Submitted 7 months ago by L4s@lemmy.world [bot] to technology@lemmy.world
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2023/nov/22/tesla-autopilot-defective-lawsuit-musk
Judge finds ‘reasonable evidence’ Tesla knew self-driving tech was defective::Ruling clears way for lawsuit brought against company over fatal crash in 2019 in which Stephen Banner was killed near Miami
Tesla FSD… Coming 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2024
The sun will explode before Tesla succeeds in making full self-driving work with only basic cameras.
Are there at least two front facing cameras for depth perception?
This is the best summary I could come up with:
A judge has found “reasonable evidence” that Elon Musk and other executives at Tesla knew that the company’s self-driving technology was defective but still allowed the cars to be driven in an unsafe manner anyway, according to a recent ruling issued in Florida.
The lawsuit, brought by Banner’s wife, accuses the company of intentional misconduct and gross negligence, which could expose Tesla to punitive damages.
The ruling comes after Tesla won two product liability lawsuits in California earlier this year focused on alleged defects in its Autopilot system.
“It would be reasonable to conclude that the Defendant Tesla through its CEO and engineers was acutely aware of the problem with the ‘Autopilot’ failing to detect cross traffic,” the judge wrote.
Bryant Walker Smith, a University of South Carolina law professor, told Reuters that the judge’s summary of the evidence was significant because it suggests “alarming inconsistencies” between what Tesla knew internally, and what it was saying in its marketing.
“This opinion opens the door for a public trial in which the judge seems inclined to admit a lot of testimony and other evidence that could be pretty awkward for Tesla and its CEO,” Smith said.
The original article contains 462 words, the summary contains 195 words. Saved 58%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
“It would be reasonable to conclude that the Defendant Tesla through its CEO and engineers was acutely aware of the problem with the ‘Autopilot’ failing to detect cross traffic,” the judge wrote.
If that’s what this centers I don’t think this necessarily a correct ruling
That semi was moving fairly slowly as it was crossing the road as any semi would.
Radar does not detect stationary objects at high speeds, which this slow moving cross traffic vehicle could look like. I imagine there’s some limit where a cross traffic item moving very slowly would appear for all intents and purposes stationary as it fills the entire roadway horizontally.
The car explicitly warns you that Radar won’t detect stationary objects at high speeds. Other manufacturers explicitly warn about this very same problem as well.
It’ll be interesting to see what happens with this case, but if that’s what it hinges on, IMO, it doesn’t look good for the plaintiff.
Doesn’t Tesla only use cameras and image processing though? As in no radar at all?
PlasmaDistortion@lemm.ee 7 months ago
It’s asinine that Tesla is trying to do full self driving without actually using some sort of LiDAR. Using video/photos to judge distance is just unreliable and stupid.
xanu@lemmy.world 7 months ago
but it’s MUCH cheaper, so keeping with every other shitty idea he’s ever had, Musk was REALLY banking on Tesla engineers to make a crazy breakthrough so he could reap billions in reward.
It worked at SpaceX because of a perfect concoction of all the best rocket scientists and engineers wanting to work at SpaceX, since it was one of the only space programs not owned by a government and could push the boundaries, the technology being possible and wildly practical to implement, and massive government subsidies.
Tesla is in the car market, which is notoriously competitive and, while they do have massive government subsidies, they don’t have the best engineers and musk’s insistence that they “figure out” how to shove autonomous driving into a medium that simply doesn’t provide enough information drives even the better engineers away.
I really wish my government would stop funding his ego and let his fantasy projects die already.
PlasmaDistortion@lemm.ee 7 months ago
The tech has gotten so cheap now that there is no reason to skimp out on it.
fmstrat@lemmy.nowsci.com 7 months ago
With two offset cameras, depth is reliable, especially using a wide angle and narrow angle lens offset. This is what OpenPilot does with the Comma 3 (FOSS self driving).
Radar is better, but most automotive radar seems to only be great at short ranges (from my experience with my fork of OP in combination with radar built into a vehicle).
lloram239@feddit.de 7 months ago
What if one of them is dirty? What if you are driving with the sun right in front of you? What on a foggy winter day? The big problem here isn’t even what the cameras are or aren’t capable of, but that there is little to no information on all the situations Tesla’s autopilot will fail in. We are only really learning that one deadly accident at a time. The documentation of the autopilots capabilities is extremely lacking, it’s little more than “trust me bro” and “keep your hands on the wheel”.
The fact that it can’t even handle railroad crossing and thinks trains are a series of trucks that blink in and out of existence and randomly change directions does not make me wanna blindly trust it.
MeanEYE@lemmy.world 7 months ago
No it’s not. World is filled with optical illusions that even our powerful brains can’t process and yet you expect two web cams to do. And depth is not the only thing that’s needed when it comes autonomous driving. Distance is an absolute factor. Case in point, two killed (if not more) bikers because they had 2 tail lights instead of one and Tesla thought it’s a car far away instead of motorcycle close by. Ran them over as if they were not there. Us as humans would see this rider and realize it’s a motorcyle… first because of sound second because our brain is better at reasoning. And we’d avoid the situation. This is why cars MUST have more sensors, because processing is lacking so much.
Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 months ago
Sitting in a Tesla and watching it try to understand anything other than highway driving is so unnerving. It gets so much wrong about other cars’ direction of travel that it’s not too shocking one occasionally is plowed into or plows into someone else
topinambour_rex@lemmy.world 7 months ago
All depend how powerful is the computer managing the datas. A human brain does the job by example.
lloram239@feddit.de 7 months ago
Humans don’t have the best track record when it comes to safe driving, might not be the best idea to imitate them when there is better tech around.
ChaoticEntropy@feddit.uk 7 months ago
I thought the whole point was to overcome human shortcomings, not just make a worse version of a human driver.