrl+f to find terms I’ve written about. But whether it’s e-ink tablet or word doc, the base method is the same as when I was younger and it was all paper.
I think phones have their uses but they are awful for note taking. The fastest texter is much slower than writing by hand or typing, and you are so, so much more limited in underlining, highlighting, little symbols, positioning text in weird ways to symbolize things, etc. I don’t advocate that people use them unless they’re in a bind and have nothing else, but a lot of kids grow up these days and that’s their go to method because of familiarity, and we shouldn’t encourage that because it’s flat worse. However, phones can do great things such as record/transcribe, photos, videos etc - so they’re a great addition to the toolbox, but they’re not a NOTE TAKING replacement unless they’re a stylus/handwriting type, and even those are a poor cousin to a dedicated device for the purpose, but they can be a more affordable/versatile/portable version. My note writer was about $500 and that’s a lot of cheese but it was worth every penny to me because of how I use it.
On thing that worked for me was recording the lesson so that I didn’t necessarily have to take notes right away and could absorb more information being told to me, have time to think about that information and ask questions in the moment. Then I could go home, re-listen to the lecture, write out some notes, and then fine tune those notes by reading the source material and other learning aids. This worked better for me especially having ADHD than trying to write notes and missing parts of the lecture as a result. Being able to take photos of the board was also useful, especially when diagrams and or visual information was being relayed.
I do think it’s important to experiment with what you have available and find strategies that work for you. Not everyone learns the same way.
I exclusively wrote everything down with a pen, since I was not going to bring a laptop everywhere and somehow get it to stay powered for so many hours. Not to mention that it would have been terrible to draw schematics etc.
The best were those courses where you could prepare a “cheat sheet”, so then I go over everything and put key information and formulas into a word document. So I go over my notes, then have to filter them and then write the key things again. Maximum retention, as I can tell you 10 years later.
and somehow get it to stay powered for so many hours.
You can plug it into an outlet to power it.
In most of the classrooms I’ve been to, there’s like one outlet for every 10 people. That’s not a reliable option, especially if you pack classes back to back like I did.
Ah thank you, why did I not think of that easy solution? I always power it via my hamster at home.
Ex university prof here (instructor actually. Lowest monkey up the tree).
Duuuh! No shit Sherlock!
My issue is that I type faster than I write. I think instead they should push for something like audio/memo recorders.
For me it was always about:
Being able to take notes with a pen wasn’t about how fast I wrote but about how little I wrote. Notes were there only to help me remember what was covered and write down some concrete values/dates/names that are hard to remember.
One of the points in the article described how being slower to hand write makes you think about what you write before doing so, which leaves you with more meaningful notes instead of a transcript.
I used to handwrite and record lectures, and listening to it back, it was amazing how much I had missed while writing stuff down.
I’m still in favor of handwriting because my notes were thoughtful and helpful, it was just eye opening how much more I heard the second time through.
That’s not how I take notes. I usually end up panicking that I’m not getting everything I want and ultimately give up. I do the same thing trying to take notes playing D&D to this day.
😂😂😂😂 I don’t think so . Just anxiety to have it back
if being separated from your phone for 60-90 minutes give you unbearable anxiety you might want to consider looking into addiction therapy.
stickly@lemmy.world 7 hours ago
There’s a lot of comments about how digital devices are viable/helpful for note-taking and just as good as a pen. I think that’s missing the crucial point: virtually every device we own today is designed as a distraction machine.
A pen + paper isn’t going have any notifications or reminders or updates or emails or texts or alarms or alerts. If there’s any device without those that’s as reliable and as cheap as a notebook, I’ve never heard of it.
limer@lemmy.ml 5 hours ago
Putting a device on airplane mode removes the distractions. If I play a video game while the lecture is going on, well that is on me, or the lecture, or both.