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Comment on System76 tries to talk Colorado down over OS age checks

You can buy computers without an operating system installed on it but most consumers barely understand what a computer is and would think that a computer without an operating system was broken. So there never was much of a market and then Microsoft came along and paid the OEMs to install Windows.

Quite a few website will let you untick the windows 11 licence if you want to go your own way.

Unfortunately the Linux market is so fragmented that your average user is overwhelmed. This is not helped by the Linux community who in a general rule are not particularly accommodating towards novices.

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iglou@programming.dev ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

his is not helped by the Linux community who in a general rule are not particularly accommodating towards novices.

Luckily this trend is shifting! More and more linux distros oriented towards users new to linux, and helpful communities.

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reksas@sopuli.xyz ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
being asshole towards less technically adept people about linux should become something that gets you seriously shamed. that kind of behavior hurts ALL of us by reducing popularity of linux and this reducing developer interest in supporting linux, which also means less drivers for critical components which in turn might mean your pc just cant utilize linux.

Personally, i have issue of internet getting randomly cut off due to too old drivers for my network adapter/chipset/not sure. The motherboard i use is one of the latest there is. This issue has apparently persisted for years now, according to forum posts about it. -> Someone else would just return to windows because this is quite insuffreable even for me. But personally i’m happier with malfunctioning linux system than correctly working windows.

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SocialMediaRefugee@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

Unfortunately the Linux market is so fragmented that your average user is overwhelmed. This is not helped by the Linux community who in a general rule are not particularly accommodating towards novices.

Omg yes. I’m considering going to linux at home for my next system but when I look at my options I can look at 10 sources and get 10 different recommendations. There are a million flavors of linux now. Every time I look into the subject I see a new flavor has been released. I also don’t want to get comfortable with one version only to find out it isn’t supported or updated a few years from now and have to switch. My goal is to use it, not to be a sys admin in my spare time.

I’m tech savvier than most people so even talking about linux to the avg person is like talking about nuclear physics. Usually when I read a story about, say, someone’s mom using it it is because some very skilled linux fan installed and set it up for them.

You get beaten up for just bringing these points up.

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SocialMediaRefugee@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
Apple IIs had the OS built into the ROMs.

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- ThomasWilliams@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  Apple DOS was on a disk. There wasn’t really any OS, you operated the computer through the BASIC interpreter.
  
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  - SocialMediaRefugee@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    Applesoft was in ROM. The DOS was only for the disk controller. Without a disk drive I could still work the memory map, execute code, calls to locations, speaker calls, graphics control, load off of cassette, etc.
    
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- echodot@feddit.uk ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  Yeah I probably wouldn’t recommend getting an Apple II
  
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mghackerlady@leminal.space ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
Where! Dell and Lenovo limit their linux options to a handful of laptops and their workstations, HP limits their linux options to a couple of their workstations, acer only provides windows, asus also only provides windows but is mainly a parts manufacturer so you could technically say you can buy an asus with no operating system. None of these provide a no operating system option (with the exception of maybe a few HP workstations that can be bought “linux ready”, but they don’t clarify what that means), requiring you to choose ubuntu and maybe RHEL on the super high end stuff. The only manufacturer I can think of with a definitive “No thanks, I’ll bring my own” esque-option is Framework, but only on their kits and not their pre-assembled models

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Samskara@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
I like buying hardware, that I know is supported by an operating system. Although that doesn’t always have a good result either. I bought a small Linux netbook with an ARM chip, that never received a kernel update because of incompatible drivers.

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utopiah@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

You can buy computers without an operating system installed on it

AFAIR that hasn’t been the case in most places for a while precisely because Microsoft made partnerships with OEMs to avoid that situation.

I believe new laws were added, e.g. in Europe, but I would be curious were this was the case. In fact I remember the opposite, namely that most computers one would buy always came with an OS, Windows for PC and MacOS for Apple computers. Even computers that one would buy in part that would be assembled for them from non OEM would also have the options to have an OS. In fact I’d be curious about example of fully assemble PCs, not just parts, that could be purchased without an OS before the law in the places where its the case now, would prove an OS-free option. Can you please share examples?

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- echodot@feddit.uk ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
  The last place I saw it as an option was on the framework website.
  
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  - utopiah@lemmy.world ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago
    Right but Framework is basically new, founded just in 2020. Also I believe most people who go on their website is precisely because of this kind of options. I don’t think, sadly, they are representative of the broader market.
    
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