Comment on Ukraine isn’t invited to its own peace talks. History is full of such examples – and the results are devastating

• Opinionhaver@feddit.uk ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  What’s the alternative here?

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  • sleep_deprived@lemmy.dbzer0.com ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    The alternative is making Russia getting/keeping the territory a worse option than leaving Ukraine the hell alone. I agree that the unfortunate reality is that Putin will never - can never - give up the war willingly without concessions, but the flip side to that is they’ll be back for more sooner or later. We have to make the war such a bad option for Russia that Putin is deposed, whether by his oligarchs or by the Russian people. It’s a difficult fight, but it’s one we’ve fought before on 3 fronts in WWII. The difference, this time, being nukes exist and that understandably makes a lot of people nervous - but again, expansionists never stop. The confrontation has to come at some point unless we want all-out war in Europe.

    I’m far removed from the situation, so my opinion isn’t worth much on this part, but I think realistically maybe there could be some concessions around Crimea for a peace deal - sort of a status quo ante or similar - but Russia would have to make some concessions in turn for Ukraine to agree (NATO peacekeeping forces in Ukraine? Still a no-go for Putin though…). Ceding Ukranian territorial losses from the current war, though, will only put off the eventual confrontation, and hurt the West in the meantime.

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    • lorty@lemmy.ml ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      There’s nothing that can be done, Russia is winning on the battlefield. At this point negotiating suits Ukraine, not the other way around.

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      • Glitterbomb@lemmy.world ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        Buying thousands of North Koreans with zero combat experience to attempt to take back land you lost in an invasion that you started… is that what winning looks like?

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      • Cethin@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        They’re holding more dirt, but taking more losses while they’re economy is not doing so great. If that’s what winning looks like then I wouldn’t want to be a winner.

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    • ghost_of_faso3@lemmygrad.ml ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      I’m far removed from the situation, so my opinion isn’t worth much on this part, but I think realistically maybe there could be some concessions around Crimea for a peace deal

      If your opinion isnt worth shit dont share it, the notion that Russia will give up any territory, never mind territory it held before the invasion is counter to the reality where the entire ukraine front is currently collapsing and Zelensky isnt even being considered in peace talks because he has no position of strength due to insane losses.

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      • shani66@ani.social ⁨4⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

        You realize your opinion isn’t worth shit either, yeah?

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    • pinball_wizard@lemmy.zip ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

      We have to make the war such a bad option for Russia that Putin is deposed,

      You’re right and it might be humanity’s only chance at survival. In the post nuclear era, we must either eradicate all warmongering, or it will likely kill every single one of us.

      If Putin wins, no one else can.

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  • diablexical@lemm.ee ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

    Conquered territories including Kursk?

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• superkret@feddit.org ⁨3⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  It worked for Finland (after the Winter War).

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