Comment on We live in a post scarcity information society and we still haven't moved on from capitalism.

• Deceptichum@kbin.social ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Because you can’t eat ideas.

  We can have all the free information in the world, the people who control the bare necessities still control the bare necessities and they can use that to keep people down and divided.

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  • Th4tGuyII@kbin.social ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Exactly. Information is a luxury - you could go your entire life without learning even a shred of information, but you'd still need to eat.

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• aesc@lemmy.sdf.org ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  We don’t just use capitalism to distribute information. There are free libraries all over the U.S. It’s possible to learn most of what knowledge-workers need to know for free. Then you can seek employment for using what you know and not your physical labor.

  But also, economists consider humans to have infinite wants. Certainly society as a whole has infinite wants. So no matter what resources we extract from the environment, society always wants more, which creates scarcity, which creates markets, which, in a free society, creates capitalism.

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  • Eldritch@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Markets and currency have existed for thousands of years. Capitalism has existed for barely more than 200 years. Markets don’t create capitalism. However capitalism destroys markets.

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    • aesc@lemmy.sdf.org ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Unregulated agriculture also destroys land. Just because something has negative effects over long-term unregulated use doesn’t mean it should be abolished despite the positive effects. Just because a system is older than another doesn’t mean it’s superior. Or do you yearn for serfdom?

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      • Eldritch@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        What positive effects has it had?

        The only reason I pointed out the age is that markets and currency often are, and were being confused/conflated with capitalism.

        I actually advocate for a system 100 years newer than capitalism. And even then I push for a version of it that has been modernized to fit current realities.

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  • Cowbee@lemmy.ml ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    Markets aren’t Capitalism. You can have non-Capitalist markets, such as ones made up of Worker Co-ops.

    You can have a market-based economy without exploitation a la Capitalism.

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    • aesc@lemmy.sdf.org ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

      Fine. Factories are capital. If you want manufactured goods and the freedom to get a job you want more than you want to work in a factory then you want capitalism.

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      • Eldritch@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        Capitalism keeps people from the jobs they want. Literally. If the job you want can’t meet your basic needs. Capitalism falsely posits that it’s because the job has no value. Rather than the value of it not being generally understood or valued by others.

        Capitalism is still good at making menial valueless work to under pay you for however.

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      • Cowbee@lemmy.ml ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

        No.

        All tools are Capital. If Workers collectively share ownership of industry, there is a free flow of labor to where you wish to apply it. Are you under the mistaken impression that Socialism is when someone picks where you can work? You sure you aren’t talking about Capitalism?

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• DessertStorms@kbin.social ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  yet we still use the same capitalist system to distribute that information.

  ..they posted, on the fediverse.. 🙄

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• Carighan@lemmy.world ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  Some people

  Who?

  if we lived in a post-scarcity society we wouldn’t have a need for capitalism anymore

  there is an aspect of our lives that is already post-scarcity

  To be equivalent in your observation, wouldn’t it be enough if one aspect of your live wasn’t based on capitalism any more? Is there such an aspect?

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• fine_sandy_bottom@discuss.tchncs.de ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

  I have 3kg of cheese in the fridge but no bread.

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  • Deceptichum@kbin.social ⁨11⁩ ⁨months⁩ ago

    go conquer some.

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