Comment on Easy-to-use solar panels are coming, but utilities are trying to delay them

• eleitl@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  It is a commercial product, connected to the grid via a standard schuko plug, sold in Germany. It has to be compliant with the local law to be sold legally.

  It all shouldn’t be so difficult to understand.

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  • TheEighthDoctor@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    It is a commercial product, connected to the grid via a standard schuko plug, sold in Germany.

    Or you buy it in Aliexpress/Temu and it will have whatever it will have, no policeman is going to come check if the panel they see from the street has a stamp or not.

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    • eleitl@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      But if your house burns down because of your unlicensed configuration, the insurance won’t pay, and if people got hurt there will be a criminal investigation.

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      • TheEighthDoctor@lemmy.zip ⁨2⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        And this still results in innocent third parties being hurt

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  • artyom@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    It has to be compliant with the local law to be sold legally.

    So you can’t buy raw solar panels or inverters in Germany?

    It all shouldn’t be so difficult to understand.

    It’s not, which is why I’m not sure why you’re struggling.

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    • ExcessShiv@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      So you can’t buy raw solar panels or inverters in Germany?

      Sure you can. Solar panels will be fried by grid voltage more or less immediately if you connect them directly to a wall socket and become useless.

      You cannot buy a PV inverter in Germany (entire EU really) that doesn’t automatically shut off if it doesn’t detect a frequency to sync against from it’s AC side, unless it can run off-grid in which case it has to disble the grid connection within the same 20ms.

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      • artyom@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        You cannot buy a PV inverter in Germany (entire EU really) that doesn’t automatically shut off if it doesn’t detect a frequency to sync against from it’s AC side, unless it can run off-grid in which case it has to disble the grid connection within the same 20ms.

        So you can’t buy a grid-connected inverter with off-grid capabilities? Because the inverter has no way to tell the difference between the grid being off, and being off-grid.

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    • eleitl@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      Of course you can buy whatever you like, and whatever is being sold has to be compliant with local legal requirements.

      If you buy illegal stuff and cause problems, you will have problems with your insurance and potentially, legal ones.

      And that’s all I’m going to say on the matter. HAND.

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      • artyom@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        There’s no way to prevent people from connecting perfectly legal equipment in an illegal manner, where otherwise there would be.

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• ywuduyu@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  You are only allowed to dell inverters improved by VDE

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  • artyom@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    Again I ask, if there is no permit, how will the utilities know you are in compliance with this law?

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    • eleitl@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      You are required to notify your utilities that you’ll be operating a direct plugged small solar PV installation, that’s it. They can’t forbid you from doing this.

      The utilities don’t monitor compliance, the manufacturer is.

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      • artyom@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        So it sounds like you’re saying there is no way? And therein lies the problem.

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• captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

  In the United States that would be UL Certification.

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  • artyom@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

    UL is not a license. It’s a certification. And you forgot the second question.

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    • Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

      UL certification is a requirement for an electric or electronic product to be licensed for sale to consumers in the US. This is enforced on US manufacturers of a product and on importers.

      Whilst people buying something from AliExpress for personal use and importing it themselves don’t have to obbey such requirements, those importing them or making them for sale in the US do.

      The CE mark does the same thing in the EU.

      No idea if in the US there are further licensing requirements for things to be connected to the grid that would close the importing for personal use loophole.

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      • artyom@piefed.social ⁨3⁩ ⁨weeks⁩ ago

        UL certification is a requirement for an electric or electronic product to be licensed for sale to consumers in the US.

        That is completely incorrect. I own a ton of equipment that is not UL listed.

        Further, UL listed equipment is not prevented from backfeeding to the grid, and in fact most of it is intended for precisely that.

        No idea if in the US there are further licensing requirements for things to be connected to the grid that would close the importing for personal use loophole.

        There aren’t.

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