Comment on BYD Reveals the ‘World’s Longest-Range EV’ as American Auto Industry Struggles to Keep Pace
xenomor@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
It’s amusing to me that the same folks to deride Chinese car manufacturers because they are somehow cheating by getting support from the government are the same people demanding that the US government artificially protect the US car industry by blocking Chinese imports. The point being that neither side actually objects to government participation in the market. But, one side uses it to make better products and service consumers, and the other does it to protect worse products from market forces.
People CONSTANTLY harp on Chinese government support of the EV industry.
Name one ICE manufacturer not taking state and federal money. Detroit took $80B in handouts after 2008. That’s far more than the Chinese government has spent, and the largest investor in Chinese industry, by far, has been Apple Computers.
So China ended up with a new industry taking the world stage. What did we get from Detroit? Bloated low tech shit boxes that barely make it past warranty.
The UK was constantly bribing car makers to stay, and most of them still fucked off.
Australia just gave up and told GM and Ford to go it alone. The fact that they shut it all down in 2017 says there was no business plan without government subsidies.
Well there is a plan, it’s just “make them in countries where you can still have slaves”.
What did we get from Detroit? Bloated low tech shit boxes that barely make it past warranty.
Don’t forget the bailouts:
Better products? What about geopolitical interests? If China doesn’t need oil then they don’t have to care if the strait of Hormuz is open or closed.
It’s a nice added benefit that they are better for the air, quieter and have more cargo space.
reev@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
“A free market is self regulating” until someone makes a better product for less money, I guess.
Quazatron@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
We tasted some of that self regulating ‘free market’ a while ago. Banks were having huge profits from the housing bubble until the subprime crisis hit, banks went into default, and the losses were picked up by public money.
My profit. Our losses.
msage@programming.dev 2 weeks ago
My profit. Your losses.
CosmoNova@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
The point both of you deliberately overlook is that China is not participating in a free market anyway. They never played by those rules so there‘s no point in treating them the same way as anyone who does. There is a lot of hypocrisy to be found in politics and economics around the world and China itself is a prime example of that. But a measure to defend yourself from an obvious case of economic warfare is the most understandable thing in history. Your criticism is misplaced and irrational. I mean do you seriously think a monopoly is desirable?
Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
We’ve had of ecocomic warfare already. It was just fine for US companies to hollow out domestic manufacturing so China could build the manufacturing infrastructure that could have been built in the US.
But now that a Chinese company is building things that undercut a US company, you want protections for US billionaires that weren’t afforded to US workers.
CosmoNova@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Are you ignoring the whole subsidies thing on purpose? This is not BYD attacking Tesla. This is the Chinese government attacking western industries.
CmdrShepard49@sh.itjust.works 2 weeks ago
American companies only make up a small portion of the US auto industry.
ParlimentOfDoom@piefed.zip 2 weeks ago
There no such thing as a free market. It’s a constant pull between monopolistic forces and government restriction.
SparroHawc@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
And there never will be. Not so long as it is possible to hide information from the consumer, and any sort of barrier to entry exists for market competition to spring up.
daychilde@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Ideally, although the US is trying our best for monopolies…
Damage@feddit.it 2 weeks ago
China defends its interests and follows what rules it deems advantageous. Just like everyone else does. It may upset you but they’re just better at playing this game than most countries nowadays.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
Because they don’t have a class of politicians and billionaires stuffing their pockets.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
When has the US ever participated in a free market?
Man…interweb really drinks that anti-China koolaid.
monkeyjoe@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
Decades of propaganda works. Centuries of racism helps as well.
AA5B@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
I don’t think anyone is denying Chinese aggressive intent here, just our response. Give us a response where we can get onboard, a response that is more legitimate than their approach, and wecan all be mad at China.
Or think of it this way. We all agree on all the ways China are the bad guys, but our behavior is making them look like the good guys. wtf are we doing?
bitjunkie@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
ftfy
Legitimate_lake@lemmy.world 2 weeks ago
After that it’s “unfair competition” and the state has to intervene
yabbadabaddon@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
We should be critical of our manufacturers but we should also not forget China is basically getting its R&D for free by stealing tech from everybody (all do, but some more than others).
Riverside@reddthat.com 2 weeks ago
Bullshit. China is the pioneer in battery technology for years now.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 2 weeks ago
Oh shut up. CATL is doing more R&D in batteries than the rest of the world combined.
yabbadabaddon@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
Yours such a joy to interact with, piss tank.
dogzilla@masto.deluma.biz 2 weeks ago
@yabbadabaddon @technology Unfortunately this is no longer the case. While China 10-20 years ago definitely bootstrapped itself with corporate espionage and reverse engineering, so did every country including the United States. The China of today produces its own fundamental research at a rate comparable to the US, and given the structural failures of our educational system, will exceed the US over the next 5 years.
Not recognizing that and making excuses is the sign of a country in decline.
yabbadabaddon@lemmy.zip 2 weeks ago
A company in Europe has to respect patents. Same for a company in the USA. Not a company in China. Of course this has an impact. Failing to grasp this is at best naive at worst purposefully misleading.