Free Palestine from the river to the sea. 🇵🇸🇵🇸
Debunking : “From the river to the sea” is a call to genocide.
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apfelwoiSchoppen@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Streisand Effect
Free Palestine from the river to the sea.
Sauvandu59@lemmy.my.id 6 months ago
LaLiLuLuCo@lemmy.ca 6 months ago
Debunking that Blog is really easy.
Literally 75% of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza choose it as the explicit genocide option on a survey that Includes one state for two people as an option. This is a poll done by a Palestinian university in the west bank, claiming its Israeli propaganda would be pretty stupid. All the US congress did was assert to the public what the meaning is to a super majority of Palestinians in Palestine. The diaspora pushing a different narrative never speaks up when the crowds chant the Arabic version that ends in “Palestine will be Arab” (or “Palestine is Arab”).
KittyCat@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Fuck off with that, its just as genocidal as the zionests.
LaLiLuLuCo@lemmy.ca 6 months ago
For all the people still in denial, that is a genocide slogan.
All you need to do is listen to actual Palestinians in Palestine instead of anonymous blogs.
Like a survey conducted by Palestine’s Birzeit University’s Arab World for Research & Development (AWRAD)
Literally 75% of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza choose it as the explicit genocide option on a survey that Includes one state for two people as an option. This is a poll done by a Palestinian university in the west bank after the start of the war, claiming its Israeli propaganda would be pretty stupid. All the US congress did was assert to the public what the meaning is to a super majority of Palestinians in Palestine. The diaspora pushing a different narrative never speaks up when the crowds chant the Arabic version that ends in “Palestine will be Arab” (or “Palestine is Arab”).
snek@lemmy.world 6 months ago
britishteadrinker@feddit.uk 6 months ago
No calls for genocide please.
apfelwoiSchoppen@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Yeah I agree, Israel should stop actually committing genocide.
britishteadrinker@feddit.uk 6 months ago
That wasn’t what I meant, and you knew it. Well done!
apfelwoiSchoppen@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Yeah, actual facts. Simply tying to stick to actual genocide instead of illusory projected genocide.
iopq@lemmy.world 6 months ago
What I don’t understand, as someone who doesn’t support Hamas or Netanyahu, is why you would chant that.
Like, where would Jews go? Is that actually a real solution? Only super old people actually came to Israel from another country, most of the Israelis don’t know any other home
Saxoboneless@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Well for one, Jews and specifically Israelis don’t have to go anywhere for Palestine and Palestinians to be free?
Like the slogan just does not at all necessarily imply what you’re imagining (or what the US congress claims) it does. That slogan’s been around longer than Hamas.
NIB@lemmy.world 6 months ago
The slogan is being used by far right israelis too. And it is implicitly genocidal for both sides. Israel is here to stay and so is Palestine. Both sides need to accept this so we can move towards the next goal, defining which lands go to which side.
Israel needs to be charitable and give back land, remove settlers, etc. And in response Palestine needs to control its people and guarantee the safety of Israel.
A lot of Israel’s landgrab is because of security concerns or at least thats Israel’s excuse. If Palestine can remove that excuse by providing security, things can become a lot simpler.
The problem is that Palestine does not exist as a country with a unified government, partly because of Israel(supported hamas, etc), so Israel continues having legitimate security concerns.
prole@sh.itjust.works 6 months ago
To be fair, we do say the same thing about “all lives matter.” An objectively true statement that can border on hate speech depending on context
iain@feddit.nl 6 months ago
Exactly, it’s the whole “black lives matter” vs “all lives matter” thing all over again.
iopq@lemmy.world 6 months ago
It’s not the free part I have an issue with, it’s the geography
iopq@lemmy.world 6 months ago
We saw how that played out in the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict. After it was “freed” by Azerbaijan, 100,000 people were displaced. Sure, they didn’t have to go, but some people don’t like living under a dictatorship.
Gaza didn’t have an election since 2006
LaLiLuLuCo@lemmy.ca 6 months ago
Literally 75% of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza choose it as the explicit genocide option on a survey that Includes one state for two people as an option. This is a poll done by a Palestinian university in the west bank, claiming its Israeli propaganda would be pretty stupid.
awrad.org/…/Public Opinion Poll - Gaza War 2023 -…
Fitik@fedia.io 6 months ago
You know the original slogan in Arabic? What slogan it's translation of?
min al-mayyeh lil-mayyeh / Filasṭīn ʿarabiyyeh (من المياه للمياه / فلسطين عربية 'from the water to the water / Palestine [is] Arab')
OtakuAltair@lemm.ee 6 months ago
Jesus christ, Israel is literally a British colony. Getting Jews out of Europe was literally what the Nazis wanted.
Zionism isn’t some centuries old thing; it’s based in British colonization tactics. It started in full force only around 70 years ago to serve British military interests in the region.
The companies made are literally called “Colonization Commission” and ‘the Jewish Colonial Trust’
People are being displaced and forced out of their homes by settlers and military right now. Fuck colonizers.
iopq@lemmy.world 6 months ago
When Jews lived there in period of Judah and Israel, was that also European colonization?
Let’s not forget that Muslims conquered this region, it wasn’t magically peacefully obtained. Was this not colonialism?
rambaroo@lemmy.world 6 months ago
You are talking about shit that happened 1400 years ago. Such a flimsy and ridiculous excuse for expelling millions of Palestinians from their homes. The entitlement and religious extremism is incredible
OtakuAltair@lemm.ee 6 months ago
Reactionary thinking like this is what lets colonizers and settlers continue to do what they’re doing even in the modern day. A war 1400 years ago does not justify colonizing and slaughtering natives right now. Surely you can see how fucked up that is?
Theodor Herzl, founder of Zionism, knew this, and did not mince his words. He was simply racist, and saw it as bringing ‘civilization’ to barbarians as did the rest of Europe when they were colonizing and enslaving Africa and Asia:
That is exactly what’s happening right now. All for European and US military and economic interests in the region.
voodooattack@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Oh, so given your opinion, can African Americans or Chinese Americans return to their respective continents, occupy an entire country by displacing its current population, and claim it as their ancestral land? How delusional.
And since when is “the period of Judah” an accurate historical reference point?
Jonna@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Before the Zionist movement, Palestine was ruled first by the Ottomans and then the British. Prior to Zionism, the land held Christians (the latest bombardment destroyed the 3rd oldest Christian Church in the world), Muslims, and Jews. In fact the early Palestinian national movement considered Jewish Palestinians to be Palestinian and their demands them full rights in a secular state of Palestine.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Jews
Genetics, if that matters, shows that the pre-zionist natives of Palestine are closely related to European (Sepahrdic and Ashkenazi) Jews. Basically some people left centuries ago, but some people stayed.
Now since 1948 those that left want to kick out those that stayed, or kill them if they don’t leave.
sugartits@lemmy.world 6 months ago
Many who chant it don’t even know what river or sea they are talking about without looking it up.
And they don’t care what happens to the Jews. It’s a racist chant which is basically supporting genocide.
It’s an idiotic phrase that only morons and racists would repeat. It’s unrealistic and doesn’t solve a damn thing. But of course the herd will repeat the catchy phrase because they have an excuse to be openly racist but still have a way of justifying it.
There. I said it.
And no, before these same idiots say otherwise: I am not happy with how Israel or the IDF is handling the current situation or the situation before October. Nor am I a supporter of hamas and their actions in early October; Israel just had their own 9/11, so of course they are going to react miltaryary, of course they fucking are, like every country on the planet would.
This whole thing is like watching two unlikeable assholes having a boxing match. It’s basically boogie2899 Vs wingsofredemption but with a lot more death and destruction, so it’s not funny.
rambaroo@lemmy.world 6 months ago
“Of course they’re going to bomb refugee camps and schools, of fucking course they are” Jesus Christ just stfu already with the bullshit excuses
sugartits@lemmy.world 6 months ago
I’m not making excuses. Try reading my comment again and thinking for a moment.
You can do it! I believe in you!
avater@lemmy.world 6 months ago
take my upvote good sir
SulaymanF@lemmy.world 6 months ago
It means that Palestinians living in West Bank and Gaza should be free from Israeli oppression and Palestinians living in Israel should be free from apartheid. It doesn’t mean kicking people out.
Buelldozer@lemmy.today 6 months ago
That isn’t what it means. You are trying to RetCon history to align with present day values. Stop it.
LaLiLuLuCo@lemmy.ca 6 months ago
Literally 75% of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza choose it as the explicit genocide option on a survey that Includes one state for two people as an option.
awrad.org/…/Public Opinion Poll - Gaza War 2023 -…
The gas lighting is intense.
Thorny_Insight@lemm.ee 6 months ago
It’s a thought terminating clishe. It’s easy to avoid complex issues if you can just repeat a quick little chant to get out of critical thinking.
PatFussy@lemm.ee 6 months ago
They chant that because nobody who says that cares about what the outcome is. The Palestinians have been chanting this slogan for many years since the PLO times. The call was to unite the people to show unity between the people of gaza to west bank. However, when Hamas took power, the chant turned into something antisemitic. So you will hear both sides now, unite the people and wishes for terror.
idiocracy@lemmy.zip 6 months ago
no. it means all jews should b expelled, if not dead.
OtakuAltair@lemm.ee 6 months ago
Zionists*
Yes, all Zionists should be expelled, or dead.
SlikPikker@lemmy.ca 6 months ago
Israel can’t and shouldn’t exist in the future.
An ethnic religious state can never be free.
iopq@lemmy.world 6 months ago
But it will exists, so maybe try to work in thay framework for a solution