It’s so annoying to see in literally every thread about windows
Comment on What I learned from 3 years of running Windows 11 on “unsupported” PCs
Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
ITT: People who talk about Linux (as if that was the subject) because they just can’t accept that some people actually need to use Windows and might find articles like this one useful.
Skipcast@lemmy.world 2 days ago
parpol@programming.dev 2 days ago
Who needs Windows? You need to use better applications. And if work requires Windows, this article still doesn’t apply because it is the company’s responsibility, not yours, and running on an unsupported machine is a security risk.
halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 2 days ago
Because of course there’s absolutely no program a regular person outside of work could possibly need Windows for. None at all. Not a single application. Not a single game. Not a single piece of hardware they’re using (like many laptops with hardware needing specific drivers that don’t exist for linux).
Nope, absolutely nothing a regular user could have a need for Windows.
friend_of_satan@lemmy.world 2 days ago
OWC instructions for updating their firmware on macOS are literally “install parallels. Install windows. Run the firmware updater.”
parpol@programming.dev 2 days ago
I didn’t say all applications work. I said use better ones.
As for hardware, less computers support win11 than Linux. You can run Linux on 40 year old computers, and on brand new computers.
Ans this article is literally about bypassing the restrictions that were put in place to protect users with CPUs that have the specte and meltdown vulnerabilities. You’re safer on win10 even after they stop supporting it than win11.
halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 2 days ago
So just another variation of the “you’re using it wrong” excuse. Gotcha.
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
You’re safer on win10 even after they stop supporting it than win11.
That’s just not true. An actual spectre/meltdown/etc exploit is much less likely than you run-of-the-mill virus or whatever, so if you’re not getting security updates to your OS and apps, you’ll be much worse off than the fringe case of a theoretical attack.
So that part is just flat out wrong.
Famko@lemmy.world 2 days ago
I use Linux and none of the programs I need for structural engineering work on Linux.
Trust me, I would totally ditch the dual boot if I could, but sadly, I can’t
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
Hopefully that’ll change as more users adopt it. But most users don’t need structural engineering or other specialized software, they just don’t want to change their workflow.
Exceptions exist, and they should become fewer as the userbase of Linux grows.
parpol@programming.dev 2 days ago
What are they called? What do you need for Linux that only works on Windows or Mac right now?
Famko@lemmy.world 2 days ago
Revit, Tekla, AutoCAD, the usual. I have tried out FreeCAD but found it clunky to use comparably.
Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
I’m sorry but “your need to use better applications” is very funny to read when most of the time the Linux open source alternative will never be as good as the product made by the company that has hundreds of paid employees working on it.
parpol@programming.dev 2 days ago
Except most big open source project are developed by companies, and only the tiny ones aren’t. This applies to all open source projects on all platforms.
Also, most of them already are better. People just don’t want to change their layouts and workflows. And people also don’t value privacy, which if they would, they wouldn’t rate the proprietary software as half as good.
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
Exactly. For example:
- LibreOffice - Collabora offers paid support for larger companies and does a ton of development on the core
- WINE - CodeWeavers has their own proprietary version (CrossOver) that they sell as a commercial product; oh, and Valve helps a ton too
- GNOME - RedHat/IBM funds it and most things in its ecosystem for its commercial customers
And so on. Most big FOSS projects are backed by one or more companies with full-time developers supporting it. The difference is that the license makes lock-in a lot less likely, since the community (read: non-paid devs) will likely patch in compatibility (i.e. file support, data export, etc).
sqw@lemmy.sdf.org 2 days ago
otoh a lot of the most useful and enduring software ever made has been made by volunteers in their spare time
net00@lemm.ee 2 days ago
Linux doesn’t have several programs I use to control my peripherals, the mobo RGB profile, and GPU fan control from Sapphire. It also doesn’t have a proper AMD adrenalin as far as I’ve checked, nor firmware updater for SSD/NVME, and the list goes on and on. I also heard controlling high refresh rate displays on linux is a nightmare.
If I want to use the gaming PC I built to its full potential then I need windows…
The article is still dumb though, anyone left behind using old hardware should not go through the pain of forcing win11 to run. They all should switch to linux
parpol@programming.dev 2 days ago
You usually don’t need proprietary software and drivers on Linux because of the great general purpose open source alternatives. Even on Windows, a ton of the drivers are actually useless and only bloat your system or perform invasive telemetry.
Personally I don’t even use the RGB features on my gaming PC, but OpenRGB is open source and lightweight. I would probably use it over proprietary RGB profiles even on Windows. You should give it a try.
GPU fan control is already available by default in most Linux distributions and should require no additional drivers.
AMD always have Linux drivers. The Linux adrenaline driver is here: www.amd.com/en/support/…/linux-drivers.html
SSD/NVME firmware updates should also already be supported by default in linux. With for example fwupdmgr.
High refresh rate displays should also work out the box on the modern distributions. On Linux Mint and Ubuntu they have a GUI for it, but changing resolution and refresh rate with Xrandr also only takes one or two terminal commands. There likely is software to do it, but if anything I could write you a script that does it if your distribution doesn’t already have GUI for it. I had to write a script to adjust some of my monitors’ drawing area because I mirror, but my displays don’t have the same aspect ratio.
net00@lemm.ee 1 day ago
I have already looked up most of what you recommended, and I arrived at the same initial conclusion…
- OpenRGB doesn’t list support for my Gigabyte mobo, or XPG ram (unless I’m reading this wrong). I need this to stop the default behavior which is rainbow puke
- AMD adrenalin only lists 3 distros, and none of which I’d like to use (I’d prefer linux mint LMDE)
- Plus I haven’t even talked about the apps (office for starters, then itunes+icloud which I use to sideload apps)
Daveyborn@lemmy.world 2 days ago
Its part of their personality.
They remind me of my devout jehovah witness neighbor who’s been doorknocking and dropping flyers in my mailbox for 20+ years to remind me I’m going to burn if I don’t convert.
variants@possumpat.io 2 days ago
I think a lot of people have switched to Linux and realized it was just a lot better, myself included. It took me a bit to let the differences soak in, just like when I got my first smart phone but after a bit of using it and trying things out you realize you should have done it a long time ago
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
Sure, and the article exists for those who want to go that route.
Comments are comments, as in discussion about and around the topic. In this case, people are discussing Linux as an alternative, because it is a viable alternative for most people, especially the type for whom this article is too complex. Discussion about Linux as a viable alternative is therefore absolutely welcome and should be encouraged.
I also welcome discussion about macOS as well, especially since they have a really good track record for supporting their hardware with software updates.
If this pisses you off, just know that Microsoft will probably make more changes like this that will piss you off. They’re trying to take more control over your computer little by little, and right now they’re doing it in the name of “security,” but eventually they’ll likely drop that and just make changes for the sake of lock-in. So if this pisses you off, you should consider alternatives if they’ll work for you.
Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
The thing is, it’s impossible to have a discussion about Windows on Lemmy because they automatically get hijacked by people who only have one thing to say “Install Linux you idiot.”, they add nothing to the conversation and are off topic.
sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 1 day ago
Agreed, and it’s really unfortunate. In many areas, Lemmy is much more of a “hive mind” than Reddit was, probably because a lot of people with similar ideas got pissed about the same thing and left around the same time.
grue@lemmy.world 2 days ago
ITT: Stockholm Syndrome victims defending the abusive relationship they have with their OS.
Newsflash, honey: she doesn’t respect you; she only wants to exploit you. It’s time to break up!
TurboHarbinger@feddit.cl 2 days ago
Yes because never ever an user had abused their OS.
Newsflash honey: it’s a fucking tool, it doesn’t have feelings. It’s your own choice to use it or not.
Man fuck these half baked analogies.
grue@lemmy.world 2 days ago
That’s right: it is a fucking tool, which means nothing the user does to it or with it could possibly count as “abuse” by the user. An OS is supposed to exist to do exactly the computer owner’s bidding; no more, no less.
But Microsoft certainly doesn’t see it that way. Instead, Windows exists to do Microsoft’ bidding, computer owner’s rights be damned. It’s Microsoft that’s abusing you, by whoring you out to advertisers and subverting your property against you, when you use Windows.
spikecushion@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
Bro, it’s true you can’t disable certain things, but you can certainly break it. I can still use a previous version and not update. I can still pirate ltsc. I can remove or install any bullshit I want. It takes the same fucking time when configuring your Linux distro of choice, unattended or not.
I don’t give a fuck what Microsoft thinks. I can still break their os to do what I want.
You’re too self absorbed in Linux good windows bad.
Zachariah@lemmy.world 2 days ago
If you need Windows, don’t run it on hardware that doesn’t support Windows 11. If you need it, do it the right way, so you can count on it working.
Now, what do you do with your old hardware? There are plenty of good ideas in the comments here.
Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
Or instead of installing Linux as a workaround and having to learn how to use a new OS and having to troubleshoot a ton of inevitable issues to make it work as well as the setup you’re used to just… Use a workaround to skip the hardware requirement! In the end both are a way to work around Microsoft’s requirements, one is something you need to deal with once just requiring you to follow a guide and you’re done, the other will be an ongoing learning process.
webghost0101@sopuli.xyz 2 days ago
Honestly the only people worried about learning a new OS are people that have not even tried another OS for longer then 15 minuts.
The desktop is still a desktop so is the taskbar.
The mouse works like a mouse, browser works like a browser and the majority of apps these days are browser apps.
The single actual difference is that rather then downloading an exe you use something similar to an appstor if your non technical or the command line if you don’t.
And if you are just a little technical you can acutely download that exe and install/run it just fine. (Wine)
Broken@lemmy.ml 2 days ago
Worrying about learning an new OS isn’t as simple as you make it. It takes time, dedication, and will power to work through the pain points.
Most Linux users give answers like “just use Linux” but it’s not that simple. Yes, it’s easier to switch these days because more and more apps are browser/cloud based. But technically a chrome book would be an easier switch if that’s the mentality.
I “use” my PC. I don’t simply check email and go on Facebook. I’m currently trying Linux for probably the 4th or 5th time. It’s easier to get into these days, but it still functions completely differently than Windows, as it should.
For example, It took me at least an hour to figure out how to partition and mount a drive. There’s some not so clear information out there so finding the right info wasn’t as easy as it should be. OK no big deal, now I know, but I don’t necessarily want to chase answers like that every time I use my computer.
Lastly, I’ve never accepted using Wine as a work around for unsupported programs. OK, maybe if you have 1, but not if you have 6. That’s not an acceptable solution when your needs scale up like that. And I have many. I’m not going to 100% get away from Windows. It sucks, but it’s reality.
dustyData@lemmy.world 2 days ago
How is having to apply workarounds to keep windows working on old machines any different from troubleshooting the occasional linux issue? It’s a rethorical question, the difference is that the workaround on Windows is mandatory while the Linux troubleshoot is nowadays rare and usually related to edge cases.
Some of the workarounds in this article are far more involved and convoluted than what I’ve ever had to do in 15 years of linux. My very recent install of bazzite in a new laptop has been a perfectly out of the box it just works experience. Not even having to open the terminal. 100% friendly GUI without compromising flexibility, power and customizability. Today, suggesting linux with a solid desktop environment like KDE plasma is just foolproof. The end user will be using exactly the same knowledge and habits of Windows, without the harassment machine that is MS now.
Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
Meanwhile I started on Bazzite, my display signal just stopped whenever there was load on the GPU, two days trying different things to make it work, switched to Mint, GPU works but wifi antenna doesn’t, another couple hours to make it work… Windows? Install it and… Well, that’s it, it just works.
Zachariah@lemmy.world 2 days ago
How long with working around the requirements work? If I need Windows, I’m not going to risk it.
Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 2 days ago
Then get newer hardware, simple as that, anything from 2017 or more recent will work.
wreckedcarzz@lemmy.world 2 days ago
“to avoid learning new things, just learn these new things instead and repeat as needed until it doesn’t work anymore! duh!”