Comment on Why Americans Can’t Buy the World’s Best Electric Car
CameronDev@programming.dev 3 days ago
I am pretty sure there is some financial fuckery going on with BYD. My parents own two, and they are very nice, but way under priced compared to every other EV manufacturer.
Can’t prove anything of course, but there is something odd going on when everyone else is 20-30k more expensive.
Hard to feel sorry for GM though, they suckled at our governments (Australia) teet for decades before giving up and leaving entirely. At least if BYD is being propped up we are at least getting good cheap cars from it.
Brazil shuts BYD factory site over ‘slavery’ conditions
From 2016 and still true today:
Chinese Government Subsidies Play Major Part In Electric Car Maker BYD’s Rise
Yeah, subsidies and other benefits from governments exist but China is going all in.
My only point of confusion is that a 20k loss on every car is insane. I’m guessing its a bit of BYD is subsidised somewhat, and everyone else is price gouging somewhat. No idea the ratio.
Also odd that other Chinese brands (really only tried MG) dont seem to have the same high quality, high pricing that suggests the same level of crazy subsidies.
Honestly, there is just so much fuckery going I just have no idea what is what.
Rivian is losing about $30k per vehicle, but with much lower production numbers.
Thats crazy. Are those public numbers from rivian?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ttu55nEtC6o - How BYD overtook Tesla?
China subsidises industries it wants to dominate in, allowing them to sell for less than cost. It’s why the EU also tariffs Chinese cars.
Also for anything the big 3 make in the US, I believe they use union labor? Not sure if they did for Aussie market cars.
Ulrich@feddit.org 3 days ago
The financial fuckery is that they’re very heavily subsidized by the CCP. It’s not sustainable.
einkorn@feddit.org 3 days ago
I’d argue it is.
Just look how Amazon got where it is now: Sell way under market price, till local competition closed shop, then squeeze.
frezik@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 days ago
It’s unsustainable to keep prices lower than costs. The Amazon example didn’t have low prices forever.
einkorn@feddit.org 2 days ago
Yes, I know. That’s why BYD is going to
then squeezethe customers once they are locked in.Gigasser@lemmy.world 2 days ago
It might just be that, since BYD is serving such a large domestic market/population, that allows them to have cheaper cars? Something something, economies of scale. I’m no expert though.
einkorn@feddit.org 1 day ago
There is a limit to that effect, though. And most observers agree that the state is subsidizing heavily.
CameronDev@programming.dev 2 days ago
I think your muddying sustainable and successful. It definitely can be successful, but its not sustainable.
einkorn@feddit.org 2 days ago
feddit.org/comment/7714367
jaxxed@lemmy.ml 2 days ago
BYD is already facing scrutiny for running Evergrande like accounting, and a lot of political pressures from other Chinese manufacturers. The risk is that they collapse like Evergrande, and that they drag public debt into it. The CCP might prop them up, so it light be safe. A car is different from a book, because you need lifetime service for it. If they go under, you might lose access to parts.
Ulrich@feddit.org 2 days ago
You forgot the part where they raised prices on everything.
einkorn@feddit.org 2 days ago
feddit.org/comment/7714367
Greyghoster@aussie.zone 2 days ago
While they are subsidised, the Chinese are really good at low cost manufacturing. It’s not the cheap labour anymore but factory automation and robotics. They really outclass anyone else.
Ulrich@feddit.org 2 days ago
They’re not “good” at it, they just have no minimum wage and no semblance of annoying things like worker protections to be concerned with.
wildbus8979@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
That’s just patently false. en.wikipedia.org/…/All-China_Federation_of_Trade_…
Saurok@lemmy.ml 1 day ago
China doesn’t have a national minimum wage, but minimum wage is delegated to the local level there and definitely exists in every single province. Just echoing what the other user said, literally everything you said here is easily disprovable. www.china-briefing.com/news/minimum-wages-China/
Greyghoster@aussie.zone 1 day ago
They actually have a problem with workers or the lack of them and they have invested heavily in robotics. They aren’t the China of the 70s and 90s. It’s really something that we need to face up to if we want to compete but our political class isn’t really ready for that sort of reality. Years behind because of smugness.