we want an immediate end to the war. in what way does wanting an end to the death make us comparable with the alt-right?
Comment on Suddenly seeing more hexbear posts. Did we re-federate with them?
NuPNuA@lemm.ee 1 year agoYou guys and the MAGA types seem to have very similar views on the Russia/Ukraine situation at the moment.
silent_water@hexbear.net 1 year ago
MonkCanatella@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
How is being pro russia and wanting war to end in any way compatible though? They invaded Ukraine. They literally started a war. That’s a pretty disgusting deflection tbh
420LetPobedy@hexbear.net 1 year ago
NATO/US started the war when the couped the democratically elected Ukrainian government in 2014, and when the US installed regime started bombing civilians in the Donbass
MonkCanatella@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Oh so Russia is just saving Ukrainians from US imperialism by bombing them and committing war crimes. Thank god for our wonderful leader putin o7
Venus@hexbear.net 1 year ago
Russia started a war. Ukraine has two choices. Surrender and end the bloodshed, or fight tooth and nail and pour more innocent people into the meat grinder and then surrender. There is not a third option. Obviously they should choose the former.
Zirconium@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Calling for an immediate end to the war is dishonest and supports Russia
somename@hexbear.net 1 year ago
We’re just not keeping our head in the sand here. Ukraine is not taking back Crimea, or even the Donbas. The counteroffensive failed horribly. Cheering for more bloodshed isn’t going to make a better outcome in the end.
winterayars@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Russia could make that happen, you know. They could pull their forces out. Right now, that would end the conflict.
somename@hexbear.net 1 year ago
Do you think we’re in charge of the Russian military? The war is going to end eventually one way or another. We might as well push for the path that preserves Ukrainian lives.
winterayars@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
Are we in charge of the Ukrainian military? Not that it really matters, but still.
Russia can unilaterally end the conflict. Ukraine cannot (yet). Calling on Ukrainians to surrender while they still want to defend themselves is cowardice. I would rather support their continued struggle.
RedDawn@hexbear.net 1 year ago
Damn too bad they’re not going to do that, so what should we do about that? We support a negotiated settlement to the conflict in order to achieve peace, you support marching every single Ukrainian person into a meat grinder to die. Which of is more right wing?
winterayars@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
This isn’t about us. What “we” should do is to support and show solidarity with the side being attacked by an imperialist, dictatorial state and help them defend themselves.
When the Finnish were defending themselves in the Winter War it would not have been just to say “they should just surrender to save their lives”. The Finns did eventually surrender, but only after they had stomped the Soviet army all across Finland. They continued fighting not to die but so that they could live.
The Ukrainians are fighting now not to die but so that they can live in (relative) freedom.
Again, this “we should just capitulate to whatever warmongers want” stuff is shameful and cowardly, doubly so for people on the Left.
yuri@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
imagine dying on the “war is bad” hill. i can agree on that point, and i don’t even need to politically align myself with real shitters and make a fool of myself in pseudo-public to do it!
PandaBearGreen@hexbear.net 1 year ago
imagine not thinking war is bad. imagine believing American propaganda given its track record.
ReadFanon@hexbear.net 1 year ago
Bro, this war is totally different to every other war, bro!
Trust me, bro! I know we got duped into supporting:
The Korean War
The Vietnam War
The war in Iraq
The other war in Iraq
The war in Afghanistan
The war in the Philippines
The war in Guatemala
The war on Cuba
The war in Laos
The war in Cambodia
The war in Somalia
The war in Yemen
The war in Libya
The war in Grenada
The war in Yugoslavia
…but this time it’s an existential threat!! Trust me, bro!
hexi@hexbear.net 1 year ago
I think Belarus should annex both countries.
Catradora_Stalinism@hexbear.net 1 year ago
I find these terms agreeable
MemesAreTheory@hexbear.net 1 year ago
lukashenko-tired Chad
Gelamzer@hexbear.net 1 year ago
And you guys and MAGA have similar views on China
AntiOutsideAktion@hexbear.net 1 year ago
“Very” implies you’ve drilled down beyond the very first superficial similarity.
Please offer two things in which we have in common since you’re clearly not just talking out of your ass.
Doubledee@hexbear.net 1 year ago
Could you be more specific?
I think, for example, that most alt-right types oppose the war either because of chauvinistic beliefs about American boys and American blood and treasure being spent on foreigners, or because they would like to work together with Russia to counter China and think a war with them hurts the white struggle against the eastern hordes. No one on hexbear would defend either of those positions.
It needs to be more specific than “both of you are against continuing the war.” Just like it wouldn’t be fair for me to accuse you of being alt- right because you and them both agree that there weren’t WMDs in Iraq and that that invasion was sold on false pretenses. You might both technically agree but it would be missing the point.
Estiar@sh.itjust.works 1 year ago
It’s theories about how spheres of influence work, that Russia has a right to take over Ukraine, or at least override it politically. Very much similar to Kissinger’s Great power politics in the days of the USSR. It’s somewhat different than the Russian right which is their divine right to Empire, over the Ukrainians and the Poles and Slavic countries in general. The ideologues Ivan Ilyin and Karl Schmidt influence that part. But notably, both parts believe that there’s a place that Russia must dominate in Europe, and that other great powers must not interfere there. Leftists also are influenced by these theories, especially when they remember the reaches of the Iron Curtain far into Central Europe. The USSR had a history of intervening into the politics of its satellite states. Notably in Hungary when there were democratic protests, they sent in tanks to quell the uprising. This theory echoes in 2014 when the Ukrainians changed their government, and Russia invades and annexes Crimea. Many on the far left and far right see the massive protests as creeping American influence that does not belong in the region. They fear NATO expansion as it is a threat to Russia; In the west it’s Russia itself, and in Russia, it’s Russian greatness in Empire.
Doubledee@hexbear.net 1 year ago
I’m sorry, I’m not sure I understand. Liberals don’t believe that countries exert influence on other countries around them? You think Joe Biden objects to the concept of spheres of influence? You brought up Kissinger, you don’t think US foreign policy is operating under the logic of realpolitik? I’m not sure what the alternative is to believing that countries act to pursue their interests in other countries. That just sounds like a description of the concept of foreign policy.
RedDawn@hexbear.net 1 year ago
You’re talking about the fascist uprising where they went around marking the houses of Jews and Communists for extermination, like only a decade after the Soviets saved the world from Hitler?